client9

I just received a Noob Yachtmaster and I noticed that the crystal sits much too low -- it's perfectly flush with the bezel. Is there a way to fix this? If so, about how much will it cost?

The only purpose of your post was to create useless drama and another 20-page debate. This is so transparent... you think we're complete idiots here?

....

You have no class.

Enough said.

This was a shock and a disappointment to read.

And one final [harsh] note to you personally TeeJay

I understand. Reps are indeed a dirty business.

Where do they find these guys?

And whose to call your post a "literary work of high intelligence",.. are you claiming this for yourself ??... you seem to be telling us exactly how things are going down... what you said happened,.. like it's "point of FACT" can you show any insight into how you garnered this brilliant piece of intelligence.. Humint ?? what ??

Do you have any "real Insight" into how Asian "organizations" work..?? the Hierarchy involved.. do you have any "on the job" experience... How does the Top of the food chain work ?? have you seen it in action ??

Lanikai, I've been complimented on my writing abilities before, but I've never had my work called "a literary work of high intelligence" before. Thank you for that. I appreciate it.

I will admit, I've never been to a meeting of replica dealers, but that does not matter. It doesn't take a genius to put together what is going on behind the scenes with the facts that are given. This is what my post said:

1. Andrew is a major league dealer who makes a lot of money (fact)

2. Because he is a major dealer, he must have close connections to manufacturers (fact)

3. These connections allow him to threaten other 'trusted dealers' with access to watches (fact, it's the reason he was banned)

4. Price fixing leads to higher prices for forum members (fact)

Is this line of reasoning really that outrageous, Lanikai? Do you really need a documentary and photographs to accept this? Is it worth insulting me over?

Hate to say it, but that statement that it costs $3 causes me to loser all confidence in anything you have to say. The goddamn movement cost a hell of a lot more. And how nice of you to to provide them with a better wage than their lower paid chinese counterparts. They should be so grateful to us westerners. Yes, Massuh!

Whoever said "Ignorance is bliss"?

If ignorance is bliss, you must be in heaven right now, Robert.

The retail price of a movement, like any other good, is indeed expensive, but the wholesale price is dirt cheap. For example, did you know Nike shoes only cost $5 to make? This is called economies of scale - look into it.

The dealers don't have to say, "Yes, Massuh!" They only have to reply to emails promptly and deliver what they promise. That means not charging $100 for "waterproofing" that never gets done.

I am not posting in defense nor commenting on the RWI synopsis ... but c9 you have come to this froum 3 months ago that not being the point .. but you post such ludicris statements .. like everyone is dealing in back street alley's

you're testamony is not based on a single "shred" of evidence or "Proof" ... but your... "I'll tell you". line is ignorant to the point of being comical..

Is this just so you can join the mix ??

Go ahead and buy outside all the forums dealers and see how far you get with decent reps ... How many reps of awaited genuines have you purchased?

if you have been buying for a year or 2 .. that time frame would give you a good idea of how things operate... how many parts have you sourced from dealers ?? another gauge into the rep business world

"factory dealers" are those whom commission the factories or "maker" to replicate a genuine piece .... the dealers that procure the rep has done so from his own pocket .... the maker disassembles the genuine,.. for replication..

The factory or Maker that is commissioned has a quota for the dealers to sell .. and the Factory makers set the price..

ever been into a Staturn Car Dealership.... there is no Bartering.. no one dealer can give you a better price than what you see on the tag at your first stop.. the prices are set across the board .. the same at every dealership .. they could vary on where you live.. to adjust for fishing..

The Saturn Car Dealers are under the factories say so....

a Dealer that breaks the ranks has to answer to someone....

What if the Factory set a price and you were not following directions... would they send a factory representative??? of course they would.. this factory representative may be the one that bought the genuine for the factory

What amazes me is VERY VERY FEW MEMBERS SEE that the dealers are not the ultimate power here.. they are more like factory reps.

The MAKERS (factories) HOLD THE POWER .. they tell the dealers how many have to be sold if they replicate a genuine..

You are giving way too much credit to the dealers .... and not enough to the makers ....

This was all side bars and not about J&A .. but think of GZ as you would Detroit and the dealers as you would your local Chevy or Ford dealerships...

The factory - Makers are the modern WarLords fo China .. not the dealers,.....the dealers are the conduit from the makers..

Lanikai, I am disappointed in you. Did you even attempt to read the posts before you posted this garbage?

Let me spell it out for you: Andrew has been banned from RWI. Do you know why? It's for the very reasons I have stated. He was strong arming dealers on these forums to raise their prices to a level he found acceptable. If they didn't, he would stop them from getting access to watches. I didn't make this stuff up. This is what he did. I was merely explaining it to people in my own words.

Next time, before you start throwing insults, the number of posts you have, and Saturn dealerships, try increasing your reading comprehension.

Real ETA movements in a stainless steel watertight case with genuine saphire for $3?

