I love Panerai as much as the next guy but...

[SportsPg]

Guys and gals,

I think we have enough PAM reps now - there are like 20 models to choose from that are by and large pretty damned impressive. My #1 watch still is my EL 196, but recently the new IWC watches, the Omega Planet Ocean and some other brands have caught my eye.

I was perusing a watch guide I was given over the holidays and came across this beauty. Anyone know Kobold Polar Surveyor? This is the Sir Ranulph Fiennes version, I think we need a rep...it's gorgeous. Here are it's stats:

case

stainless steel (surgical); brushed / satinized finish

dimensions

41.3 mm diameter (bezel end to bezel end);

45.8 mm diameter overall (bezel end to crown end;

50.8 mm length overall (lug end to lug end);

20 mm lug width (between lugs; measures strap width);

15.3 mm height overall

crystal synthetic sapphire; domed, anti-reflective (inside only); extra-thick

crown screw-locked; signed

push pieces recessed

bezel unique blue bezel; stationary; 24-hour scale

back stainless steel (surgical); Antarctica laser etching

ratings* waterproof (20 atm/660 ft with crown locked); (3 atm/100 ft with crown unlocked) antimagnetic; shock-resistant; pressure-proof to 30 atmospheres

movement K.715 (base caliber ETA 7750); Swiss-made; chronograph mechanism

winding automatic mechanism

jewels 28

balance Glucydur

mainspring Nivarox 1

decoration skeletonized rotor, gold-plated; engraved & signed

functions

hours, minutes, seconds; chronograph hours, minutes, seconds; GMT; AM/PM indicator for local time (world novelty); date

other 42 hours power reserve

*all ratings in accordance with the strict regulations set forth by the German Industrial Standard Bureau, DIN

Anyone seen a Kobold before or own a gen? Thoughts vs. PAM or other big watches like IWC, SINN etc?

[right_on_time]

the aesthetic of Kobold is not as clean and attractive as a Panerai. My 2 cents worth, they wont make the replica out of the kobold cause the branding is not straong enough to reach out to the masses. otherwise the watch is SOLID!

[jimmytim]

Cross between Daytona and Speedmaster?

Maybe?

[chris5264]

I'm not a huge fan of kobold's design but I think the watches have such a great story behind them I've considered buying one a few times. I've lived in Pittsburgh for years now and just realized his office is less than 30 mins from me, so I have planned a trip down there after spring semester is over. I'll do a post on my trip, should be cool.

[HighDef]

Wow, it look like an EXP, IWC,Breitling, Omega and a 212.

[coolfire]

Wow, it look like an EXP, IWC,Breitling, Omega and a 212.

Hmmm... kinda agree on that, dude... apart from the brand name, this watch actually looks pretty good...

[longshot]

Michael Kobold is a spoiled rich kid whose father (a wealthy German industrialist, see Kobold Instruments) gave him a few million dollars to start a watch compeny. His father is also very close friends with Helmut Sinn.

When his watches were a reasonable value I owned one and it was nice enough. Then he more then doubled the prices in an effort to move upmarket, but did not change anything. They are just another ETA movement recased, at Rolex pricing.

He has also been arrested for impersonating a police officer and part of his 'tough guy' persona

Then he tried the 'Navy Seals', 'Mall Ninja' marketing ploy, which failed. Navy Seals wear G-Shocks as they can't afford $4000 watches!

But the best part to me is...

Look at the dial of the watch pictured. On his f'lagship' model Surveyor is MISSPELLED

THey were made aware of the problam and did not bother to fix it!!!!!!!!!

Maybe if the rep makers made one with CORRECT spelling on the dial I would buy the rep

[Richard Tracy]

Cross between Omega and Breitling....

[archibald]

LOL!!! Mall-ninja. That's my word of the day. You are a poet, my friend.

[SportsPg]

Michael Kobold is a spoiled rich kid whose father (a wealthy German industrialist, see Kobold Instruments) gave him a few million dollars to start a watch compeny. His father is also very close friends with Helmut Sinn.

When his watches were a reasonable value I owned one and it was nice enough. Then he more then doubled the prices in an effort to move upmarket, but did not change anything. They are just another ETA movement recased, at Rolex pricing.

He has also been arrested for impersonating a police officer and part of his 'tough guy' persona

Then he tried the 'Navy Seals', 'Mall Ninja' marketing ploy, which failed. Navy Seals wear G-Shocks as they can't afford $4000 watches!

But the best part to me is...

Look at the dial of the watch pictured. On his f'lagship' model Surveyor is MISSPELLED

THey were made aware of the problam and did not bother to fix it!!!!!!!!!

