Bignasty

LOL

OH MY GOD! The Zigmeister's posted! Yeppie! Hope this is a sign of more to come! Cheers and enjoy your time off! Jon

Remember for them to manufacture one they might as well manufacture 1000 because to create one they have to re-tool their factories! This is big business this is why Andrew has previously stated that the first run of a new rep is never profitable. The factories are attempting to recover their expenses on this run. So if they create the rep and it isn't successful they might not retool again for the same rep but might just move on to something else. Then all those that wanted the rep but passed on it are losers! I've also heard from another reputable dealer here that if and when the 194 comes out he will not be buying them on the first run because many people scream for the Ti reps but then when they are released they don't buy them! Cheers, Jon

OK Heres my quick 2 cents regarding 7750 movements! Asian 7750 or 7750a/b = Bad: No luck with these failure rate for me 100% (3 of 3 failed or had major issues) New Asian 7750b1 = Good: Knock on wood for saying this but seems to function properly (2 for 2 so far) ETA 7750 = Absolutely great! Would recommend to anyone! Now heres a bit more information. Many reps that came with the 7750a/b are being re-released with the new 7750b1 but there are signs this has happened. For instance I received the 7750a/b in my Navitimer Serie Speciale just a few months ago. Last month another member received the 7750b1 in his but it has a new dial. Also to note the 7750a/b movements use the EXACT same hand sizes as the ETA 7750. The new 7750b1 movement hands will not fit on the ETA 7750! The center seconds (chronograph seconds) will not fit on the ETA movement. The ETA pinion is too small. So if you buy this rep and plan on swapping to Swiss you will have to either source a new second hand or have the Asian Pinion installed in the ETA movement! There it is my 2 cents regarding these movements! Cheers, Jon

I just remember in my rural area back 8 or 10 years ago the only place to find reps was nothing short of visiting Canal St NYC on vacation. Well that and for awhile you could buy decent stuff on Yahoo's Auction site. Ebay was quick to ban them from their site because of pressure from the powers that be. I abandoned the hobby for awhile then hooked up with a couple of "amateur" dealers in China via the web. Still the quality of merchandise vs. the price was just not up to par. Still it was good to get back into the swing of things. Then last summer I visited NYC on business. So I took a day trip down to Canal and Mott streets. It was amazing how much things had changed since my last visit. Now the reps seem to be worse than they were before and very difficult to find. Now everything is done behind closed doors. 10 years ago thats all you saw right on the sidewalks. They were being sold openly with no worries. Now they take you into secret rooms and call on their Nextel phones to find you something if that one dealer doesn't have itin stock. After asking and viewing quite a few of the worst reps I've ever seen I was ready to give up. Finally a guy got me the rep I wanted. It had sapphire, a good dial, good case, and a good looking band. So I bargained, bought it, and happily went on my way. That was the last rep I bought until I stumbled across these forums a few months ago. Now lets just say, I'm back in the hobby and once again hooked! I am now amazed by the quality vs. price available here. Its also great to be able to discuss these different watches with other membes. Now I've also learned to mod and work on some of this stuff which has opened a whole new door for me. Because for me when you buy reps you just want to keep on buying them. Now I can buy a few, work on them for a while, then buy more when they are completed. It adds a bit more fun to the whole deal and slows down the drain on my wallet! I'm just really concerned that some of us may be a little too spoiled. Just hope that we all remember you don't miss what you have until its gone! Cheers, Jon

LOL you see what you guys have done? Demand new models but don't buy them when they come out because of "flaws". Seems like a win win for the buyer and a lose lose for the dealer! Jon

The screws come out on these reps often. I mean the Seawolf SS & Ti, Chrono Avenger Ti, and I guess now the Super Avenger reps. Easiest and best remedy is to apply Loctite to each individual screw before strapping it on! Same goes for all PAM reps as well as many others with screws! Cheers, Jon

Neil, I agree 100% on the Super Avenger being more of an 'instrument' than the Bentley models. Both are very nice watches in fact there aren't many Breitlings that I would turn my nose up at! Cheers, Jon

Quarks, PM sent regarding the SS Seawolf. I've got one I don't ever wear if you are interested! Cheers, Jon

