Guest Posted August 22, 2013 Report Share Posted August 22, 2013 PM'ing is a full time job in itself. Maybe MD2020 should hire an assistant to keep communication flowing and make people happy? Maybe a suggestion would be to do what Speedy does and have a google spreadsheet of the work he has. That way people can see up-to-date info on their projects as well as get an idea how much work Mike really has on his hands. From what I know, there are several members that have met him face to face and at least one that knows where he lives. Don't think he's trying to pull a fast one. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
panerai153 Posted August 22, 2013 Report Share Posted August 22, 2013 PM'ing is a full time job in itself. Maybe MD2020 should hire an assistant to keep communication flowing and make people happy? Maybe a suggestion would be to do what Speedy does and have a google spreadsheet of the work he has. That way people can see up-to-date info on their projects as well as get an idea how much work Mike really has on his hands. From what I know, there are several members that have met him face to face and at least one that knows where he lives. Don't think he's trying to pull a fast one. That's all well and good going forward, the problem now is to clean up the backlog of unanswered emails and PM's. that can only be done by sitting down at the computer and grinding them out . I disagree as to PM'ing is a full time job. It's not necessary to write a dissertation in every response. Simply, your watch is 3rd in line for the work performed, expect to start tomorrow, will have it finished in 3 days ready to mail. Can even develop a "ticket" template with check boxes, etc. Not terribly time consuming If you are diligent in not letting PM's, emails pile up, then it becomes daunting! AFA using and assistant, that's a good idea, but expensive unless you have a "live in" assistant i.e. wife/girlfriend. Ziggy never corresponded with anyone, all of his correspondence was through Jennifer, who did a great job of answering emails. I'm sure Ziggy could tell her what was going on with a customers watch and she typed out the email and he never had to leave his bench. She also handled all the billing as well as scheduling watches in for repair or modding. But the key to that is having someone who is knowledgeable and is around all the time. Just hiring and assistant and then having to dictate or write out everything that you want to tell a customer is probably counterproductive, you can do that yourself in the same or less time, and it's expensive to hire someone. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ceocorona Posted August 22, 2013 Report Share Posted August 22, 2013 Again, life deals some serious lemons sometimes. Thats fact. So in that I sympathize with MD and I wish him the best through the tough times. With that said... I do not know of many, if any, jobs that you could "abandon" for months while handling personal issues. At the end of the day there are work responsibilities. I do not think my boss would take it well if I said I needed 2-3 months off to take care of a cold/death/birth/etc. The excuses that he's spending the time communicating are worthless, lets just be honest. Windows 7 or 8? Really? Please MD, you're a smart guy. That time could be better spent coming up with a plan of action and reaching to the members he has work pending with. Just man up, own up, and move on. There are several people who have more than just a few hundred in watches/parts with MD. This isn't about putting family 1st, 2nd, or 3rd. This is just about running a responsible business. Again, MD I wish you the best. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted August 22, 2013 Report Share Posted August 22, 2013 That was actually sarcasm about hiring an assistant. There are some members that respond to each pm with a different question each time. It can be annoying and time consuming as well. Sometimes they don't know when to stop. I know because I have done this too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kbh Posted August 22, 2013 Report Share Posted August 22, 2013 This is none of my concern really, but if PM'ing customers is such a full time job, posting one topic on this forum would take 2 minutes and alleviate 90% of the anxiety that going silent has caused. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fitmic Posted August 22, 2013 Report Share Posted August 22, 2013 Its not burning just yet, I have every confidence Mike will pull this back and make everything good again. Lets get back to giving him our support instead of kicking a man when he's down. Second that! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
carliv Posted August 22, 2013 Report Share Posted August 22, 2013 You guys are right about communication. He told me he'd look at my watch about a month ago with a turn around of possibly a few days. If he would've responded to a pm(which still hasn't happened) and let me know he was having trouble and its going to be longer I'd have absolutely no issue with that, I'm in the business of repairs and I understand that can happen, but the blatant ignoring of contact is infuriating when you know he's reading them. His excuses, besides the family probs if true, only add to the frustration. I don't care if the watches are a hundred dollars, in my case 400 when you have 20 or more that aren't getting returned or updates, that's a nice chunk of change. Windows 8 is the issue now? Come on. It's insulting. I answer up to 100 emails an hour on somedays. I'm pretty sure he can find sometime to reply to his customers for a ten word update. I'm new to this forum and mike and its obvious hes done some great work and made plenty of friends and I'm sure he's probably a good guy but I'm a customer just looking for an update and at this point, just a returned watch. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SSTEEL Posted August 22, 2013 Report Share Posted August 22, 2013 I have never met Mike in person, but I feel I am a friend of his. He has helped me no end in recent month in getting me set up as a watchmaker, providing me with valuable information on what tools, oils, equipment etc etc I need. Its been an absolute joy dealing with Mike via pm's, he has always had time to help me. His forum persona is also unparalleled and has always shared his experience, opinion, and great advice. Here's to you Mike, wishing you a smooth transition through the given task with family, I know you will come through it wiser, and stronger, and finally get back to what I share passion with you, watchmaking Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CptTripps Posted August 22, 2013 Report Share Posted August 22, 2013 This is none of my concern really, but if PM'ing customers is such a full time job, posting one topic on this forum would take 2 minutes and alleviate 90% of the anxiety that going silent has caused.Like this one...last week?http://www.rwgforum.net/topic/161987-im-back/#entry1260563 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cc33 Posted August 22, 2013 Report Share Posted August 22, 2013 That was on the 13th, people were complaining about not hearing anything as of yesterday the 21st.. He said he would pm everyone within a couple of days, 8 days is more than a couple Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Ezel Posted August 22, 2013 Report Share Posted August 22, 2013 Im new, and almost all of you seem to know md and that he will do the right stuff!!! But, You need to check yourself before you wreck yourelf couse thats not good for your health! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
relaxman Posted August 22, 2013 Report Share Posted August 22, 2013 Im new, and almost all of you seem to know md and that he will do the right stuff!!! But, You need to check yourself before you wreck yourelf couse thats not good for your health! Profound 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Ezel Posted August 22, 2013 Report Share Posted August 22, 2013 Profound Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kbh Posted August 22, 2013 Report Share Posted August 22, 2013 Like this one...last week?http://www.rwgforum.net/topic/161987-im-back/#entry1260563 Exactly. My point is you do it before people start getting upset, not after. Then you might even think about a follow up post at least once a week so people know you're seriously engaged in working with them. All I'm suggesting is showing a little common courtesy to your friends and customers. Nothing particularly difficult here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PeteM Posted August 22, 2013 Report Share Posted August 22, 2013 I can fully understand how these sort of situations can arise... and I understand how difficult it can be for anyone in this situation... But reading the first reply ...I personally feel is wrong.. To say this is only reps and my family come first is totally applaudable.... and I feel the same way.. but you are talking about yourself...you are now dealing with others.. and in that respect by taking this work and other members watches you are no longer just doing a hobby for yourself... Guys who have spent their money and sent thier property to you have put thier trust in you... you cant just walk away from that and expect them to understand that ...no matter the reason.... A simple thread or contacting a mod/crew member would give comfort to those who are in your hands and its a single conduit of communication..that can be easily updated withoiut spending to much of your time on it By taking watches and taking money this is no longer simply a hobby for you but it is for those giving you thier trust and thier money... all they ask in return is a simple flow of information in return... I am not out to beat M with this and I dont doubt his honesty but I do think that by saying that ...he really doesnt understand or has given any thought to how these guys feel or I certainly know how I would feel if I sent soemone a few hundred/thousand worth of stuff... and heard nothing.. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fraggle42 Posted August 22, 2013 Report Share Posted August 22, 2013 To those that say "He should have taken an hour and answered everyones emails and messages", you have absolutely NO idea how long it can take to do that. Even if he's got only 100 customers, emailing them all with an individual update about their own watches, money and estimated completion date will take easy 15 minutes PER PERSON. 1500 minutes, 25 hours non stop. For just 100 customers. He hasn't got his own section which would have made it so much easier to post a status update once every couple of days with a very brief status that everyone knew where it was, and could check it. And I don't care what anyone thinks, family does always come first, ahead of anything that's non family. That's not to say MD shouldn't have posted an update every few days, he did. Don't blame Mike that he hasn't got his own section where people can find his updates, and that an easilt findable sticky thread wasn't created that he could post updates too. As to how long this may go on for, my sister had to become the executor of my mums finances and take them over when mum was going down hill, and that took months to get sorted out in the first place, and it took months to finalise it all when mum passed on. It's NOT a quick process, so honestly do not expect Mike to be back to working 100% speed, I really cannot see that happening. If you must have instant communications from your watch repairer, buy a gen, sod off to the AD and pay 5 times the price for the work. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
