gioarmani Posted December 9, 2006 Report Share Posted December 9, 2006 Tonight, I had the back open on my new Daytona 7750 from Josh (I purchased from Overboosted) attempting to regulate the movement. To note, it's only 3-4 months old and I've only used the chronos once, and they reset perfectly. Before opening the case-back, I pulled the crown out to the last position activating the hacking function, to stop the second hand from moving. I don't recall touching anything other than the one arm on the escapement used to slow down/speed up the beat. When I pushed the crown back in, the watch didn't resume ticking. The gold-wheel that the hairspring is in (forgive my lack of terminology) still rocks back and forth for about 10-20 seconds if you move it--moves as if it would under normal circumstances--and the hairspring is still attached and looks perfect. None of the other gears connected to it appear stripped or bent, but I can't see anything out of place (to my untrained eye) but the watch still won't resume ticking. My camera's battery is dead, so I'll use one of your pictures to illustrate what I did notice: Underneath the escapement there's a silver gear with teeth (I've labeled "B") that seems to also tick to the second's beat, guided by another silver, hook-like piece (labeled "A"). These also connect to a larger, gold gear (labeled "C"). When you get the escapement to turn like it normally would, the hook (A) moves back and forth (I'm guessing similar to the old clock verge & folliet system), but B & C refuse to move with it. Now, I'm not sure in which order these 3 run off each other, but something funny happened a minute later, that also happened after I screwed the case-back on and attempted to wind it via the crown. There was a fast whirring noise and B & C were suddenly speeding along so fast, that the seconds subdial hand @ 6 was spinning so fast you could even see it move, and the hour & minute hands were racing around the dial. They probably moved a good 4 or 5 hours worth ahead. At the time this was going on neither the escapement with the hairspring, or hook (A) were moving. After about 10 seconds this spinning completely ceased and nothing was moving internally, or on the dial/subdials. As I stated earlier, I replaced the case-back and heard the same noise (accompanied by the dial/subdial spinning) for another 10 seconds, then ceased again. This did not affect the other chrono subdials or the large second hand that runs when the stop-watch function is activated; this stayed at 12 o'clock as it normally does. I've never seen this before, and have never heard of this happening anywhere on the boards (from my search queries). I'm hoping you can provide me with some assistance as to what this might be, so I know what to ask for at the watch-smiths tomorrow. I don't want to jinx the perfect resetting of the chronos and would like to avoid having them disassemble every part of the movement in order to fix it (and save a little money), if possible. I'm curious if it's something less than $100 that can be relatively easily fixed, or whether I should just buy another Daytona, but I'd rather not unless absolutely necessary as I don't want to get stuck with one who's subdials don't reset properly. Any assistance you can provide would be greatly appreciated. Thank you for your time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Devedander Posted December 9, 2006 Report Share Posted December 9, 2006 I am sorry but I have less knowledge on the subject than you, but was wondering why you changed the beat lever (do you have one of those fancy machines to tell you how accurate the beat is) and how you can see what inside is turning with the caseback screwed on? I am not doubting anything you say, just trying to follow along... Also did you try to put everything back exactly where it was when you started to see if that helps? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gioarmani Posted December 9, 2006 Author Report Share Posted December 9, 2006 I regulated the movement in the same manner all my others have been--because it was running too fast. And the reason why I knew what was happening inside the movement, was because the same thing that happened while the caseback was off, also happened after the caseback was on. No offence, but this thread was intended for expert answers to the problem I've addressed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RWG Technical Posted December 9, 2006 Report Share Posted December 9, 2006 I only have a few minutes so I will get right to it... First point, never ever remove the stem on a 7750 with the watch in any position but the WINDING position...actually do this on every watch... I know it goes against the "Experts" but it has never failed me, and I have removed a number of stems... The first problem you said, where the watch would not run after you installed the stem, is directly caused by removing the stem with the watch not in the winding position. What has happened and is now the problem, is that once you took the stem out, the hacking lever slipped out of the clutch wheel, and when you pressed the stem back in, the hacking lever got in front of the clutch gear and is pressing against the balance ALL the time... THis is why the watch won't work... Because of this, when you removed and reinstalled the stem again, the hacking lever was pushing even harder against the balance and probably caused some damage. If you hold the movemnet sideways, look inside past the balance towards the stem and crown, you will see the hacking lever pushing against the balance...to fix this you need to take the movement apart on the dial side and reset the parts of the keyless works.... AGAIN, never take a stem out but in the winding position, on ALL movements... especially the 7750...normally on the 7750 the crown gear falls down also when you remove the stem in the time setting position, causing even more problems... Sorry but I have to run... RG Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gioarmani Posted December 9, 2006 Author Report Share Posted December 9, 2006 Maybe my wording was off, but I didn't actually remove them stem from the movement; simply unscrewed it from the tube & pulled it out to the position you normally would to adjust the time. Does this change the diagnosis? Thanks