btocamelo Posted February 18, 2011 Report Share Posted February 18, 2011 Ok.....so if you were to drop in a GEN 1570 movement.....which 1680 case set would be the most recommended? Any expert advice or insight on fit and finish would be great. PHONG???...most likely expensive...BUT...he claims to use true 316 Stainless.....which others (Yuki) does not.....now, I know those old style cases, Role GEN did not even use 316...but it is a better stainless YUKI watch???......he will seem to be the least expensive.....BUT....is his case better finished than others??? NDTrading.....I don't know much about their case sets....but I do see they are more expensive than Yuki....and slightly less so than Phong. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ronin Posted February 18, 2011 Report Share Posted February 18, 2011 Vlydog and Zigmeister can confirm the "new/current generation" Yuki case is problematic. I used an "old" Yuki for my 1680 build and it was perfect. So if you go Yuki, you need vintage Yuki for lack of a better explanation. His new case has the glued tube also. edit to add: You can always inquire with Yuki and get some sort of "return" option, and do a dry run/build. His stock changes. Getting around the language barrier might be tough in trying to communicate you want the SAME case he sold 3 years ago. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
freddy333 Posted February 18, 2011 Report Share Posted February 18, 2011 I have no direct experience with aftermarket 1680 cases, but I sort of agree with Ronin. I have found that Yuki's English communication skills are quite satisfactory, so I would just check to be sure you can return his case if it does not fit (my experience with other Yuki parts is that they will accept the part back without any problem as long as you demonstrate why it was defective or incorrect). In any case, unless you are 100% certain that crowns, tubes & crystals are gens, I would factor in the cost of gen replacements no matter which aftermarket seller you buy a case from (why would you expect to receive a gen crown/tube from a seller of aftermarket cases, crowns & tubes). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chiman12 Posted February 18, 2011 Report Share Posted February 18, 2011 ...Role GEN did not even use 316...but it is a better stainless I'm quite positive that Rolex used 316 until the late 80's then they switched to 904 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vlydog Posted February 18, 2011 Report Share Posted February 18, 2011 Vlydog and Zigmeister can confirm the "new/current generation" Yuki case is problematic. I used an "old" Yuki for my 1680 build and it was perfect. So if you go Yuki, you need vintage Yuki for lack of a better explanation. His new case has the glued tube also. edit to add: You can always inquire with Yuki and get some sort of "return" option, and do a dry run/build. His stock changes. Getting around the language barrier might be tough in trying to communicate you want the SAME case he sold 3 years ago. Yes, can confirm that the current Yuki was problematic. He did however take the case back and issued me a full refund. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
btocamelo Posted February 18, 2011 Author Report Share Posted February 18, 2011 (edited) correct Chiman....I was thinking of 1960 Rolex....here's some info. I have read Rolex watches from 70's used 316L stainless... old Rolex from 60's or before used 304L stainless 316L (similar to 304L) but has 2-3% more molybdenum added, which provides more corrosion resistance than 304L then in mid 1980 switch to 904L, which contains more nickel and is 3x more expensive 904L would be better for people that have more acidic sweat, or maybe expose the Rolex to seawater where can cause more corrosion between bezel or caseback Yuki states that he uses "normal stainless"...but he would not confirm 304L or 316L I can tell you for certain...Phong bashed the hell out of Yuki cases...saying that his recent steel is inferior and the machining is poor quality compared to his. I have heard of great finish experiences with Phong 1655 cases..but you are talking about $1000 for the complete case set if you are able to get the guy down that low.....for a 1655 build this is worth it, but I'm not sure for a 1680 build....betweem GEN 1570 movement and Phong caseset....looking at $2K to $3K depending on other parts like dial and bracelet. I have not seen anyone here build using an NDTrading case set? I'm quite positive that Rolex used 316 until the late 80's then they switched to 904 Edited February 18, 2011 by btocamelo Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Star69 Posted February 18, 2011 Report Share Posted February 18, 2011 im sorry spending $1000 on some questionable case ? i have an DW case for <$100 here - it looks even better than the NDT one okay - the Phong case on my Snowflake is nice - but never Never ever i would pay $1000 for it this doesn't really help - doesn't it ? to answer your question : NDT look horrible YUKI has quality problems Phong is ridicules expensive DW no 1:1 construction old MBW is after a lot of work nice Josh new vintage case too cheers, Frank Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
