S3g0y Posted November 8, 2011 Report Share Posted November 8, 2011 Now, everyone who bought PAM318 brooklyn bridge rep just open your candy and see how f****** far from the gen you are. This is what you should experience: http://www.network54.com/Forum/353391/thread/1320595343/The+mysterious+PAM318 Interesting, isn't it? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PeteM Posted November 8, 2011 Report Share Posted November 8, 2011 The discussions that led from this were far more interesting.... and the other threads taking it further... I suppose something was needed after the 360 hooha Been a few threads on here about it too.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
txcollector Posted November 8, 2011 Report Share Posted November 8, 2011 I was actually shocked that the Risti folks couldn't believe Panerai would cheap out. Corporations these days will do anything to increase profit margins, even if that means using a $50 movement on a $4K watch. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
subbiesrock Posted November 8, 2011 Report Share Posted November 8, 2011 Having read through the comments, the 'half-fullers' see it as a 'unique' item, like a special error banknote. However, the more cynical 'half-emptyers' are f u c k i n g p I s s e d IMHO, to stake the company's reputation on such a silly, near-sighted movement switch is really stupid. It doesn't take much to sour the image they've spent so much money to build up. Plus, it's so ironic that it happened on the 'Brooklyn Bridge' model Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
txcollector Posted November 8, 2011 Report Share Posted November 8, 2011 if they are so worry about it, pay the service center $600-800 to replace the movement, or buy a high grade 6497-2 for $400 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
exeekias Posted November 9, 2011 Report Share Posted November 9, 2011 I was actually shocked that the Risti folks couldn't believe Panerai would cheap out. Corporations these days will do anything to increase profit margins, even if that means using a $50 movement on a $4K watch. I've been thinking about this. It makes no sense to me that Panerai would have purposefully used unfinished movements to increase profit. The total run of 150 watches is so low, how much are they really saving, 150k? 300k? Richemont group had Gross sales of €6892 million and Net Profit of €1079 million in 2011 (according to their financials). 300k is a drop in that bucket, and they could stand to lose much more from this incident than they saved in terms of Goodwill (which they listed at €441 million in 2011). It seems much more likely to me that they were against some deadline, had to rush this special edition out the door, and ran into a supply problem on finished movements. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
superlative Posted November 10, 2011 Report Share Posted November 10, 2011 (edited) No Panerai watch with a 6497 in it commands a price higher than $500. When I see a PAM 203a on eBay selling for $70K, I just laugh. Edited November 10, 2011 by superlative Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AsiadeCuba Posted November 10, 2011 Report Share Posted November 10, 2011 agreed superlative. that's why i would NEVER buy a gen pam. i cant justify a 4k to 8k when the movement is barely in house. also, these super pams are too close to the gen it's not even funny Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PeteM Posted November 10, 2011 Report Share Posted November 10, 2011 When I see a PAM 203a on eBay selling for $70K, I just laugh. Why ? Are you the guy selling it ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Watchmeister Posted November 10, 2011 Report Share Posted November 10, 2011 I tend to agree that it was not some conscious decision other than the assemblers were told to get them out the door and they had no standard movements in house. Having said that in truth that movement is true to the real Panerai heritage. In it's prime (pre-Vendome) Panerai was always broke so they used whatever they could get. Ever wonder why no two pre-V's were the same. But seriously, I would hope that Panerai would own up to the mistake and offer to swap movements. And if it isn't - than shame on them. Panerai has rapidly morphed into a brand which I am a lot less proud to own. Then again that is what I am hearing from a few of the original Risti as well. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PeteM Posted November 10, 2011 Report Share Posted November 10, 2011 This saddens me to say it but... +1 I find it better to be a Risti within the rep scene.... that way I can focus on what made OP so much of a great marque rather than where it is now... I think a lot of that can be seen in attitudes of some guys who just want the current rep fodder from the factories to meet their needs of the modern (wannabe) Ristis.. Or am I being too cynical? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
txcollector Posted November 10, 2011 Report Share Posted November 10, 2011 Or am I being too cynical? well, always but what was the question again? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PeteM Posted November 10, 2011 Report Share Posted November 10, 2011 But I can always count on the support of my friends.... Hold on........!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
frankt Posted November 10, 2011 Report Share Posted November 10, 2011 One might even think that the Panny factory was simply applying a little wry humor here......After all....They were selling you ..... "The Brooklyn Bridge"!!!... ;) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MJC Posted November 10, 2011 Report Share Posted November 10, 2011 Crazy indeed... I have been a genuine PAM owner for the past 7 years... The lust back then was incredible at that time, now a day's, since i've found this site and the super rep's... It makes my genuine piece's feel like BLAH lol, kind of a waste .... I still have a gen 162/359 and 005 PVD piece, and the Panerai aura has just worn off immensely... Now to read this? And to read historical things about Panerai, other cost cutting avenues they've taken, etc etc... Not to mention people making me realize their base movements are [censored] and don't demand the price for the base watches at all (i've opened my eyes) and am no longer in delusion... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Watchmeister Posted November 10, 2011 Report Share Posted November 10, 2011 And the bizarre thing is that these are the same folks asking Haute Horologie collectors to pay $100k for a tourby. Do they really think they can be Breitling on one end (strike that, Breitling decorates its movements ) and Patek on the other. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Utheman Posted November 10, 2011 Report Share Posted November 10, 2011 It was an inside job. Some supervisor made off with a bunch of nicer movements. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PeteM Posted November 10, 2011 Report Share Posted November 10, 2011 And what a great deal he gave me too Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