You could do it if you had the patience! You could also use a dremel to do much of the work. The rep would still have flaws but would be much more accurate if polished. There has never been a brushed Super Avenger. Great watch though. Very big like th new Breitling for Bentley 49mm in my Avatar but it is sportier! Cheers, Jon

Here is the Gen Super Avenger I sold a few months ago. Great watch, super heavy, and very tough! The new version Josh offers is much better considering his previous version was a quartz model. Looks like the same case, bracelet, bezel, and all just an improved movement. This rep could be made much more accurate simply by polishing it up with a Cape Cod Cloth! Cheers, Jon

Great read here regarding some differences between 316L and 904 stainless. http://www.rolexreferencepage.com/smpvssub.html 904 resists scratches better so the bracelet/case looks less worn over time. Cheers, Jon

Amazing collection! The display is breath taking. Really is like looking into a display at an AD! Why is it that PAM's look cooler in large groups? LOL Cheers and keep posting as the collection grows! Jon

It’s interesting where this thread has gone in the last 24 hours. This is the way I see it. I've had issues with a few of our dealers, Andrew included. But these issues have always been resolved! And through these experiences I have learned that its part of the process. These are reps and were paying a fraction of the price to buy a SIMILAR product but it is by no means its genuine counter part. Heres a little story. One of my first purchases from Andrew was for a couple of PO's. I didn't realize at the time that some dealers call glass crystals "synthetic sapphire" which I now know is not really "synthetic sapphire" but simply mineral glass. So please no one reply to my post explaining the properties of sapphire and corundum and mineral glass and so on and so forth as, I ALREADY KNOW! These descriptions are some what hard to understand but once you know you know! But anyway. One of my co-workers is a big Omega fan. He wanted me to get him a rep after I stumbled across this place and its dealers. I'd already ordered a few reps from Andrew so I contacted him again about getting a couple of POs. One for myself and the other for my friend. Andrew explained that they would have to be 3rd gens unless I wanted to wait for the 4ths that he had on order. Well I agreed to the 3rd gens because I didn't do my research to realize what I was getting myself into. So I get the watches. The casebacks were wrong, the bracelets looked pretty bad, and the crystal had no AR. But I only paid around a $100 a piece for them. So me and my co-worker both wore them while working on cars. Then a few days later I realized that the watches didn't in fact have sapphire glass but mineral as they had easily scratched. I immediately contacted Andrew about this situation. He explained that "synthetic sapphire" in his descriptions meant mineral glass. I went back and read all of his sales threads and realized that there were reps sold as "synthetic sapphire" and some that were sold as "sapphire". OK so now I understand! But Andrew being the nice guy that he is agreed to sell me replacement 4th Gens a deep discount to compensate for the previously purchased 3rd Gen models. Of course he had no use for used and scratched 3rd gens and I didn't want to just loose my money on them so we worked a deal that made both parties happy. I was then able to recover the difference I might have lost through these boards by selling the 3rd Gens for basically half what I had paid for them. So someone got a good deal on a used watch, I got my 4th gen which was much better quality, and Andrew got his sales and kept another happy customer. Whats my point? Well I think it should be obvious, the customer service provided by Andrew was great and respectful! I think its great that our dealers are willing to make us happy. I've had similar situations with Ed were he was quick to offer a solution no questions asked! I'm sure that because we have a forum to analyze and discuss these reps down to the least little imperfection we are probably some of the hardest clientele to keep happy. This is something that we often overlook. I don't know the percentages but I would imagine our combined purchases are merely a fraction of the sales most of our dealers make. Paul for one has shown that prices can be deeply cut when selling in large numbers. I've seen the pics of some of Paul’s larger sales. We're talking 50+ watches in one order. That’s more than I could order in a year or two! So why should we [censored] off our dealers by criticizing them for attempting to push up sales? Thats their job isn't it? You don't go to work every day to not work do you? You don't set goals for your self and not strive to obtain them do you? So if a dealer buys X number of a new rep to try and sale and make back his money don't you think its upsetting when the items don't sell? I'm not trying to say thats our fault its just the nature of the beast. Many ideas in business fail while others are great successes. You win some and you lose some. The same goes for us as buyers. If I buy a 1st gen rep and realize that the markers might fall off its just part of the game! I could have bought a watchhonpo 187 a long time ago and the markers might not have fallen off but I still would have gotten what I consider to be a junk movement for double the price I paid for the current version 187. So you got it I won one and I lost one. But in my eyes I still won because guess what, the freaking movement will still be working in a few months! After all it is a rep timepiece, the least I could ask for is a watch that actually keeps good time, right? I for one don't see the problem with holding out for purchase of certain reps because another