for your input; hope to hear from you when you have more time. Thanks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RWG Technical Posted December 10, 2006 Report Share Posted December 10, 2006 Maybe my wording was off, but I didn't actually remove them stem from the movement; simply unscrewed it from the tube & pulled it out to the position you normally would to adjust the time. Does this change the diagnosis? Thanks for your input; hope to hear from you when you have more time. Thanks. Ok sorry for misreading your info, I had never heard of removing a movement and reinstalling it in a case without removing the stem...that is what threw me off... Having said that I am at a loss as to the problem...it's difficult to find problems when you can hold and look at the watch in person, but almost impossible to do it on a forum... I am not sure what the problem could be it could be hands touching, or the hacking lever as it can pop out of place, or any of a number of things... If I saw it in person, I could probably be of more help...sorry... RG Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
slay Posted December 10, 2006 Report Share Posted December 10, 2006 I had similar problems with a 6497 once, it wouldnt start ticking. the problem was, that a little fiber (I had the movement sitting on the carpet, yes I'm dumb lol) went into the movement and curled around one of the girls and blocked it from running. and that spinning around of the hands has also happened to me once, right after I wound a watch (fiddy). it all the hands started to swing like a mofo, they spinned soo fast the lume fell off! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gioarmani Posted December 10, 2006 Author Report Share Posted December 10, 2006 Ok sorry for misreading your info, I had never heard of removing a movement and reinstalling it in a case without removing the stem...that is what threw me off... Having said that I am at a loss as to the problem...it's difficult to find problems when you can hold and look at the watch in person, but almost impossible to do it on a forum... I am not sure what the problem could be it could be hands touching, or the hacking lever as it can pop out of place, or any of a number of things... If I saw it in person, I could probably be of more help...sorry... RG Not a problem; I appreciate your time. Well, I've taken it to my German guy, so we'll see what he has to say by Tuesday. He doesn't think it requires a complete rebuild. I certaintly hope not--the chronos are perfect & I've got the time regulation almost down to the second. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gioarmani Posted December 14, 2006 Author Report Share Posted December 14, 2006 Bump! Alright, I was a little busy when the smith called to tell me which gears had gone askew, but the long & short of it is $130, and 3-4 weeks. Since this movement is so complicated & such a pain in the ass to work on, should I simply buy another or repair this one? Opinions? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RWG Technical Posted December 14, 2006 Report Share Posted December 14, 2006 What gears are we talking about??? $130 is a lot of gears, curious as to what he found...and needs replacing... BIG caution, this is not an ETA movement, and many ETA parts will NOT fit on it...if he's ordering ETA, since you can't get Asian parts, I would be very careful that you dont' end up paying for parts you can't use... What exactly is wrong with the movement? RG Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gioarmani Posted December 14, 2006 Author Report Share Posted December 14, 2006 Just tried calling, and they said he's not in today. They told me something about having to completely disassemble the movement in order to fix it. German, so the accent's really thick--sounded like something with a bad "train wheel" (?) and some other gear inside. Should I take it somewhere else, or does this not sound correct? I don't know of any other reputable smiths in the Tampa area that can fix a rep; if anybody else does, please let me know. I'm trying to weigh my options as to the best solution--repair of the existing watch, or another replacement. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
retep Posted December 14, 2006 Report Share Posted December 14, 2006 How about sending it to our resident watchgoeroe who answered your questions...........The Zigmeisterzumba. Or is there a real customs problem? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Highflyingclive Posted December 14, 2006 Report Share Posted December 14, 2006 ...on the carpet ... curled around one of the girls ... Anytime you need help with this task, Slay - just give me a call We now return you to your scheduled program... which isn't funny. I feel for you, Gioarmani Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gioarmani Posted December 14, 2006 Author Report Share Posted December 14, 2006 Anytime you need help with this task, Slay - just give me a call We now return you to your scheduled program... which isn't funny. I feel for you, Gioarmani Yes, but modern girls aren't supposed to have "carpet". I'm going to take it for a second opinion and see what happens, or I may just say screw it and replace it. Since his wait was 3-4 weeks, where do you sit currently, The Zigmeister? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RWG Technical Posted December 15, 2006 Report Share Posted December 15, 2006 I wonder how the gears got damaged by you only removing the watch from the case...seems odd... If you can get a replacement this may be your best option, but getting replacement 7750's is not easy. If you want me to look at it, shoot me a PM and we can work something out...worse case you out the postage cost...best case it's an easy fix and that solves your problem... RG Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gioarmani Posted December 15, 2006 Author Report Share Posted December 15, 2006 Actually, Mr. Josh has agreed to replace/fix the watch as it's only 4 or 5 months old. God bless him for it. I do sincerely appreciate your offer though, Zig. If any do ever need repair, I promise to send them to you instead of dealing with the [censored] around here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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