Erict719 Posted February 28, 2013 Report Share Posted February 28, 2013 after the new tc or wm9 have been release to us, what's the reason to buy gen? 1: with a franken, all gen parts install, the watch is exectly the same, cost is half of gen. Especially when the tc v3 bracelet released, you can even save more money from buying gen braclet or clasp 2: gen holds value or even raise value, but so do Franken watches. at the selling price in this forum, I don't see much lost in money. 3: repairing is cheaper for reps 4: care less for being stolen or broken 5: can buy more different style for a price of 1 gen SO.... What's the reason to buy gen these days? Give some opinion of how you think. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tonyyammine Posted February 28, 2013 Report Share Posted February 28, 2013 Try getting a gen Patek Philippe one day. My future watch. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
irolexu Posted February 28, 2013 Report Share Posted February 28, 2013 Gen is gen. Cosmetically speaking your right no reason to buy a gen. Value wise a gen will hold its value a little better and keep in mind we take rwg for grantid. Our watches only hold value here. You would never convince a friend or a local watch shopper that your replica franken is worth 1000+ he will just laugh and call you a fool for spending that on a fake. If something ever happened to the rep forums we would be in trouble!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
freddy333 Posted February 28, 2013 Report Share Posted February 28, 2013 Rolex benefits - good fit & finish, high degree of build quality, (higher) resale value retained/gained over time, legal (not contraband) Top quality rep benefits - relatively cheap, provides appearance of gen Rolex negatives - expensive, costly to repair (especially, in the case of vintage) Top quality rep negatives - little or no Q/C, unreliable until/unless professionally overhauled, legal issues with ownership in some countries, low resale value, risk of being identified as 'poser' 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fidhle007 Posted February 28, 2013 Report Share Posted February 28, 2013 I know I'm a special case but for me a rep will never, ever equal a gen. Ever. Reps are great, the reps a build are even better. I like them because I get to fiddle around with stuff and get them as close to gen as I possibly can but there will always be something that bugs me. I'm sure I'd have the same problem with a gen but at least then I know it's always been like that and everyone else's is like that too.Just so know know I'm not talking out of my a$$, I have more then a gen sub's worth invested in my two hyper-franken subs and I'm still not happy. I've built a few TCs and they don't even come close. They're still great reps though! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robaer Posted February 28, 2013 Report Share Posted February 28, 2013 I was under the impression that the TCs were really close? Though I've never seen one IRL. Too bad. Anyway, I've spent a lot on my franken MBW 5513 with gen more or less everything and I don't think I'd do it again. Even with all the money, work and parts I have in it I'd never mistake it for a gen in a million years. If you have the skills and tools to do most of you're own work it's ok, but otherwise you're very dependent on the rep community for repair work, mods etc and also resale as mentioned earlier. If you lose your high end rep/franken or it gets stolen you can kiss all your money good bye. No insurance is going to help you. And you're also running the risk of being called a cheap, fake, poser, white trash, POS no matter how much you spent on your rep, or how much you love your hobby. I've never met anyone who likes, respects or even accept rep/fake stuff. So, in my opinion reps can be great and fun, but once you go with expensive versions and mods it can end up costing more than it's worth. It all depends on yourself really. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HauteHippie Posted February 28, 2013 Report Share Posted February 28, 2013 My comments are as follows: Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
phillycheez Posted February 28, 2013 Report Share Posted February 28, 2013 I assume the OP is just talking about the 16610.. And in that case I agree. I would never buy a gen 16610 cause the rep looks so good, especially a franken. But I also would never buy a 16610 in general. Too played put imo. Huge fan of the 1680s though. But after delving in to gen vintage rolex's I've come to realize I'm too picky for even that.. I like a certain patina on my rolex and choices are slim and expensive in the gen world! I've sold a 1675 and two 5513s cause the patina wasn't exactly to my liking. In the rep world we can make it look exactly how we like it! And just to show you how crazy I am... Here's a 1675 and a premo 5513 I sold. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Erict719 Posted February 28, 2013 Author Report Share Posted February 28, 2013 You guys are very right I guess. These watch only hold value here in this forum. No one really would buy a rep for these money. and no insurance cover. but if you have skill to mod your own watch then cost will be less. but honestly... if the TRF people seen these rep. I don't think they will really take a gen. only we will know its a rep.. Who really out there knows if you have gen insert , bezel , dial, crystal .. Etc of course unless they open your case back. will the QC of bk or tc.. it's good enough. all I can see from rep vs gen is the QC . Most of the QC problem I see is: scratched hands or dial markers, uneven lume . But I do seen some which have been mod by bk which does not have any of these problem. I guess if we have been more picky on the parts we use on rep. The QC should be around the same as gen. also. I k ow many people who always want to buy rep , but just worry to get call put , therefore they pay so much for a gen. but if the rep could t be call out on the appearance, I guess they would buy it, as long as they don't let anyone knows. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Erict719 Posted February 28, 2013 Author Report Share Posted February 28, 2013 Rep always get call out when look up close since of those QC problem , but if we even get gen dial on 16610 rep.. we will never get call out honestly. But that's only base on subs or YM. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest zeleni kukuruz Posted February 28, 2013 Report Share Posted February 28, 2013 I assume the OP is just talking about the 16610.. And in that case I agree. I would never buy a gen 16610 cause the rep looks so good, especially a franken. But I also would never buy a 16610 in general. Too played put imo. Huge fan of the 1680s though. But after delving in to gen vintage rolex's I've come to realize I'm too picky for even that.. I like a certain patina on my rolex and choices are slim and expensive in the gen world! I've sold a 1675 and two 5513s cause the patina wasn't exactly to my liking. In the rep world we can make it look exactly how we like it! And just to show you how crazy I am... Here's a 1675 and a premo 5513 I sold. Yep, YOU are crazy!!! Maaaan, if i could just have them on my wrist for 5min i would die a happy man!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Erict719 Posted February 28, 2013 Author Report Share Posted February 28, 2013 My comments are as follows:ImageUploadedByTapatalk1362079448.774406.jpg Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Nice! Gen?? Yep, YOU are crazy!!! Maaaan, if i could just have them on my wrist for 5min i would die a happy man!!! It's so nice! I always wanted one of those. Are they gen? Or rep Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
phillycheez Posted February 28, 2013 Report Share Posted February 28, 2013 Yep, YOU are crazy!!! Maaaan, if i could just have them on my wrist for 5min i would die a happy man!!! Haha. That feeling of 'OMG this gen is so awesome sauce' wears off unfortunately. I love your builds though!! I really want a rolexaddict build. I was about to send him a gen 5513 that had a relumed and touched up dial so I can have him re-lume it but jacek was kind enough to take it back for something else. One day... I'll own a RA build.. one day. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
automatico Posted February 28, 2013 Report Share Posted February 28, 2013 "You guys are very right I guess. These watch only hold value here in this forum. No one really would buy a rep for these money." Frankenstein vintage rolex (1016, 5512/13, 1680 etc) with genuine movements sell pretty good at NAWCC etc watch shows...under the table of course. No parts and high prices killed genuine 'vintage' rolex for me. 'vintage' = 1960s/1970s with 1530 base movements "I would never buy a gen 16610 cause the rep looks so good, especially a franken. Same for me if I was a modern watch guy. I always liked the 16600 SD though. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gavidoc Posted February 28, 2013 Report Share Posted February 28, 2013 As others have said, Gen is gen. Value is all in the quality and the overall brand. If you look at selling, you have a larger pool of people to sell to with gen. Reps? I learned the hard way it's difficult to sell a "super" franken. Buillt a 9411 and the only non-original thing on it was the mid and back case. I couldn't sell it for what I had in the gen parts to people here as it was a "rep." Parted the watch out, sold the gen parts individually and the rep case and actually sold everything for more then I was asking for on the completed watch. Even with super frankens your pool of buyers is limited. I'd never spend $1000 let alone $500 on a rep but that's just me. Having owned and currently own real Rolex and Tudors, it's not worth it IMO. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
freddy333 Posted February 28, 2013 Report Share Posted February 28, 2013 Yep, YOU are crazy!!! Maaaan, if i could just have them on my wrist for 5min i would die a happy man!!! Please do not re-quote an entire set of pics just to add a line or 2 at the end. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JoeyB Posted February 28, 2013 Report Share Posted February 28, 2013 It's all personal choice when you own and wear it yourself. What do you want? is the question. For me, the 21J movement is the smarter buy, but I feel better with a gen Swiss ETA. In terms of money, as already said, the market for a modded or fully franken watch is only on the rep forums. Regardless what non-Rolex movement is used, as soon as the case is opened most people will know. But on the vintage Rolex GMT the DG3804B looks more like a Rolex movement than the ETA does, and would fool anyone at a glance that is not an expert. And for personal use, both will need service in about 5 years, the ETA service anywhere to $250, the DG you just remove, smack it with a hammer, and buy a new one for under $30. But being 'called out' depends on many things, particularly you and what watch you are wearing. My Son wears a noobmariner I bought for him. He gets called out all the time, a college kid with a Rolex. But when he says his Dad got it for him it is accepted. I am older, drive a Mercedes, and never get called out. I've even been in the Rolex AD in Waikiki with my 16710, the owner held it in his hand trying to get me to let him change the insert to all black, or trade it for a 116710. He never questioned it. My vintage watches are even better, always getting the 'oohs and ahhs', and I make the dials myself. People assume a lot. Keep in mind that aftermarket parts sellers like Clark's sell substantially more stuff to gen owners and gen watchmakers than to the rep world. Many gen owners don't want to pay Rolex prices for a crystal when they can get a good quality that they'd never see the difference in much cheaper. Inserts, bracelets, clasps, hands, sell big for the aftermarket to gen owners. We are the only picky ones, likely because we know what we can do. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