generation may be improved. I will not buy a quartz rep of a watch that is supposed to have an automatic movement. Sorry I just can't bring myself to do it. I just hate quartz watches. I mean they are the reason that the Swiss watch industry nearly crumbled back many years ago. I refuse to buy them even as beaters, thats just my attitude towards them. So regarding the new PO Chrono that someone brought up it just doesn't float my boat! I'm not going to criticize it and stop others from buying it. I'm not going to analyze its every flaw! I think its great that new models like these come out and hope (and cross my fingers) that it is a sign of better reps to come. But don't forget that the newer model will most certainly be much more expensive. Regardless if I pass on the $150 PO quartz Chrono model I might get an opportunity to buy a 7750 model if and when it comes out. But if and when it does it will surely start out at around $400. So have I won or have I lost? In my eyes again I have won because I don't like quartz. If I were desperate to own a PO Chrono one could consider it to be a loss, since they could have had a more accurate time keeping piece for a fraction of that $400. And to top it all off a few months later that initial price will come down to probably $250 mark as other dealers buy in. Then will I be upset that I didn't save that $150? ABSOLUTELY NOT! Its part of the process. Same goes for almost anything. I could go out today and buy an HD DVD player to go along with my HD DLP television. The DVD player will cost me $1000 and there are only a few titles to choose from. Next year the same player will cost me half that and there will be 10 times more movies to choose from. So should I be [censored] that I didn't wait? No because I am a grown man I made the decision to buy it when I thought best! So the only person you can blame for buying an "imperfect" generation rep is yourself. Make an educated decision on weither or not to buy and stick with it. Its all a gamble, after all the better generation may never arrive as we have seen with a few reps, the SMPs are one! So to further elaborate a few of you have commented on the new Tag Link Chrono reps, the new 187, and the Breitlings. I have purchased all, and I bought them all at somewhat of a premium price. Well I'll say it like this. The Tag Link Chrono is FREAKING AMAZING! The quality brilliant! I don't think there could be a better generation! The 187, well don't wont to sound repetitive but its also ABSOLUTELY AMAZING! I also don't think there will be any improvements except maybe adding AR to the crystal which I could have done now if I were that picky. And lastly the Breitling Bentleys, yes once again they are INCREDIBLE! And yes I don't think there will be another generation as there is little room for improvement in my eyes! I contacted Andrew shortly after seeing these Breitling reps to see if he had spoken with his suppliers during a recent trip to China. I inquired about the possibility of a 7750 powered Chronomat rep. His response was something like this (intentionally placed in loose quotations!). 'You guys are too greedy... these Breitlings are hard to make.... you should be happy with the new ones being offered.' I didn't inquire because I was complaining about the models made but merely hoped that with the new correct bracelet that maybe, just maybe a Chronomat might also be around the corner. So as for Andrews response, should I have taken offense? Absolutely not! I now know where he was coming from. We absolutely should be happy with the new offerings that have been brought to the table. I for one think they are amazing reps! Some of the best I've seen. I just didn't realize how passionate he was about this and honestly think he took my question the wrong way. He took it as a complaint or an insult to a product of which he was very proud. For that Andrew I apologize! So whats my point again? A rep is and always will be a rep! Buy what you like! Don't criticize the dealers for wanting to sell their product! Thats their job and their livelihood. Some models will fly and some will fail! If a model is successful but has its flaws there will likely be updated versions. If the demand is there, which we have to remember not just what we demand as a small sector in the market, the factories will produce. Bottom line is this and I will finish up. If you get to know your dealer they will take care of you. Just remember they are people with needs. They also have priorities other than these forums and you. You can't ask for the world without considering its cost! Nothing in this world is free! Dealers want to sell you their product because that is the profession they chose! They will satisfy your needs if you are worthy of their help. But they owe complainers and critics nothing! If you nag and complain about every little thing they are eventually going to tell you to kick rocks. If we don't appreciate the dealers that serve us and our hobby then they will stop serving us! Were would we be if we didn't have them and their excellent but sometimes flawed product? We would be limited to those purchases at yard sales, swap meets, auctions, and shady websites that promise Swiss reps and primo prices! And don't forget the occasional trips to Canal St because those are some great reps (sarcasm sensed hopefully!)! I FOR ONE DON'T WANT TO TAKE OUR HOBBY BACK INTO THE DARK AGES SO THANKS TO ALL OF OUR DEALERS FOR TAKING THE RISKS THEY TAKE TO DO WHAT THEY DO AND GETTING US THE PRODUCT THAT WE WANT! Sorry for the long winded post but I for one think our dealers try very hard to get us what we want and provide great customer service almost all of the time. I also think that we often times get a little too critical and forget that they are also just people trying to make a living! Cheers, Jon