freddy333 Posted February 18, 2011 Report Share Posted February 18, 2011 Why are people so concerned about the steel composition of their case? No one & I mean no one can tell the difference, visually, between the steel used to make a good rep 5513, 1680 or 1665 & the 316L Rolex used. In fact, with the possible exception of the brushed texture (which often looks better on reps), I cannot distinguish between my oldest, cheapest POS Sub rep case & my gens. Unless you plan to use your watch in an acid bath (in which case, 904L is definitely the way to go), I fail to see what all the hullabaloo over steel composition of rep/aftermarket cases is all about? If you are talking about a modern Rolex, which uses the slightly whiter 904L steel, then you might have a point. But, even then, very few people could ID a rep case without having the gen on hand for a direct comparison. I certainly would never put any money on my ability to identify the steel composition of a vintage Rolex watch on the street. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
btocamelo Posted February 18, 2011 Author Report Share Posted February 18, 2011 my comment about the steel stems from Phong marketing his case steel as better, using 316 and also better machined...whereas Yuki uses poorer stainless and less QC...hell, even the Cartels use 316 on their REP Rolex... but you're right....it's nitpicking about the steel, especially a vintage type case...which should really look like it's 40 years old..... the real issue is the best 1:1 fitting and finished case....which I know Phong has the closest, and Yuki's is somewhat lacking, but cheaper...at least from comments here. unfortunately we are limited in case sets that will accommodate a 1570 Why are people so concerned about the steel composition of their case? No one & I mean no one can tell the difference, visually, between the steel used to make a good rep 5513, 1680 or 1665 & the 316L Rolex used. In fact, with the possible exception of the brushed texture (which often looks better on reps), I cannot distinguish between my oldest, cheapest POS Sub rep case & my gens. Unless you plan to use your watch in an acid bath (in which case, 904L is definitely the way to go), I fail to see what all the hullabaloo over steel composition of rep/aftermarket cases is all about? If you are talking about a modern Rolex, which uses the slightly whiter 904L steel, then you might have a point. But, even then, very few people could ID a rep case without having the gen on hand for a direct comparison. I certainly would never put any money on my ability to identify the steel composition of a vintage Rolex watch on the street. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
freddy333 Posted February 19, 2011 Report Share Posted February 19, 2011 it's nitpicking about the steel, especially a vintage type case...which should really look like it's 40 years old..... Not nitpicking, I think it is misguided. 1 of these cases is gen & the other is a standard MBW rep case. Can you tell which is which (even if you know the history of each of these watches, I think you would agree that, in practice, the steel composition of each case is not a reliable way to gauge authenticity) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
btocamelo Posted February 19, 2011 Author Report Share Posted February 19, 2011 One of the left is MBW case...on the right is GEN Those MBW cases are machined for ETA movement...so dropping in a GEN movement is out of the question. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
freddy333 Posted February 19, 2011 Report Share Posted February 19, 2011 One of the left is MBW case...on the right is GEN Correct. Those MBW cases are machined for ETA movement...so dropping in a GEN movement is out of the question. The 1665 & 5514 at the ends are gen-powered MBW mid-case-based frankens Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
btocamelo Posted February 19, 2011 Author Report Share Posted February 19, 2011 looks great....that's interested about those MBWs, I was under the impression that the larger GEN movement would not fit into the case for ETA...and the inner mounting slot is not the same, also stem alignment would be off? Are those MBW cases available...maybe from Reg? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
