Noel Fleischer

Here's my IHS Asian, working well-so far! group shot 3rd from right. its so good i keep it next to my gens in the box.

How about a little visit "Overseas"?

Thanx By-Tor, you're right. they are very good reps IMHO. they are almost 2 years old and the gold has really held up. i tested the Daytona and it was 10-12kt. Taking away the emotions and the fact that he lies like crazy there's something to be said about these reps @$1000. Especially if the Daytona has the real Valjoux as he swears. I think its possible because it runs very smoothly. After all; $1000 for the HB BB with an A7750. The real YM costs about $15K with the MOP/Diamond face BTW

Here's another with her sister, TT Daytona as promised Swiss Valjoux movement (may actually be- keeps damn good time, but winder doesn't work). Both courtesy james.

that's the only one i have now- want some more?

After the hub-bub from last week, i figured i'd show my $1000 from "this was James" from Bestswiss

there are alot of falsehoods in that article. i have a number of reps that are working fine after several years. only a very knowlegeble watch person would be able to call out the well made reps. that said, i still have about 35% gens in my collection. i like variety and i just can't afford every gen i like. i wouldn't want to have a rep only collection.

still waitin' don't expect pix like BY-TOR. i'm reatarded with the camera.

it looks nice, but too many flaws on the dial and the size is off . i doubt this will be a true 'super rep'.

i'm still waitin' too! something is a bit weird. that other tag looks nice though.

me too they say the SSD is the best water rep. you know even hi end gens don't always do so well in water. for example- a Tag may say 300 meters but they don't even really recommend it for diving. i doubt it can withstand 1000 feet of water!!

thank you for the apology. its a shame that things got so heated and the mob mentality appeared to take over. but 'we will survive'

that's a good size for 'todays woman' a got a gen one like that -also quartz, but for men about 42mm & chrono. they're not too expensive. you can get them here in the states or online for about 35% off. Tags are really reliable watches; we get kinda snobby around here with the automatic thing. the truth is a tag quartz will run circles around most of these high end watches for accuracy and durability. and you can take them swimming/diving whatever!

@15mando- i'm not bragging about anything.nor am i here to defend the dealers. i'm just saying that my experience with josh for the most part has been good (i bet many would agree). i'm Not condoning any unethical behavior, nor do i want to see anyone ripped off. i've been ripped off many times in this business. i said i don't believe all the claims by the cartels- for example, i doubt every mov't they claim to sell as swiss is really an eta- not a clone. and yes this bothers me. but you can have the same problem with ruby too. what suprises me here- this vast outpouring of anger against the'cartel'. lets get real here they are not war criminals. who are we to judge when we are all part of a collective illegal network.if everybody is so fed up why do they continue to buy from these guys. i don't see how we can cry victim so much when we get a very reasonable rep for 5% of the cost and in the case of 'jandrew' almost immediate 24/7 service. @Eurotimez- as i said above, i'm not here to knock you. i was just using an example for the this thread. everybody seems bent on hanging josh &andrew and i was playing the devils advocate.i added that i'd probably buy again, knowing that daytonas are a problem. so i'm not angry; i just had bad luck. the only thing that i will say again- if a watchmaker who has no axe to grind says there is a problem mov't; i would tend to believe him. i'm sorry if this sounds suspicious.

Yep I spoke to Eurotimez about an exchange- no deal. I even said i had a watchmaker take it apart and i was told the mov't was no good- wheels bent. Chris really didn't believe me but in the end offered $25 credit. as a "kind gesture". also offered to take it back , maybe fix it. I'm underwhelmed, but i'm not angry. probably get something else. i think Jandrew would have at least equaled that deal, probably better.

What i bring to this discussion is my own feelings and experience. i was trying to say that most of us are not privi to the back door dealings of black market merchants across the globe. (apparently Dave 123 might be) I am not naive- of course i beleive that Josh and Andrew (and Bill Gates) would try to manipulate the market to their advantage. Nor do I believe all of the claims; for example- the ETA issue vs. clones. Like many of us, I came here late in the game. I was used to paying $1000 for so called solid 18k gold reps with 27 jewel movements! I am used to be lied to in this game. Not to condone it, rather by comparison I find Josh a relative saint. As for Eurotimez- not to knock him, but he seems to be enjoying a honeymoon around here. Perhaps because he is fairly new as a dealer. I bought 1 watch from him which turned out to be a POS! (Daytona which is a problem piece- I know) I really doubt the QC was better than Josh in that case. And- I realize that Josh & Andrew both probably drop-ship, even if they deny it. Its a free country- if RMI bans the Cartel good for them. Caveat Emptor, if people don't feel good about "jandrew" they can buy elsewhere. So far; I have no reason to be angry with Josh. He's always been fair with me, selfishly, that's my main concern.

I am not a member of RMI nor do I know the facts enough to come a conclusion about who did what. I think we need to remember that this 'hobby' is illegal! I do have personal experience with Josh and also to some degree with Andrew. Almost all of the dealings have been smooth and polite. In fact, often much better than the service i get with 'legitmate' businesses. I would much rather do business with Josh than an insurance company! Think about other 'black market' businesses, there is no rule of law, concern for other dealers, etc,etc. In the drug world your competition is often just murdered.Of course i'm exaggerating abit. We are alot more civilized than crack dealers here- I hope. As for price fixing- it seems that the prices are more or less the same within $30-40. In fact Eurotimez likes to advertise that they are more expensive than Andrew.

so its 3mm more than the gen. I think Josh originally told me 1mm. $400 has become almost the middle range for new reps. look at the Concord, APROO, HB BB, etc. its in the mail- i think its the kind of thing that you can only see when you actually put it on.

oopps- my bad.

I ordered one of these from the dreaded 'cartel'. i'm still waiting to get it - i saw that its 18mm thick. that seems like a monster- i can't think of any other watches that size. i once tried on a gen and don't remember it being so bulky. it seems like the mods of the A 7750 really made it bigger. Has anyone actually seen it yet?

well i took the plunge- i'll be the first on the block to own the Grand Carrera. I got the black face- should get in within a week - from Andrew.

i have to agree, i never had any problems with my cheaper asian reps. i have quite a number of problems with the 'swiss' movements. mostly the winding mechanism/setting bridge. there's nothing wrong with starting with a rolex. i think the plain black sub is abit played out; you can try a newer DJ. they have many interesting dials, josh,andrew & ruby have tons to chose from.

i think if you really like this hobby, sooner or later you're gonna end up with some gens. there is something different about the look and feel of the gens that can't be captured by the rep. also- you can get pretty good deals on some of the less exclusive brands especially on the net. I have a gen SS Timewalker (not chrono) i paid about $1700. I doubt that i'd pay 20k for a gen; but i have paid up to 7k for a gen TT GMT ceramic

i've worked with a russian guy mike- he's on 2nd Ave. & 71 ST. (he shares space in a shoe repair)he's pretty good -he works on anything. also you can send to guys on the forum, like rex or The Zigmeister

i would guess that they get ALOT of business from us and our friends. i've been a collector for quite awhile and like most of us, kinda ended up here by accident. you are much more likely to end up at Ideal, BestSwiss, etc. when you search for reps. i never saw one mention of Perfect Clones until i got here.