Actually yes, all that for $3. The watch business is a cash cow. Watches, except for the hand made ones requiring high levels of skill, are very cheap to make. Despite all the marketing hoopla, they are noting more than mass-produced trinkets. Even the glorified ETA movements are mass-produced. You have to ask yourself: "How does Rolex, Breitling, et al. afford all those million dollar television commercials and full page advertisements?" It's smoke and mirrors.

How does a factory not supply certain dealers? I'll tell you.

The amount of money the dealers are making off these forums is incredible. These forums make up a huge percentage of their sales. Andrew, being the biggest seller, has the clout to make special deals with the manufacturers.

He says to them: in return for blocking certain dealers who don't play by my rules, I will give you a bigger cut of my profits, or I will buy wathces from you at a higher price. Of course, they agree. This causes other dealers to set their prices to what Andrew demans, therefore, causing prices on the rep forums to go through the roof. The point isn't to ban all buyers in china, the point is to control the few that are called "trusted dealers" on the rep watch forum, which number about ten. Since we don't buy from those outside the "trusted dealer" network, the prices become artificially high for all of us.

In other words, he is screwing all of us behind our backs.

The amount of money the dealers are making off this and other boards is staggering.

According to a friend of mine who worked for a Citizen watch distributor, the wholesale price of a Citizen Nighthawk is about $15 to $20. This watch often sells in stores for $450. This is an amazing profit margin despite the costs of marketing, quality control, and warranties.

The cost of making a fake in China is much cheaper than the cost of making a Citizen watch. They don't do QC, they don't do marketing, they don't have customer support, they don't use quality materials. It must cost them $3 at the most, yet they often sell for over $400.

The time has come for we as a community to begin demanding more from our dealers. The days of simply getting a watch in the mail and then calling the dealer "a good guy" are over. If dealers are going to charge $400 for a watch, they should manually inspect it and deliver the ultimate in customer service. Remember, we are providing them with a wage that few in China can even imagine having. They should be bending over backwards to get our business.

I think this could have been avoided with an addition to this forum allowing reviews of dealers to be made without others attacking the reviewer. For example, the review thread could be locked, allowing only the dealer, administrators, and reviewer to respond. There is a natural tendency for members to defend dealers that they use from bad reviews, and in the process, skew reviews or silence those that would post negative reviews.

P4GTR, I want to apologize for my comment. You are right, I did make assumptions that are insulting. Again, my apologies, and I hope Admin can come up with a suitable solution for your and other members' needs.

client9

There is nothing wrong with disagreement, it's how you handle it that counts.

Good riddance! I've said it before and I will say it again: Andrew, the sleazy watch guy.

This is a non-issue. If you don't want your coworkers knowing which websites you visit, don't visit them while at work.

And as was stated earlier, the header makes no difference because IT knows your internet usage in elaborate detail -- the websites you visit, at what time, and for how long.

In addition, a low-fi version is already a part of the forum, accessible at the bottom of the web page.

Further, wearing reps isn't supposed to be a cloak and dagger affair. Don't boast about it, but when people ask you, be honest and forthright. You will soon realize that people don't care about what you wear.

There is a joke that cuts to the heart of this issue:

I like the look of this forum -- it's professional looking.

As for having "replica watch" at the top of the site, I don't care. If i am going to be wearing a fake watch on my wrist all day, why should I care if people see me browsing a fake watch website? I think some people are taking this hobby too seriously.

The positive side of the credit crunch for me here in CA is the price of homes coming down. Just a few years ago, houses the size of a tuna can were going for one million dollars. They have already dropped to about $800,000. In two more years I can see them going for $500,000 -- a 50% discount!

I've abandoned gens altogether and won't be going back for awhile. I want variety and striking designs all at a low cost. Reps fit the bill perfectly. Also the community for reps is a lot more fun and interesting than for gens. TZ and WUS put me to sleep with all their petty arguments and pomposity.

Lanikai, thanks for the info.

The package didn't look like it had been previously opened when I received it -- the thief had done an excellent job. I can imagine this package passing through customs without arousing any suspicion. See the photo below. This was taken after I had realized the watch was stolen. Notice the clean line across the top that the crook made.

One last thing: Thank you, Eurotimez, for going above and beyond what was required of you. You are great.

Eurotimez, it's likely that the watch was stolen in Thailand, not in the US. If the chances of goods being stolen in your country are high, I suggest Registered Airmail stop being offered and EMS be used exclusively. Forcing a customer to take a gamble on whether or not they will ever receive a watch does not fit with your overall fantastic customer service.

Fakemaster, trying to get a good price is not the same thing as lying to someone and stealing their money.

I suggest we start taxing the members of this board to help start a relief fund for our poor overworked dealers so that they can continue to sell us watches for over $400. I'd hate to see prices go down.

Fakemaster, why do you think scamming people on eBay is an OK thing to do?