Pastorius Posted February 8, 2010 Report Share Posted February 8, 2010 George, I don't understand how it is possible that the old version of the MBW RO is much better than the last version I can understand the difficulty of copying the dial, so particular. But I think it is absurd that no producer is able to make better screws!!! You agree with me that the screws are the biggest and most obvious flaw of this watch. Why is it so difficult to mount better screws? Why does "no modded" Mbw RO have yellow-gold looking screws??? I wish I had answers to all my questions Paul, if you can communicate with the producer you should expect more like the genuine screws Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Katerchen Posted February 9, 2010 Report Share Posted February 9, 2010 George, I don't understand how it is possible that the old version of the MBW RO is much better than the last version NO pastorius it is not! Maybe someone should make a review on different Royal Oak models - the appearance of different Royal Oaks (smaller AND the jumbo models) was and is always slightly different when it comes to the LOOK OF THE SCREWS. It took long for me to understand, because even from the head office of AP in Germany/Wiesbaden i always had the information that the indexes/markers and screws where to be fabricated of (silver-looking)WG on the steel models - this is what ive been told and with email officially. Having seen a few vintage ROs in person and from pictures, this was something i doubted. In the area where i live we have the heraues holding - a company involved with gold and noble metals - many goldsmiths receive their basic material from there. However since a few years there is a kind of "international norm" to what someone can declare as WG with different Grades (see MJSA in US). That means that the mixture of WG from manufacturers may differ. A fellow watchsmith with expierence servicing AP ROs told me on the issue of the WG screws, that AP often used a mixture of WG with LESS PALLADIUM on their old/vintage RO models, because there was no proper standard of exactly what is the mixture of WG or not. The gens with the most silver looking screws where the ROOs and the RO 15300ST. I thought that tis is just a matter of fading away of the rhodium plating of WG but it is not only this. A fading coat of rhodium, which is applied to protect the WG from oxidation would cause a blurry appearance when fading away due to sweat or polishing the surface. However this is not the case on any vintage and modern 15202ST jumbos ive seen. It seems that AP simply altered their mixture on the WG screws a few times, thats why some gens seem to have a more yellow toned WG used for the screws and some (mainly the modern) appear to be more silver! I cant confirm all information because i am no expert, but a few months ago a goldsmith approved my question on rhodium plating, that there is NO way you can apply a coat of rhodium onto WG that thick, that it wouldnt fade away due to daily exposure to sweat and heat of the skin when worn! This means we must have at least a bulk of used ROs where the screws on the backside (also fabricated of WG) have to be blurry because of worn out rhodium plating and on the face/bezel a different picture. However this is not the case, my simple guess is that AP did not always use rhodium plating on their (older) jumbos - the mixture of WG was simply different (less palladium so more yellow) and my watchsmith is right. ----> To come back to your question/issue on whether the old or new batch of mbk AP jumbo is more accurate: The color of the screws on the AP 15202ST model is mainly a matter of "taste" ive seen some at my AD that seem to have more silver WG screws and some vintage with darker/yellow WG screws. Thats all. George Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pastorius Posted February 9, 2010 Report Share Posted February 9, 2010 Thank you very much, George, for your technical response on the screws. You have explained very well the question. A final question: is it so hard to build screws with the slots finer and smaller? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Katerchen Posted February 9, 2010 Report Share Posted February 9, 2010 A final question: is it so hard to build screws with the slots finer and smaller? "Hard" is the wrong term - Do a search on companies specialized in light&precision engineering (CNC) and youll find plenty on the net - maybe also where u live?! I did a search once for myself and talked to some people. Its just a matter of $$$, most of them want some kind of mechanical drawing/blueprint of what you like to be machined - some of them also offer to replicate from a sample/prototype you can send! i asked because i once wanted to get 8 bolts for RO machined of WG but never pulled the trigger on that one. Be aware that it IS NOT cheap... Regards George Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pastorius Posted February 9, 2010 Report Share Posted February 9, 2010 "Hard" is the wrong term - Regards George George, I have already apologized for my poor English Anyway thanks again for your comprehensive response. You were very kind. Best regards Stefano Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