Maybe if the rep makers made one with CORRECT spelling on the dial I would buy the rep

That's interesting - I didn't know the history of the brand. I think the surveyoUr spelling is some sort of Euro chic english, they can't have actually pulled a chinese manufacturer move and misspelled the word could they?

[chris5264]

Michael Kobold is a spoiled rich kid whose father (a wealthy German industrialist, see Kobold Instruments) gave him a few million dollars to start a watch compeny. His father is also very close friends with Helmut Sinn.

When his watches were a reasonable value I owned one and it was nice enough. Then he more then doubled the prices in an effort to move upmarket, but did not change anything. They are just another ETA movement recased, at Rolex pricing.

He has also been arrested for impersonating a police officer and part of his 'tough guy' persona

Then he tried the 'Navy Seals', 'Mall Ninja' marketing ploy, which failed. Navy Seals wear G-Shocks as they can't afford $4000 watches!

But the best part to me is...

Look at the dial of the watch pictured. On his f'lagship' model Surveyor is MISSPELLED

THey were made aware of the problam and did not bother to fix it!!!!!!!!!

Maybe if the rep makers made one with CORRECT spelling on the dial I would buy the rep

I haven't heard any of this, but did notice that only two years ago the watches were going for around 1,000 and now they at least doubled. And the resale is pretty bad on these, not near panerai. I've seen a few going for less than 50%. Even with these things going on,,,it would still be interesting to talk with him.

[jake48]

Michael Kobold is a spoiled rich kid whose father (a wealthy German industrialist, see Kobold Instruments) gave him a few million dollars to start a watch compeny....

Well, here we see how internet rumors are perpetuated. I am admittedly not what one would considered unbiased in my opinion (I own four Kobolds) but I do speak with a little bit of reliable authority as I have known Mike Kobold since he started his "little watch Co." For starters, he is as gracious as any person I have met and his father did not give him "a few million dollars to start a watch company". His father actually was against the idea initially. Also, it is Mike who knows and is a good friend with Helmut Sinn and it is Sinn who helped Mike get started. Mike was also guided by a few other people he had the pleasure to work with, you may have heard of them before - Gerd-R Lange & Walter Lange. (Chronoswiss and A. Lange & Sons respectively)

Actually, Mike has changed his entire line of watches completely from when they were first introduced. His first watches were a collaboration with Helmet Sinn of Guinand-Watch. These watches were essentially Guinand-Watches rebadged with the Kobold name. Contrary to rumor (or is that rumour) Mike did not have "millions" and was lucky enough to have Helmut help him with his start and rebadging of a limited number of watches. These few watches were all Mike could afford initially. (This is not to say that later, as Mike began to run a successful watch business his father, who saw a good investment opportunity, did not invest some money) His watches now are exclusively his by design and in fact he has come up with some very original ideas. As far as using ETA movmn'ts - you have got to be kidding! I won't even begin the list of reputable watch makers who use ETA movemn'ts (it's way too long for this post)

As far as impersonating a police officer goes, yes Mike was charged with this. However, if you knew the details, you would be laughing pretty hard at the speculation that the very young and naive Kobold (at the time of the incident) was looking to establish a "tough guy" image. Kobold has publicly apologized for his mistake and like any story, there are two sides. Always be cautious of someone who is quick to spread rumors with out knowing the facts.

As for as Navy Seals or anyone else for that matter who wears Kobold watches, check his web site. He has a list of who wears Kobolds. As a member of the Law Enforcement community that share a fondness for Kobold watches, I can assure you that every person or organization mentioned on Kobold's list uses Kobold watches. And as a side note, Kobold has not and does not give watches to people to wear. He does, however, give Military and Law Enforcement a small discount. Further, many Kobold watches you have seen on celebrities wrists are returned to Kobold who auctions them off and gives the proceeds to charities.

And probably the only thing I can say I agree with you on is that I wish the prices did not go up so much. Mike, however, as a businessman, made a decision to try and enter the high end market. He knows what he is doing and it is his company to make or break. As of today, I might add, he seems to be doing just fine with his "little watch Co."

The "misspelling" of surveyour on his watch is not misspelled. Mike was a German kid who was sent to English boarding schools for much of his education, hence the European way of spelling surveyor - as in honour - sorry.

As a whole, I can tell you one thing for sure. Mike Kobold loves watches and is a genuinely nice guy who makes awesome watches.

