Jetsons

Our friends have usually been blown away by my reps, specifically the 1665 MBW and the 2893-2 Pams, 029 & 063. They could not believe these guys were not the real deal. A couple of weeks ago I handed two buddies four of my watches to examine namely, TW Classic Sub w/spring bar mod, MBW white letter 1665 with OEM parts, Pam 029 w/Camille Fournet strap & gen vintage Tudor Submariner w/ OEM folded oyster bracelet. They asked me if they were reps or gens. My response, you tell me. Both believed all were gens with the exception of the Tudor. which was viewed as too darn light to be a gen. I didn't say a word, smiled and returned the toys to their watch box. Outside of members of these forums and some WIS, folks really do not have a clue regardless if they own quality gens or not. It's okay to relax when wearing out top quaity toys. Jet

Very helpful post! Thanks! I would have loved to have had this info before I started on this path. I mentioned in my much briefer tutorial that these 316L cases were very tough and that one needed to take their time. This can take far more effort & patience than one would initially believe. It also took me a good while to drill the SEL bracelet of the TW Sub and smooth all the surfaces so all would fit. I agree that bracelets are not an easy mod and it is not usually mentioned. I used a small round grinding stone and wire brush with the dremel and the combination that worked nicely but that took well over an hour. Good thing that you mentioned the part about the bracelet spinning out of control on the hand. That can be a very dangerous situation. I locked it with hefty vice grips (teeth very well covered with electrical tape) and that worked well. I haven't tried drlling the non SEL endlinks just yet but that looks like a PIA and very easy to destroy. Drill bits, I used four Cobalt on a single case of two different sizes. I recently ordered another 8 for whenever I get the urge to this again, which will not be next week. I haven't worked myself up to working on my MBWs just yet. Next time, I will do this far differently. I may stick with the dremel (using different size bits as I did before) but will use a drill stand and vice to hold the case and bracelet. I hope all is fine with your MBW. Jet

Pugwash, your Nato. Something else to put on my shopping list. BTW, where is Bytor? I hope he's okay and having a great time. Poor man's 1680:

Here are a couple of posts of how I removed the bezel & insert of the TW Sub classic which may be of help: http://www.rwg.cc/members/index.php?showto...780entry41780 & http://www.rwg.cc/members/index.php?showtopic=3024&hl= The bezel may have a bunch of dirt underneath which is what I found on my TW Sub. Once all the parts are cleaned, the bezel will rotate very nicely. I also modded the side case holes & bracelet of my TW Sub & posted a description of the process @ http://www.rwg.cc/members/index.php?showtopic=3520&hl= Hope this helps out a bit. For the insert which you asked about in another post, it is easiest to purchase an insert with a decent pearl and use the pearl on the TW insert. Very easy to do as it just attatched with glue. Jet

WW, you can easily smooth out the edges of the hollow mid link bracelet. Apply metal polish with a cotton cloth and apply pressure as necessary. If you have a dremel tool, apply the polish with a cotton wheel and the process is a breeze. Oil and clean the bracelet and it will be silky smooth. The difference is night and day. There are several topics on this subject which should be easy to find with the search feature. Jet

Once you install the OEM T-39 (specially the superdome), the MBW will look as mighty as the gen. The super thick and tall OEM crystals make a big difference on the 1665s. Beautiful watch & excellent work, Tribal. Glad to hear that your enjoying what I believe is your first MBW 1665. They are by far my favorite clones. The white letter is on my wrist as I type. Regards, Jet

Randy, you have the honors of having completed the most fantastic project I have ever seen on thse forums. Amazing work and most importantly, perseverance. I'm not sure what you can possibly come up with to top this one but I'm sure you'll think of something. Many congratulations on a fantastic watch. You deserve it. Two thumbs up, way up to Chris for helping you complete your dream watch. Enjoy! Jet

I would stick the classic which is a clone of the older Sub case with the side case holes. I have this piece and its a terrific & very solid watch. The date mag is spot on (2.5X) with correct cyclops placement, deep inner ring, thick crystal as the gen plus I prefer the solid mid link bracelet (also have the hollow). Newer does not necessarily mean better. Jet

The Snap-On cobalt bits must be darn good. I drilled the lug holes of my TW Sub at 5,000 RPM (slowest setting on my Proxon dremel)) and none of the bits melted or worse, snapped. Jet

Thanks, mikellem! That's an excellent deal @ 70% off and the blemishes seem to be negligible. Cheers, Jet

Chris, I used a dremel and cobalt bits. I held the watch firm but free hand and allowed the bit to follow the case holes. I did not have the bits break using this technique. BTW, these bits get dull so I suggest installing a new for every 2 holes. What I did that I haven't seen mentioned, is use a smaller size bit to get things started and the 1.2mm to finsih. You need to lubricate the holes & bit often to keep things from getting too hot. I agree with the comment that a low speed drill with torque would be much better than a dremel. The high speed of the dremel generates excessive heat & places a heck of a lot of stress on the bits. Jet

Let's try this: Still voting for insert 2 with pearl #1.