panerai153 Posted August 22, 2013 Report Share Posted August 22, 2013 I agree with you about family, I totally disagree with you about how long it takes you to PM folks. Updates don't have to be verbose, a simple "your watch is on the bench should finish in 1,2,3,5 days" whatever. Or "movement is apart, cleaned, waiting on a part, should be here Monday, watch should be in the mail by Wednesday". Simple one to two sentence updates are sufficient to satisfy most folks. What is causing the trouble is no updates. A couple of other posters have also hit another nail on the head as well. When you take the first watch, car, vacuum cleaner, whatever you are repairing, for money, your enterprise ceases to be a hobby. now you have a fiduciary responsibility to the customer who is paying for the work. I believe that also includes timely updates should the customer request them. In that vein, The customer has a responsibility as well, I don't think that sending someone a PM every day or two or calling them every day is acceptable either. I believe that if this is worked out with and amicable solution for most folks, which I really hope happens, Mike can take some valuable lessons away from this experience which will make him a better, more organized watchmaker and businessman. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
carliv Posted August 22, 2013 Report Share Posted August 22, 2013 I agree with you about family, I totally disagree with you about how long it takes you to PM folks. Updates don't have to be verbose, a simple "your watch is on the bench should finish in 1,2,3,5 days" whatever. Or "movement is apart, cleaned, waiting on a part, should be here Monday, watch should be in the mail by Wednesday". Simple one to two sentence updates are sufficient to satisfy most folks. What is causing the trouble is no updates. A couple of other posters have also hit another nail on the head as well. When you take the first watch, car, vacuum cleaner, whatever you are repairing, for money, your enterprise ceases to be a hobby. now you have a fiduciary responsibility to the customer who is paying for the work. I believe that also includes timely updates should the customer request them. In that vein, The customer has a responsibility as well, I don't think that sending someone a PM every day or two or calling them every day is acceptable either. I believe that if this is worked out with and amicable solution for most folks, which I really hope happens, Mike can take some valuable lessons away from this experience which will make him a better, more organized watchmaker and businessman. You nailed it! I've sent 4 pm's in the last month all politely asking for a brief update. No answer. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PeteM Posted August 22, 2013 Report Share Posted August 22, 2013 To those that say "He should have taken an hour and answered everyones emails and messages", you have absolutely NO idea how long it can take to do that. Even if he's got only 100 customers, emailing them all with an individual update about their own watches, money and estimated completion date will take easy 15 minutes PER PERSON. 1500 minutes, 25 hours non stop. For just 100 customers. He hasn't got his own section which would have made it so much easier to post a status update once every couple of days with a very brief status that everyone knew where it was, and could check it. And I don't care what anyone thinks, family does always come first, ahead of anything that's non family. That's not to say MD shouldn't have posted an update every few days, he did. Don't blame Mike that he hasn't got his own section where people can find his updates, and that an easilt findable sticky thread wasn't created that he could post updates too. As to how long this may go on for, my sister had to become the executor of my mums finances and take them over when mum was going down hill, and that took months to get sorted out in the first place, and it took months to finalise it all when mum passed on. It's NOT a quick process, so honestly do not expect Mike to be back to working 100% speed, I really cannot see that happening. If you must have instant communications from your watch repairer, buy a gen, sod off to the AD and pay 5 times the price for the work. No one has asked for instant communications mate... maybe you need to reread this thread... and for the rest of your comments...well it speaks volumes... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
triplehd Posted August 22, 2013 Report Share Posted August 22, 2013 Guys,we can continue to discuss what Mike should have done until we are blue in the face. I believe we all agree that a simple communication would put many members at ease. Going forward, now that Mike has seen concerns by many on the board, hopefully lessons learned, Mike can improve his communication with members some way some how. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mil04 Posted August 22, 2013 Report Share Posted August 22, 2013 Guys,we can continue to discuss what Mike should have done until we are blue in the face. I believe we all agree that a simple communication would put many members at ease. Going forward, now that Mike has seen concerns by many on the board, hopefully lessons learned, Mike can improve his communication with members some way some how. +1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tonyyammine Posted August 22, 2013 Report Share Posted August 22, 2013 I read all this crap and i get mad. I didnt want to jump in stuff but what the hell. I sent md a watch in march. I told him mike take as long as you want but if i send you any parts please lmk when you get them. I was communicating with him at least 2-3 times a day. So please whoever goes and says he doesnt have time to answer his pms needs to just keep quiet. He would tell me what to buy and he would tell me the progress of my project. All of a sudden he goes from speaking to me 2 to 3 times a day to not one pm since july 2nd. I see him on the shout box and ask him why he hasnt pmed me. Instead of pming me or speaking to me in a professional matter he gets testy with me like im the bad guy with the nerve to question him. To the point where i had a actual pm argument with a member here. MD tells me i never pmed him meanwhile not only do i have all my pms saved i also emailed him. So this guy supposely never got my pms or emails, so in other words im a lair. Its not about the watch. Like i said i told him take all the time he wants. Its about the parts i bought and sent him. Its about having professional courtesy and easing the customers mind when they send you something and expect an answer to a question. I spent a lot of money here. In this forum for the first time in my life i sent a complete stranger 1000 through pp gift and he sent me a watch. So i am very trusting of the members here.I have 500 dollars invested in this. If anyone goes and says oh your nuts 500 is nothing i got this with him or that,you know what ill send you a pm with my pp address and you can send me 500 buxx. I know hes going through some bad breaks but if and im going to direct this to you mike, if you dont have respect for me in contacting me then you know what i really couldnt care less what your going through. I have a business and you know what my dad died and i still took the time out to get in touch with all mine and his customers as quickly as possible. Its not professional when someone is concerned about their product and they have someone that you know what im sorry to say really couldnt care less about answering you. Your answer to me on the shout box the one time that u contacted me since july 2nd was " hey tony if you dont like wats going on then ill just send you your watch back" well you know what im not going to accecpt that. I want my project done and i want you to provide answers to me and to everyone on here that spent their money with you. Im waiting for a responsible response. Jsut because someone has a talent doesnt mean you could go and lead people on thats not cool. And you were looking to have your own section here. Thats a laugh. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Ezel Posted August 22, 2013 Report Share Posted August 22, 2013 Ooohhhh, this will get messy! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jbg44 Posted August 22, 2013 Report Share Posted August 22, 2013 Sorry Mike, but count me in for the pile-on! Over the last month, on two occasions I was told that my watch was shipping-off to come back to me, and still I have no watch. I am getting close to chalking it up as a total loss. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fraggle42 Posted August 22, 2013 Report Share Posted August 22, 2013 I agree with you about family, I totally disagree with you about how long it takes you to PM folks. Updates don't have to be verbose, a simple "your watch is on the bench should finish in 1,2,3,5 days" whatever. Or "movement is apart, cleaned, waiting on a part, should be here Monday, watch should be in the mail by Wednesday". Simple one to two sentence updates are sufficient to satisfy most folks. And doing exactly that will take the time. You're in your workshop. You have say 100 watches (or cases, movements, whatever) in the line for whatever work they require. To be able to spend a few seconds per reply as you indicate means that Mike has to remember EXACTLY who sent each watch, exactly what they wanted doing, how much has been paid, how much there is to pay, the exact status of the work to date, what parts have been ordered, what parts have arrived, what parts are still to be ordered, what timeframe he gave the person, when it arrived, which order it is within the 100 watches. Just from looking at the watch. Even if it's got a tag on it with a name, doesn't help with all the other essential information. And that's just if he starts one watch, completely finishes it, and then starts the next one, which no one does. Anyone has a dozen or two items on the go at once, as you wait for parts to arrive, or calibration to be tested over a day or two, or the final thing to be tested over a week or so. I couldn't remember that lot for ONE person, never mind 100. Could you? So, it's either kept electronically or on paper, with lots of logging when the watch comes in, parts come in, when any work is done, etc, etc, etc. So to make any meaningful message to each customer he has to dig all that information out, for each watch, assess it and work out where in the repair process it is, if it's waiting on parts, re-estimate the time remaining (just for doing that one watch assuming working 100% on it), and then take into account the other 99 jobs to arrive at an estimated time of being returned to the customer. I've worked in a place where I had maybe (just) a dozen jobs on the go. With only a dozen I could keep timescales in memory and organise it, but if I had to take a unexpected break, it all gets knocked out of your memory double quick. It's a nightmare when someone turns up out of the blue and just asks you, there's no way you can just pull a figure out of the air. It's meaningless. I'm not getting at you, I'm just saying it may seem a simple task, and if he only had one watch to repair it would be. Scale it up by 100, all needing different things doing, and all at different stages, and it's not simple. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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