deltatahoe Posted February 10, 2010 Report Share Posted February 10, 2010 i received my ap royal oak jumbo today from paul, and i have to say, in the flesh the screws look great. sure, if you stick your nose on the crystal you can see a tiny bit of space between the edge of the screw and the case, but that is getting pretty nitpicky if you ask me. many thanks to paul for improving upon the great fit and finish of the mbw ap ro with the clean look of the stainless steel screws (not to mention the more accurate caseback) -- i know i'm a happy customer to anyone standing on the fence wondering if they should pull the trigger on one of the few that are still available, go for it i'll try to take some pictures this weekend and post a quick review deltatahoe Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MyNameIsPeterAndImOld Posted February 10, 2010 Report Share Posted February 10, 2010 Are the watches for those who live in the EU shipped yet? Can't wait to get hands on mine Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TANFOGLIO Posted February 10, 2010 Report Share Posted February 10, 2010 Are the watches for those who live in the EU shipped yet? Can't wait to get hands on mine me 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aanival Posted February 10, 2010 Report Share Posted February 10, 2010 me 2 +3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cosmosblau Posted February 10, 2010 Report Share Posted February 10, 2010 mine is stuck in customs in Los Angeles for 5 days now. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Panoris Posted February 11, 2010 Report Share Posted February 11, 2010 mine is stuck in customs in Los Angeles for 5 days now. Unsure if Paul has sent mine o Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EMM Posted February 11, 2010 Report Share Posted February 11, 2010 Hey, what's still left out of this batch, and how much do they cost now? Also, is the white a "creamy" color as it looks in the first pic on Paul's first post (the one with all 3 together), or is it closer in color to the pic where the white one is by itself? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LeSentier Posted February 11, 2010 Report Share Posted February 11, 2010 Hey, what's still left out of this batch, and how much do they cost now? Also, is the white a "creamy" color as it looks in the first pic on Paul's first post (the one with all 3 together), or is it closer in color to the pic where the white one is by itself? Paul explained it some Posts before Cost is originally the same as the other who reserved watch since Sep. However, you have to contribute to RWG $40. So total is $330 + $35 + 40 = $405. After this production, he will raise price by himself. the colour should be more white J Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rolexfinder Posted February 13, 2010 Author Report Share Posted February 13, 2010 Hello, Updated information. Packages to all USA and Asian member just finished to ship out yesterday. All EMS tracking is available. Sorry to send it out late. But there is a custom incident for US fellows. It seems like there is a case that 3 watches went to the same state that make them so suspicious toward USA custom. By now, I manage to let one package pass the custom but the other 2 left. And this is too be a reason that I cant let all packages out in the same time. Hope you are understand. For EU member, I will ship them out to you via my base, the delivery might slower than you expect but, believe me, I try best for you guy to get all watches without custom issue. Will start to ship after next week. Cheers, Paul Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
watchgal Posted February 13, 2010 Report Share Posted February 13, 2010 Paul explained it some Posts before the colour should be more white J I asked for a white one but the dial is actually silver. Not sure if Paul had true white ones. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
specialvat Posted February 13, 2010 Report Share Posted February 13, 2010 The dial is very silvery in a certain light, it is the dial from the pictures tho. It looks white from odd angles and with different light, not sure if AP ever used this dial colour. Still nice dont get me wrong. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
watchgal Posted February 13, 2010 Report Share Posted February 13, 2010 The dial is very silvery in a certain light, it is the dial from the pictures tho. It looks white from odd angles and with different light, not sure if AP ever used this dial colour. Still nice dont get me wrong. Yes the watch itself is lovely. I'm really hoping I can get a strap on it. A nice black or blue gator will really pop on this watch.. oh and I'll be able to actually buckle it up! The bracelet is HUGE on this watch Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