The font on #2 is the most accurate to me. I also prefer the pearl on #1. My vote would be for a mix of the two but would take #2 if that was the only option. Here is the gen for comparison:

cib, why age a gen dial? As I recall, that was one near perfect dial which is not an easy find. The bigger question is are you up to cropping the dial feet? I would have a very difficult time altering such a rare and near perfect dial. Gen movement in the works? Jet

Excellent tutorial and photos, Kuba! Very, very well done and easy to follow. I've seen a ton of great leather on Ebay go for peanuts. This could be a great new project to explore. Thanks for sharing. Jet

Usil, very glad to hear thet you and your wife are okay. That is what is important as all else can be replaced over time. I've been vandalized and held at gun point so I know the feeling. I did try to get the bastards after the ordeal but the police couldn't do a heck of a lot as my stuff wasn't maked in some way that it could be proven to be mine. That was a biggest crock I have ever heard and what blew my lid the most. Wearing these high caliber clones will most certainly attract unwanted atttention. There are many times when I and my wife will wear cheapies for this reason. It not worth it to risk injury or worse over a watch or anything else material. Jet

That's the reason I'm not contemplating this mod for the time being, tempting as it is. I can see dollars flying out my wallet. It is a good idea fo the 1685 as the cyclops magnifies the rep date wheel. Less of an issue issue IMO with the 1665 specially with the T-39 superdome installed which distorts the heck out of everything. Jet

I'm not sure what the differences are between the MBW and TW classic 16610. They use the same case, dial, solid mid link bracelet, bezel assembly and of course, movement. I have the TW and seen many photos of the MBW. The MBW probably has better quality control but I have never had any issues with my TW. It's a very solid & quality piece. Perhaps someday, the manufacturer with opt for a more accurate dial with a centered "Swiss Made". HighDef, River carried the classic TW best models in the past and perhaps still does. Eddie has them and it remains his favorite Sub. Jet

Hi, Tribal: I'm familiar with that website. This chaps runs a censored forum. I posted there once pointing out the high prices he charges and my post was deleted. I suspect the 16610 is a TW Best which we can get from our trusted dealers for around $260. I seriously doubt it's the MBW which is very close to the TW Best down to the off center "Swiss Made". His year 2004 Y serial SD is also the TW. Regards, Jet

Very well done, Chris! It took me a long time to learn at the old RWG the information you have thoughtfully summarized. Darn lucky newbies. I'll just add that an additional difference between the modern and vintage Rollie sport models are the beautiful matte dials of the latter. IMO, beats the heck out of the modern dials with the appllied markers. Cheers, Jet

The SD Angus has looks quite good in this department. There was a nice review of in the old RWG. Doesn't look to have the massive case of the TW but that one unfortunately has the incorrect HE valve. http://s16.photobucket.com/albums/b14/pure...LEX/SEADWELLER/ Added: I second Ubi's suggestion which I mentioned to you via PM. Jet

Thank you for the kind and generous offer, veni! I very much appreciate it. Jet

Thanks for the info, Veni! I was just surprised that a made in Italy supposedly decent quality Ostrisch strap would fall apart like this in such a short period of time. This may also apply to the shark as it is in a similar price range. I have owned many leather and exotic straps (various price ranges) used on a daily basis and all held up rather well even though not exactly well cared for. It seems that the Vertigo may be the way to go but I am disappointed. Jet

V, how well does the dye (color) hold up on the Vertigo? I ask as I have a couple of Bob ostrisch straps and the dye on my wife's orange that has been used for less than 2 months has come off significantly. The strap looks like its been used for 5 years, by me. No showers or swimming. Just daily regular wear by someone that's very easy on watches. Thanks! Jet

Excellent work and tutorai, Bignasty. Terrific step by step photos as well. You make it look easy. Now, that's a watch! Cheers, Jet