panerai153 Posted February 19, 2011 Report Share Posted February 19, 2011 looks great....that's interested about those MBWs, I was under the impression that the larger GEN movement would not fit into the case for ETA...and the inner mounting slot is not the same, also stem alignment would be off? Are those MBW cases available...maybe from Reg? I can't say about the newer MBW cases, but the older MBW cases both the "original Polex Design" 5513 case which was the standard case for the old 1680's as well as the old MBW 1665 cases would accept a genuine movement. It might require some milling, but obviously it isn't an insurmountable problem. Quite a few are around among forum members. I have one in the build process right now using an old MBW 1665 case and a genuine 1570 movement.Maestro Ziggy is building mine. It would be a whole lot cheaper to find and old MBW case over any of the above mentioned aftermarket cases. I know that Phong cases are really nice, and you can get serial numbers that you want engraved, but as you said 1k for a 1680 case, WOW. At todays prices for movement, dial, hands crown/tube bezel and insert w/ a nice tritium pearl,93150 bracelet and 580 end links, you would be way better off finding a nice 1680 white on the VRF market. I'm seeing them in the 4-5k range over there almost on a daily basis. Occasionally you can find a beater for less than that. If you get tired of it or want to upgrade, it's pretty easy to get your money back. Try that with a franken. Ask a few of the folks here that have tried selling "almost genuine" watches on the sales forum. probably would have to part it out to get anywhere close to what you had invested in the watch.Sales avenues are very limited, and the market here for a 3.5k watch is infinitesimally small. In looking over sales postings, and my recent experience selling a WM9/BK v3 16610 submariner, once the price gets up around 1k and over, the number of potential buyers shrinks tremendously. Not trying to discourage your idea, just some food for thought. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
btocamelo Posted February 19, 2011 Author Report Share Posted February 19, 2011 Thanks for the input...I have a clean/serviced 1570...I'm just weighing my options on a build....preferably a date model. I can't say about the newer MBW cases, but the older MBW cases both the "original Polex Design" 5513 case which was the standard case for the old 1680's as well as the old MBW 1665 cases would accept a genuine movement. It might require some milling, but obviously it isn't an insurmountable problem. Quite a few are around among forum members. I have one in the build process right now using an old MBW 1665 case and a genuine 1570 movement.Maestro The Zigmeister is building mine. It would be a whole lot cheaper to find and old MBW case over any of the above mentioned aftermarket cases. I know that Phong cases are really nice, and you can get serial numbers that you want engraved, but as you said 1k for a 1680 case, WOW. At todays prices for movement, dial, hands crown/tube bezel and insert w/ a nice tritium pearl,93150 bracelet and 580 end links, you would be way better off finding a nice 1680 white on the VRF market. I'm seeing them in the 4-5k range over there almost on a daily basis. Occasionally you can find a beater for less than that. If you get tired of it or want to upgrade, it's pretty easy to get your money back. Try that with a franken. Ask a few of the folks here that have tried selling "almost genuine" watches on the sales forum. probably would have to part it out to get anywhere close to what you had invested in the watch.Sales avenues are very limited, and the market here for a 3.5k watch is infinitesimally small. In looking over sales postings, and my recent experience selling a WM9/BK v3 16610 submariner, once the price gets up around 1k and over, the number of potential buyers shrinks tremendously. Not trying to discourage your idea, just some food for thought. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
watchguy07 Posted February 19, 2011 Report Share Posted February 19, 2011 I can't say about the newer MBW cases, but the older MBW cases both the "original Polex Design" 5513 case which was the standard case for the old 1680's as well as the old MBW 1665 cases would accept a genuine movement. It might require some milling, but obviously it isn't an insurmountable problem. Quite a few are around among forum members. I have one in the build process right now using an old MBW 1665 case and a genuine 1570 movement.Maestro The Zigmeister is building mine. It would be a whole lot cheaper to find and old MBW case over any of the above mentioned aftermarket cases. I know that Phong cases are really nice, and you can get serial numbers that you want engraved, but as you said 1k for a 1680 case, WOW. At todays prices for movement, dial, hands crown/tube bezel and insert w/ a nice tritium pearl,93150 bracelet and 580 end links, you would be way better off finding a nice 1680 white on the VRF market. I'm seeing them in the 4-5k range over there almost on a daily basis. Occasionally you can find a beater for less than that. If you get tired of it or want to upgrade, it's pretty easy to get your money back. Try that with a franken. Ask a few of the folks here that have tried selling "almost genuine" watches on the sales forum. probably would have to part it out to get anywhere close to what you had invested in the watch.Sales avenues are very limited, and the market here for a 3.5k watch is infinitesimally small. In looking over sales postings, and my recent experience selling a WM9/BK v3 16610 submariner, once the price gets up around 1k and over, the number of potential buyers shrinks tremendously. Not trying to discourage your idea, just some food for thought. This. Which is why I originally purchased my old-case MBW 1680, but ran out of money on the project. I planned on listing it for sale soon, but I'd rather sell it to someone who's going to do a bad-ass build with it; so you can have first crack at it. It's a complete watch with some gen parts though, and I'm not going to part out just the case. 1:1 with the 5513, and "Polex" between lugs. PM me for more info if you want it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