danielv2000 Posted February 28, 2013 Report Share Posted February 28, 2013 For me, a super Franken with genuine movement is as good as the real deal. Of course, with a gen on the wrist, never any fear of being called out. Rolex will always be considered fake. When I wear an IWC or PAM, no one knows what i am wearing. So, it's always assumed to be "real" whatever that means. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HauteHippie Posted March 1, 2013 Report Share Posted March 1, 2013 My comments are as follows:ImageUploadedByTapatalk1362079448.774406.jpg Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Nice! Gen?? Thanks, but no. Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
correctime Posted March 1, 2013 Report Share Posted March 1, 2013 For me, a super Franken with genuine movement is as good as the real deal. Of course, with a gen on the wrist, never any fear of being called out. Rolex will always be considered fake. When I wear an IWC or PAM, no one knows what i am wearing. So, it's always assumed to be "real" whatever that means. I have to agree with daniel...Super Franken builds with gen mvts. IMO are as good as having the real thing. If a case accepts "all" gen parts with no modding required then what's the real difference between a Super Franken and a gen ? Gloss, color, finish, smoothness ?? I've seen alot said regarding the differences in the look of 316 SS and 904 SS. In my opinion that can only be noticed if the two are side by side...and even then that can be difficult if your Franken piece has been in the hands of a jeweler that "really" knows the properties and densities of all the various metals and "really" knows how to work it. Question is...when does a rep become a piece that the gen world would accept ?? Or should I ask when does an aftermarket build become good enough to interest the gen world ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fredfree Posted March 1, 2013 Report Share Posted March 1, 2013 I just sold 2 high end reps to go gen, one was a TC and the other was a 1665 modded by RA. Got a 16600 gen and will get a Tudor Bb to replace the vintage (not the same for sure but I love the Tudor). TC was 90% there, but that 10% is what makes a gen special. Did it make a big difference ? No. Was it worth ? yes. I didn't like the idea of wearing a rep also, cause I knew it was a rep, bezel was ok but not 100% there, same for dial and crystal. But it's something very personal. It is also nice to own something that is the result of high craftsmanship, design and care for details. And as a plus a Rolex is always a safe place to put money in. The Tudor will somehow fill the hole left by the 1665, not the same thing but it's an amazing watch with the vintage vibe,enough for me. Also (this is psychological ) it s nice when you dream and desire something special and after some time you can buy it with the results of your work. Reps got me into the watch loop and I learned a lot about watches hanging on the various forums and that's great. Will I get other reps in the future ? May be watches I will not be able to afford and/or I won't be sure about. This is how it started "may be I like a Rolex" and got myself a TC, but when I was sure I wanted that watch to stay with me for long I went gen. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
correctime Posted March 1, 2013 Report Share Posted March 1, 2013 I agree with tha as well. I've had them all along the way as well as the late great WM9's, TC's and a Sean (though I didn't actually do anything with the Sean case as it was at that time RedWatch posted his 16800 build...so I sold the Sean case) If TC's are 90%, what is a piece using "all" gen parts with the exception of the mid case considered ? "EVERYTHING" gen but the mid case...........with the correct date era warranty paper(case engraved to match the paper), boxed set with all accessories, the works......?? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fredfree Posted March 1, 2013 Report Share Posted March 1, 2013 Ok, got a good example here. Let's say you go to a Rolling Stones concert, the music is what you expected it to be, great,you are 100 feet from the stage (as usual at big concerts) and can't see details. Suddenly somebody tells you that it is one of that amazing cover bands that sound and look alike. Is it the same experience ? No because you want to be in the same room with the guys that made rock history, you want to feel that vibe in the air, want to be part of that history, you want to think "hey those I'm seeing are the same guys that made rock revolution" music is important but any good cover band can play easy RS songs, may be even better tech wise,and without being drunk or stoned ...but it will never be the same. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
correctime Posted March 1, 2013 Report Share Posted March 1, 2013 A build with an aftermarket case wouldn't give you the same thrill and gratitude (and the same smooth, precision movement and bezel action) as a genuine piece would ?? It is of course all about what a person really wants but I myself find it "more" rewarding and gratifying for the sake of it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JoeyB Posted March 1, 2013 Report Share Posted March 1, 2013 It is also nice to own something that is the result of high craftsmanship, design and care for details. I agree. That's my pride in my build. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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