rmcsherry

Waaaaaaaaaayyyyyyyyyy too big! And a P.2002 movement? That's not an Egiziano. Pah.

Silix has some good 3646's for around $100 - you could then send it to be modded, or have a go yourself!

That would be great - I noticed that Ofrei stock them as part of TZ watch school, but they aren't bevelled - I know there are different levels of decoration with the 'Mecaline Sp

Does anybody have a source for 6497 bevelled ratchet / crown wheels? Cousins don't seem to stock them, and I'm only after one set!

What parts are you looking for? Stems, springs and balance staffs are all easy enough - but more than that, and you are usually looking at a donor movement. Some of the keyless works are interchangable with a Molnija 3602, BTW.

Lets just wait and see what DSN comes up with over the next few months

There is no such thing as 'a dimension' for this case - the dimensions, curvatures etc. are very complex and would require a CAD model to accurately show what you are looking for. I try to be helpful wherever possible, but frankly, it feels like you're trying to pick an arguement for no reason. I'd help if I could, and would also love to know the exact specs of a 3646!

If you read the post, it's clear that there are different types of 3646 all with different measurements. If I had a genuine 3646 sitting in front of me, I'd give you the measurements (which would probably be unique to that particular model) - but I doubt anyone does, so please don't suggest that we are in some way hiding information or being secretive.

I think that sounds like a great idea, T - my concern with the Angelus project is making 500 sets of hands - I'd imagine there is demand for 50-100, but I don't want to see a repeat of the T60's. Count me in for 2 or 3 sets of Cortebert hands, though!

Not sure about the second hand - it's smaller than a Unitas I believe. I've got a few spare forth wheels with second pinion - all of them measure 0.21mm across the pinion (two are bestfit replacements, one is directly from an Angelus movement - so I guess this measurement is correct). I'm not sure what allowance you need for the tube - I'm guessing 0.01-0.05mm would be enough?

Tourby, The curved hands do appear on some base models - we can only assume that the movement was in fact an Angelus (as the hands appear to be from an Angelus)... Personally, I think the curved hands look great - there are so many variations, that historical accuracy becomes less of an issue and personal preference takes over!

I know how to mod a normal CG pin, but what do you do with the pin on an 'upside down CG' from a Ti 036? Finding a good replacment CG is tricky, and as the pin won't push through to be flush with the surface, would I have to fabricate a new Ti pin?

My dials fit if that's what you mean! I'm looking into another run, but would probably create only a few Angelus dials and the rest Cortebert (unless there is still a huge demand for Angelus dials?). These would ideally avoid any trademarks - so plain, MM or fictional dials (like the Gruppo Gamma one).

Tourby, Some of the watches do have curved hour / flat minute hands - however, curved minute hands do exist and look much better with the curved hour hands! If you look at my carded hands, the 4 sets on the left have curved minute hands, and the 2 sets on the right are both flat. I can send you a set with the curved hour / minute for reference for this project if required. Curved hands did exist in base dials - but the movement used for these watches (Rolex or Angelus) remains a mystery!

$550 you say? I think your idea is great, Tourby - keep homages as just that, and go for style! The curved hands will be brilliant - rose gold looks much more refined. I think the second hand would be great with the tail - you can always remove it, but can't add it back on! As for dial thickness - unless you machine the case / install the dial into the bezel or some other 'trick', you're stuck with a maximum of about 0.8mm anyway (for an Angelus in Fiddy case). I could buy a bergeon hand sizer if you need exact dimensions - unless anybody else has access to accurate measuring equipment and a set of curved hands?