btocamelo Posted February 19, 2011 Author Report Share Posted February 19, 2011 cannot send you PM...says you cannot receive messages...send me photos of what you have and photos of the inside of the case. This. Which is why I originally purchased my old-case MBW 1680, but ran out of money on the project. I planned on listing it for sale soon, but I'd rather sell it to someone who's going to do a bad-ass build with it; so you can have first crack at it. It's a complete watch with some gen parts though, and I'm not going to part out just the case. 1:1 with the 5513, and "Polex" between lugs. PM me for more info if you want it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
username here Posted February 21, 2011 Report Share Posted February 21, 2011 +1- can't send PM- i'm looking for the same case. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mcotter Posted February 22, 2011 Report Share Posted February 22, 2011 Freddy, As long as we're chatting about accuracy in our reps...Please don't be offended but the crown guards on you Tudor sub look off! The watch looks very cool yet the cg's look like a much later variety. I'm not a cg's expert but my sml rose Sub (gen) has much pointier versions... Your collection is the gold standard to which we all subscribe.. so please don't take this reply the wrong way! Regards, mcotter Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
freddy333 Posted February 22, 2011 Report Share Posted February 22, 2011 Please don't be offended but the crown guards on you Tudor sub look off! The watch looks very cool yet the cg's look like a much later variety. I'm not a cg's expert but my sml rose Sub (gen) has much pointier versions... No offense taken. CGs vary depending on model, version & condition (how much polishing they have received over the years). Here are a couple of others Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
marc jacobs Posted February 22, 2011 Report Share Posted February 22, 2011 I have email yuki. She confirmed 1680, 5513, 5512, 1665, 1655, 5514, 9411, 1675, 5517, 6263, 9420 are using 316L. But can't sure 6538, 6536, 6542 ... I have no direct experience with aftermarket 1680 cases, but I sort of agree with Ronin. I have found that Yuki's English communication skills are quite satisfactory, so I would just check to be sure you can return his case if it does not fit (my experience with other Yuki parts is that they will accept the part back without any problem as long as you demonstrate why it was defective or incorrect). In any case, unless you are 100% certain that crowns, tubes & crystals are gens, I would factor in the cost of gen replacements no matter which aftermarket seller you buy a case from (why would you expect to receive a gen crown/tube from a seller of aftermarket cases, crowns & tubes). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GWP123 Posted November 30, 2013 Report Share Posted November 30, 2013 Where can I find these so called Phong 1680 cases or MBW Cases??? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eduardor Posted November 30, 2013 Report Share Posted November 30, 2013 (edited) Phong: jewelryandwatch.com NDT: ndtradingcorp.com Yuki: yukiwatch.com MBW: ask Narikaa, he is a TD here. Go to his section and shoot hi a pm. And read up a lot bro since they all have its pros and cons. Use the search function Edited November 30, 2013 by eduardor 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GWP123 Posted November 30, 2013 Report Share Posted November 30, 2013 Phong: jewelryandwatch.com NDT: ndtradingcorp.com Yuki: yukiwatch.com MBW: ask Narikaa, he is a TD here. Go to his section and shoot hi a pm. And read up a lot bro since they all have its pros and cons. Use the search function Thanks man Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GWP123 Posted November 30, 2013 Report Share Posted November 30, 2013 Wowwww, Phong case looks beautiful, pointed crown guards look good, but I sure as hell don't want to spend $1,250 for a case. I am going to reach out to Yuki but not sure how those crown guards look from the pics....Do you know if Yuki is friendly to us rep guys? I want to ask if an Asian or Swiss ETA 2836 Auto movement would fit the case.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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