exeekias Posted November 10, 2011 Report Share Posted November 10, 2011 But seriously, I would hope that Panerai would own up to the mistake and offer to swap movements. And if it isn't - than shame on them. Panerai has rapidly morphed into a brand which I am a lot less proud to own. Then again that is what I am hearing from a few of the original Risti as well. I agree, WM, owning up to the mistake and making it right will go a long way to repairing the damage done. I see you are closing in on 10k posts, got something special planned? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StormTooper4 Posted November 11, 2011 Report Share Posted November 11, 2011 I've been thinking about this. It makes no sense to me that Panerai would have purposefully used unfinished movements to increase profit. The total run of 150 watches is so low, how much are they really saving, 150k? 300k? Richemont group had Gross sales of €6892 million and Net Profit of €1079 million in 2011 (according to their financials). 300k is a drop in that bucket, and they could stand to lose much more from this incident than they saved in terms of Goodwill (which they listed at €441 million in 2011). It seems much more likely to me that they were against some deadline, had to rush this special edition out the door, and ran into a supply problem on finished movements. I really hope you work in a "Marketing " role because you nearly had me sold there. I reckon they knew exactly what they were doing and in all seriousness the vast majority of Panerai's Historic range is massively overpriced regardless of what plates /Engravings you put on a eta 6497 its still a 100$ movement. They are Cheap cheap watches , don't get me wrong I love em, but not enough to think that a Gen Historic is worth it over a good rep. Even the F Series as used in the 127's which is the best of the bad bunch is still only a cheap movement and I think with the BB the risti crowd have finally woken up to the fact they are a rip off. But that the watch industry all over aint it . ETA 7750's and 2836's in watces that are $5000+ is just silly and dont even start me on Brietling & Tag quartz's.A Bird I work with just spent $1400 on a pink faced Quartz TAG that she got in the USA and she thinks she snagged a bargain cos its a 100 bucks more in AUS . Oh how I Chuckled . Because of the silly prices commanded on PreA &V's these days Panerai thought they could squeeze a few more bucks on the back of the "Special Edition" label , we know its bollox and now the rest world does a s well. Its the last attempt before they got totally in house on their movements. Which will only be able to be serviced by Panerai and will keep the cash flowing in. Cynical perhaps I may be and its just my opinion...But come on guys they is a well overpriced watch and to justify it is foolish Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
exeekias Posted November 11, 2011 Report Share Posted November 11, 2011 I really hope you work in a "Marketing " role because you nearly had me sold there. Nop sorry, not Marketing. I used to do archaeology, now Accounting Well, it may very well be cost-cutting as you say; it just looked more to me like the decision was taken due to a bottlneck in production rather than to the cost savings, which was minimal and vastly overshadowed by the potential (and now actual) damage the "scandal" has done and will do to the brand, in terms of trademark value, goodwill, and Its impact on future sales. I mean, for most all these marques you are buying "the brand": the image it projects, its rich history, what famous events are timed/sponsored by it, what celebrities are seen wearing it, and then qualities of the watch: its accuracy, its precision, how complex and unique it is, what materials is it made of, its philosophy of design. First and foremost the watch is a fashion statement, so yeah the materials that go in it should be of high quality, but retailers sell "The Brand", of which the actual physical watch you purchase is only a small part. And like you say, if believe otherwise you are fooling yourself. A watch gets progressively closer I think to meeting the standard of quality justifying the retail price when precious and/or exotic materials, or when inhouse movements and/or movements with multiple complications are used. And there is a point at which you can match the quality level in a artisan, generic or replica watch and have it at a price that is almost wholly based on cost of production; without paying for "the brand," in other words. And a replica, well if its good enough to be mimetic of the brand to the point where it is functionally and visually indistinguishable from the gen, then the wearer of that watch gets "the brand" for free, more or less. And that's our hobby, at least one aspect of it. So I guess people are upset at Panerai because they had been publicly striving for greater status and exclusivity by moving towards inhouse movements, and this 318 represents a step backward, maybe an intentional one, to down-market the brand. In New York City, the fashion capital. I can see that happening. It may even help our hobby. If some of these companies are that cynical, I wouldn't doubt if they were making gen parts available to us at suitably high prices through back channels while decrying replicas out the other side of their mouth. This all sounds very Swiss to me, somehow. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Watchmeister Posted November 11, 2011 Report Share Posted November 11, 2011 It is getting interesting. Apparently Panerai is offering to swap movements without "admitting" a mistake. Someone had the nerve to designate the movement as a new caliber. In any case if you are curious there are a couple of interesting threads on risti about the uproar and Panerai's response. http://www.network54.com/Forum/353391/message/1320959034/Whilst+in+transit+I+will+provide+as+much+info+as+I+can%2C+as+I+learn+it%2C+about+the+318... http://www.network54.com/Forum/353391/message/1320958470/But+it+can%27t+be+official+right- Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PeteM Posted November 11, 2011 Report Share Posted November 11, 2011 I am actualy enjoying the discussion over 'UNofficial resource'.... I mean.... Come on guys!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Watchmeister Posted November 11, 2011 Report Share Posted November 11, 2011 Quote from one of the Risti threads: "The OPXXIX movement was in OP stock and when it was decided to produce this Special Edition with a special price" To be read as those rat bastards thought they could pull a fast one on their loyal customer base. The reps are more "honest" than OP. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
txcollector Posted November 11, 2011 Report Share Posted November 11, 2011 Quote from one of the Risti threads: "The OPXXIX movement was in OP stock and when it was decided to produce this Special Edition with a special price" To be read as those rat bastards thought they could pull a fast one on their loyal customer base. The reps are more "honest" than OP. and people didn't believe me they would cheap out Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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