Here's a range of images for discussion. Some of these are the same, but it highlights the number of variants (particularly on the Angelus based watches). I'd agree with Stephan that the flat hands on an Angelus appear to be more common (perhaps they were standard, and the curved clock hands were replacements?). The pointed Angelus hands come with some clocks, as do the dagger hands - so whilst these are ok, I'd assume they are replacements that aren't worth copying (although I have all types if you are interested!). My personal preference is for the flat hands with the short hour hand (#9) from an aesthetic perspective. The curved hands are amazing though, but I suspect would be many times more expensive than the flat hands - however, I'm sure you can advise on this point, T! I think the flat hands were yellow gold, and the curved came in yellow or rose gold (or blued). From what I've seen, the flat hands were far more common than the curved hands - on 6152, GPF2/56 and on 3646 models. The second hand comes with and without a tail - I'd suggest making the second hand with a tail would be better, as individuals can trim the tail off if they decide (allowing for more options!). We all know that the 4th wheel pinion is flush to the main plate on the Angelus, so the tube length should reflect this + dial thickness + standoff. The Cortebert hands seem to be 3 main types: gold with short point, gold with long point, or blued steel with a cross piece on the hour hand. The gold long point *seems* to be more common (fitting a 6152, 6154 and 3646, rather than just the 3646). I believe this to be yellow gold rather than rose (more likely brass with radium paint). The images above are not an exhaustive list, and some a duplicates - but hopefully will provoke discussion, and allow us to focus on the particular styles.

I think the physical dimensions are very close - however, the problem you'll face is with the winding stem (the Molnija one is different, so the pocket watch one will need to be resized and probably tapped) and hour wheel (the hour wheel is fairly short on most 3602's, so you'll struggle to fit it if the dial is too thick).

The Angelus curved design would be useful to a lot of members here - the longer flat hands could work out cheaper to make (and the hands would be transferrable to a certain contemporary model or two!). I can buy a hand sizer from Cousins UK and get the tube / length dimensions if you need them - although if you've still got some original hands kicking around, it's probably as good to take them straight to the manufacturer. I've also got some of the original long hands if you would like me to dimension / create a CAD file of them for you. As for the cortebert - no real preferences. The gold baton hands for a 6152 are fairly easy to get hold of for a Unitas (and are easy to resize), so would the cali style hands be a better option? Flame blued to an almost black colour would be awesome to see - beats any paint hands down! C3 lume would be good for contemporaries, but for a vintage, you might find that a less intense glow is better. There are plenty of white / cream lumes (bergeon make one) that have less glow, and can be 'vintagised' to each individuals requirements. Alternatively, RC Tritec do an 'Old Radiomir' lume, which was supposedly colour matched to - you guessed it - an old Radiomir. The colour is suprisingly close to Pigeon s**t - the colour is horrible on most dials, but I've found that it is quite good on the hands. Whatever you choose to do, this is a great project and thanks for bringing it to us.

Stunning. The movement mods are great - something I've been considering for a while, but haven't yet acheived! Well done - this is the first Angelus 3646 homage I think I've seen!

Kev's project is awesome. I've got a WM3646 repped from the picture above, and whilst the case is ok from the outside, it's completely different in terms of construction. The new project will be awesome - correct construction, welded lug / crown tube, engraved Brevet crown, decent dials, custom blued-steel hands - the works! Can't wait to see it in person. If you don't mind me asking, why do you need all of this info on the Rad's?

Looks great, glad it worked! The lume looks very nice, and the dial colour really works well in this combo. Once I've worked out the best way to thin out the text, I'll let you know! Merry Christmas.

Sorry to be blunt, but if anybody knows the exact dimensions of an original Rad, they're not going to be sharing it with a new user in the public area of a forum! The case was approx. 47mm, made with internally threaded bezel and caseback, and brass threaded movement ring inside - the bezel / caseback 'clamp' the dial / movement in position. These are some old photos of a genuine Radiomir - there are newer images of the P'sti project that Kai references which I have, but I can't find them and don't have permission to reproduce the image anyway!

M, Sounds great - the acetate is a great idea. I've been practicing with the resin filling as well - have a few interesting ideas, but no perfect results yet! The dial thickness is great for Angelus projects (less case work required!), but not 100% historically accurate - although spacing the top and bottom dials gives more depth like the vintage Panerai's anyway! Merry Christmas, and hopefully see you in the New Year!