billodavio Posted February 14, 2010 Report Share Posted February 14, 2010 Dear Friends, I have received my AP yesterday and was put under the microscope emmidiately. I wouldn't want to sound negative and all of my observations are mentioned out of friendship. The watch is in a silver dial although I specifically ordered it in WHITE (milk white)but again mistakes happen unless this is the best white we can get. The screws are deffected but again it is a replica and no one can replicate the axact screws unliss we are ready to pay $ 1000 per watch. The Stainless Steel is of an acceptable grade but with rough edges and the clasp wouldn't open and close smoothly. The dial marking, font and logo are wrong and above all the hand are abnormally small, freakishly wrong. Beside that after wearing the watch for 2 hours it stopped and I took it to a watchsmith (a friend) who oppened it to find out that it did not have a rotor ???? yes indeed it was missing a rotor. I had one placed and now it is runing OK (still to be observed) although the noise of the rotor is freakishly loud. In all cases, I salute Paul for the xtra efforts and the great service but unfortunately, I have to say it was a great dissapointement. In fact I was waiting for the watch because I was planplanning to order 500 watches ( and another 30 my plan is to order AP for women and have them decorated with diamond. Unfortunately this cannot be done at that stage because the sample I have received does not give my clients the satisfaction they want. By the way my watch is for sale, it has not been worn and will not be worn by me / Regards Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rolexfinder Posted February 14, 2010 Author Report Share Posted February 14, 2010 @ billodavio, First of all, I have to apologize for a missing Rotor. As I did not have a proper tool to open the caseback without making any marks on the screws, What I can is shaking watches and see how long it will be last for every watches. For yours, as per my record, it is 2 hours running without stop and keep very good time. After that I check its case whether it is in the proper condition and then I send it out to you. For Dial, as per I modified from MBW/MBK, I did not have a chance to modify the dial yet but I did on the screw and case back only. Hence please understand that the watch is originally from MBW/MBK. It is what it came from him. However, if you want to get closer dial + hands, please wait until I get the gen parts to replica and you wont disappoint for you. This issue is also the same on screws as well. If I am able to get the gen and replicate it into my production, not from MBW, I am able to make it better than this. Please let me know if you want an extra rotor as I am able to ask this extra from MBW and tell what he did for his work. And again, I have to apologize for this matter. Cheers, Paul Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Katerchen Posted February 14, 2010 Report Share Posted February 14, 2010 @ billodavio sorry to hear that a rotor was missing in one watch... thats not acceptable. I mean that Rolexfinder/Paul should inform the producer about this thing. If Paul is going to start a second group buy the people should receive "entire" watches in future too! Without mentioning any timelines - i might be able to order a dial for 15202ST with handsset. Paul, get in touch with me for this issue maybe you might be able to send me some pics from dials made from your producer? Hope for the rest they will receive their watches thru customs and "entirely". Best Regards George Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rolexfinder Posted February 14, 2010 Author Report Share Posted February 14, 2010 George, Thanks for your post, mate. With billodavio's issue, I must talk to him tomorrow definitely. This case is unacceptable for us. We have to correct this quick. By now, I am contacting with the factory without the middleman anymore. Let see my 2nd work on the buckles, he can replicate the buckles with better quality than the original as followed link: For the dial and handsets. Let me create my Pam dial first, then we can discuss for our AP dial replication project. Cheers, Paul Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Katerchen Posted February 15, 2010 Report Share Posted February 15, 2010 Hi Paul... The quality of the PAM-Buckle especially the engravings gives me hope for good things to come How long will be the time period for your PAM dial 1:1 replication? And yes i think its good you get in touch 1on1 with the producer eliminating the "middle-men" on the QC issue with AP rotor! Best Regards George Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MyNameIsPeterAndImOld Posted February 15, 2010 Report Share Posted February 15, 2010 If there will be a even better Royal Oak Jumbo, with updated dial and hands, etc. you can be sure that I'd take one again I got a first batch MBW/MBK Royal Oak with swiss movement and closed caseback, but I always thought that the screws needed an update, so now I can't wait to see the result of this project. Since the Royal Oak is my favourite dress watch I would be glad to get a even better one (perhaps even a gold one?). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
exper Posted February 17, 2010 Report Share Posted February 17, 2010 Well mine arrived in the post yesterday and I am pleased with what I have received. The silver screws was the main issue for me and they are just as shown from the beginning, the closed case back was a added bonus really. Mine is the black dial so can't really comment on the white dial issue mentioned above. The dial / handset are fine for me but if someone is going to work on that project, sign me up without a doubt. Thanks again Paul! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cosmosblau Posted February 17, 2010 Report Share Posted February 17, 2010 The white dial I ordered is definitely SILVER. Does AP even make a Silver dial Jumbo? Also, mine is running 2 minutes fast a day. How hard is it to regulate this? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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