Here is something not everyone knows and I am not sure Mike would want me to reveal, but he shares a little something in common with us rep collectors. One evening, my wife and I were having dinner with Mike and as usual, he was wearing two watches, one on each wrist. He saw me looking at his Rolex Daytona and in an instant it was off his wrist as he handed it to me. Mike said "isn't it amazing" - I didn't particularly like Rolex's and this watch was a beater, so I wasn't sure what the amazement was. Then Mike told me - "It's a replica" He went on to say how good the watch was made and that he was amazed with the high end watch reps coming from China and he seemed honestly impressed!

I met Mike because of my passion for nice watches. We quickly discovered we shared the same passion and that was all it took to develop a friendship. I did not have an image to sell or millions to give to Mike. He has treated me fair and as a friend from the day we met. I would like to believe most people who share our passion for watches are as gracious and kind as Mike - too bad it is not always true

Kevin

Edited April 19, 2006 by jake48

[jraines87]

Fine post Kevin....

[Guest eddielee11]

i was actually going to get Polar Surveyor with jet black dial.

it sure is a beautiful watch

I am a watch pimp...but i also love to play with my ladies( watches).....as pimp also has needs....

I am a watch, lanthern, and fountain pen junkies....and when comes to watch, i enjoy the uniqueness of the time pieces in my private collection...some of my pieces are replicas, fantasy replicas... but they do the tricks for me....

As for Kobold,,,,it has a unique feature....I t does not use any in house movt...it is using the swiss 7750 movt..but the movt has been modified....to have gmt , am/pm , and working chrono stop watch functions. This is rare as i have never seen a watch that is capable of doing all this functions...if Kobold can add GPS feature on his watches....Kobold will be as good as " A watch for all seasons". To modify a watch movt is a tough job, and i do appreciate the beauty of such modification.

I will eventually get myself a piece of Kobold even the price is high. Sadly, Kobold rarely offers any discount like the omegas...etc....

[swemoose]

I've also met Mike and he is one of the few "stand-up" guys in the watch business. Truly a pleasure to talk to.

Ps. I would like to see the Kobold Seal as a rep......

Moose

[chris5264]

Here is something not everyone knows and I am not sure Mike would want me to reveal, but he shares a little something in common with us rep collectors.

Interesting. I was planning on wearing my gen 111H for my visit but it is now up for sale and wasn't sure what to wear. Now, perhaps I'll wear my 024 rep and see what happens.

Those that have had Kobolds on, most measure in at 42 mm, do they feel much smaller than a panerai?

[jake48]

Those that have had Kobolds on, most measure in at 42 mm, do they feel much smaller than a panerai?

Chris,

As far as Panerai size/feel VS Kobold. The Panerai feels a little bigger in diameter, mainly because of the crown guard. Most Kobold's feel a lttle top heavy as they are a little thicker than a Panerai in general. As an overall statement I would, however, say the Kobold feels a little smaller.

Kevin

[Chronus]

I speak *real* English in the UK, and have never come across surveyor spelled as surveyour ... I would think that spelling is more for a marketing reason or a mispelling. Probably easier to trademark too.

[slay]

[ubiquitous]

If Tony Soprano likes Kobold, then you should too.

...Or else...!!

[Bansenshukai]

Then he tried the 'Navy Seals', 'Mall Ninja' marketing ploy, which failed. Navy Seals wear G-Shocks as they can't afford $4000 watches!

Let’s see:

Dive Pay - $340 / mo

Jump Pay - $225 / mo

Demolition Pay - $225 / mo

Assignment Incentive Pay - $750 / mo

Foreign Language Proficiency - $300 / mo (from $150 - $300 depending on level of proficiency)

“Other” very frequent pay based on increased Operational Tempo (i.e., lots of work, few folks to do it) –

Combat Zone Tax Exclusion – Based on your Home of Record, this can go up to about $1000 / mo for a six to eight month deployment

Family Separation Pay - $100 / mo for time spent on deployment

Imminent Danger Pay (AKA Hostile Fire Pay) - $225 / mo

Not including –

-Allowance for Housing (we don't pay rent and even if you own your house, you get this which can be from $600 to over $1000/mo, depending on location)

-TDY pay for short duration deployments in non-hostile areas.

Normal Pay for the average Seal Operator – Assuming an average operator is an E-6:

$2465.10 / mo (with 6 years in service)

I think a SEAL could afford the $4000 watch. But, then, why risk breaking it with all the abuse it’s going to get in our arena. I personally know of a tough little Omega SMP that has literally been through “hell and back”.

But, I can see why the SOCOM would not purchase a $4000/watch contract. I wouldn't either.

Edited April 20, 2006 by Nouns Defions