Thanks for joining in on the threads! We appreciate everything all of our dealers do for us! I think it is sometimes hard to remember that these are reps because you guys keep offering such great new pieces! Cheers, Jon

Caught this fishing around the Bay. Dial looks off. Markers are wrong. Also outside of bracelet is polished. Seller with pictures of only the dial close up and none of caseback or clasp. Just looks odd correct me if I am wrong. Someone might get ripped on this one as the price is already over $1500. Jon http://cgi.ebay.com/Rolex-Submariner-16610...1QQcmdZViewItem

So I've had this case laying around for awhile. It came in a "homage" watch a couple of years ago that as since long been picked apart for experimentation purposes. Odly enough its signed between the lugs w/ Rollie models and serials. So my plan is to make this bad boy a project watch that I've already begun work on. I've got big plans for this and I hope it becomes a lot of fun! So heres the plan so far! Non-etched Sapphire Gen Tube and Crown Gen Springbars - on order New Dial and Hands ETA 2836 w/ Correct Datewheel (which I have on hand ) Non SEL Bracelet as the Serial I guesstimate to be from early to Mid 90s So I've also got a 1680 project watch that I'm awaiting springbars for. Once they arrive I'll uncase the movement to do the work. At that time I'm going to mod the CG's to be like the original. This is a new mod for me so I decided to play with the case for this project sub first! Well lets say I'm pleased with the outcome of my first try! Comments are appreciated! More to come soon! Also if anyone has advice on any of the parts listed above please share your knowledge! Cheers, Jon

So I wonder what the water resistance is on this rep? I've not submerged mine yet, I've always been scared to submerge chronos! My 187 has now had a bath or two but the pushers are screwed down at all times. Jon

Looks cool. Did you re-install the case back and crown into the case before submerging in water? Just wondering if the watch flooded or if you left out parts that allowed it to flood? Looks cool though! Might also consider this on my CA rep. Cheers, Jon

I've posted on this issue before and my dealer attempted to resolve for me. Since that time I've ordered new hands and a dial from Davidsen to get better lume! What can I say? Contact your dealer first. If that doesn't work out thankfully we have Davidsen around! Cheers, Jon

Thats cool the guy at the AD was a nice guy and actually asked why you would want to buy a gen . Congrats on the watch! Is it your first gen? It is a lot of cash to shell out but at least with a Rollie it will hold its value and you can practically wear it for free! Cheers, Jon

Great post! Did the Gen Hands fit perfectly w/ the ETA movement? Thanks, Jon

Seems to me it would be easier to do it with a belt sander than a dremel. First and foremost you need the right tool for the job! Also agree the lug holes could prove to be problem. Also consider that the case slopes downward at the bracelet, so removing and widening this area will make the case height higher at the bracelet. Keep us posted I'm very interested to see the results! Cheers, Jon

seems to me it would be easier to do it with a belt sander than a dremel. First and foremost you need the right tool for the job! Jon

To me unless you are a lawyer or wealthy business professional YM's all scream FAKE! Sorry its just the reality of owning a watch this expensive! My advice look at the pictures and buy based on what you see! If you like what you see then buy, if you don't like what you see then don't buy! Never had Andrew refuse to correct any issues. You might have to send a watch back but thats understandable. You don't get a replacement for defective products with out some proof. Its unavoidable when products are drop shipped, get used to it from pretty much any dealer! Remember to build a relationship with your dealer. Once they know you they will know your words are true and things operate much more smoothly! If the price is too high, buy from someone else! No one is making you deal with him! Already handled by another member! Cheers, Jon