bjl3910

congrats, very nice watch! I have one question: on the rotor is engraved "meisterstuck" or "meisterst

Thank you all for the kind words. I appreciate it. I have to admit that I was a little apprehensive about posting a review, given the short time that I've been on the forum. Your comments are helpful and appreciated.

Here are a few more pictures I was able to take this afternoon. I hope they give you a better feel for the watches finish and dimensions. I know my photography skills leave something to be desired, and I am working on that. Enjoy...

I was looking around the other day and came across this watch. I was actually looking for some good pics of the Black, all ceramic Hublot Big Bang King when I came across these Wyler watches. I found a few little threads on the forums. I was just wondering if anyone knew if they were making reps of these yet. I may hold off on getting a Big Bang if I can possibly get my hands on a Wyler. This thing is sick. And I read a little about them...they have a suspension system to help protect the case and movement. Pretty cool stuff. The company, Wyler, even dropped one of their watches off the Eiffel Tower...and it lived!!!! I also saw a version of their GMT that had a gold case, black dial, and a brown croc. Strap. It looked awesome. So if anyone knows something about Wyler, please let me know. Thanks!!!

I really like these and the only reps I've seen are on Watch Eden...and they are nothing to write home to mom about. From what I understand Wyler is a fairly new brand so there may not be any good reps yet. Thanks everybody!!!

Ok, this is my first review so please be kind. I also welcome any pointers that you may have. I chose the Mont Blanc Timewalker Chrono for my first review as it is the watch that I know the most about and because I just happened to have recently purchased another one. I also think that it more than qualifies as a SUPER REP . I feel like this watch doesn't get enough attention on the forums. To me it's one of the best OUT OF THE BOX reps This one happens to be Rose gold plated with a silver/white dial on a brown croc strap. I should preface this by saying that this is the watch that got me into reps. I've been an admirer of these watches for some time now & I've always felt like they were very classy and understated watches.

This particular one came from Josh. I also wanted to take a moment to say a few words about the purchasing experience with Perfect Clones(Josh). I ordered the watch on Dec. 18, and got it on Dec. 28. Not bad when you consider that it's Christmas. I was very impressed with Josh, and I will be doing almost all of my shopping with him from now on. The whole process was a breeze. They answered all my questions and responded promptly to my emails.

This model has the Asian 7750 movement, with running seconds in the 9 o'clock position. I have taken the advice of some of the members here and have already dropped this watch off to be serviced. I was told that this movement really needs to be serviced right out of the box. Upon receiving the piece, I did check to make sure that it was functioning properly, and it was. The crown wound smoothly and the chronograph pushers were also smooth and seemed to be very sturdy. The general feel of the watch, the buttons and crown was one of quality. Like you could feel how well made it was. Here is a picture of the crown and buttons. And again forgive my photography...I'm still learning.

The chronograph functions properly and resets back to 12, regardless of where I reset it from. I am however following The Zigmeister's advice about only resetting it from between the 12 and 2. But so far no problems. The chrono's big second hand sweeps smoothly on this watch. On one of the other Timewalkers I have, the motion is more jerky. But fortunately this one was smooth even before servicing.

The overall design of the watch is very impressive. The watch is thick, but due to the lugs curving down and towards your wrist, it has a very comfortable feel that makes wearing it very pleasant. The strap that came with it is the only real negative, and honestly it's not too bad. I will however be purchasing a gen strap from the Mont Blanc store in my area. The watch comes with a tang buckle that is pretty nice too. The buckle is actually sort of like the lugs on the case. They are skeletonized for lack of a better word. The display caseback is my girlfriend's favorite part of the watch. They have done a great job there. The detailing is great. The rotor is engraved with the correct markings and spellings. The rotor bearing assembly is also pretty close to the stainless steel gen, but differs somewhat from the gold gen. Not sure why the people over at Mont Blanc do that...

The dial is ridiculously good. All the fonts are right and with the exception of the sunken date wheel, which is common on many reps using the Asian 7750, the dial is exceptional. I read the post on here about fixing that and it seems like more trouble than it's worth. 2 other seemingly small details that ARE correct on this model are the finish beneath the lugs and inside the buckle and the number of markers between the numbers on the dial. On both this rep and the gen, the surfaces under the lugs and inside the sides of the buckle are not polished but rather brushed-looking. The markers on the dial is something of a mystery. It is my understanding that on all models that say Chronometer underneath Mont Blanc on the dial, there should be 4 markers. On all the older models that read Automatic there should be 3. I am guessing that they were copying an older model and therefore it says AUTOMATIC and DOES have the correct 3 markers between each number marker.

Overall, this is by far my favorite rep, and I bought it from what has now become my favorite dealer. (THANKS JOSH) I would recommend it to anyone that was considering adding it to their collection. I would also strongly suggest looking at the gold plated model. It is a real head turner. People can't take their eyes off it. So that's it, I hope you enjoyed my review. All criticisms are welcome. I want to get better at this, so please let me know how I did.

Oh and a couple of more things, on the day that I got this watch, I wore it around town. I had three people stop me and tell me how pretty it was. So this watch is definitely a crow pleaser. Second, I have actually worn my stainless steal Timewalker into the AD and had THEM put a new band and deployant on it...they had no clue. Just goes to show you that reps are getting scary-good and that clerks in the AD are usually clueless. LOL.

Mont Blanc Timewalker. I love this watch. By far my favorite rep!!!!!!!!!

Sounds good my friend,I to will be sending you a message

I just wanted to show you a picture of the MBTW in Rose Gold on the wrist. This watch get more compliments than anything else in my modest collection.

And I have NEVER had anyone ask me if it was fake b/c of the date wheel. More often than not I volunteer the fact that it's fake. It's far more interesting to people than a real one. Anyway that is my opinion. This is the actuual watch that I took into the AD to have a delpoyant put on...the guy had no clue. Some say that it is bad form to wear your rep into an AD. I say if you paid for it, wear it anywhere you like.

Yeah the SDW is really a non-issue on the blacki dial. BTW, MERRY CHRISTMAS Maxman, Hope you've been doing well. I'll email you later. I got some new pieces that you'll love. Picked up a UNMM like the one you showed me. F-ing awesome.

OK, I finally got an update on my package. It left China on the 17th, and the tracking information from EMS now states that it was handed over to U.S. customs on the 23rd. Anyone have any idea how long domestic deliveries are taking in the CONUS. I will NEVER order around Christmas again. LOL. Good luck to everyone else who's waiting on EMS. Personally, I hate it. Merry Christmas everyone.

Not meaning to highjack your thread.. but have you seen the MB Sport ??

it is imo.. a Super rep. and grossly underestimated.

AC/L

Yeah, the Sport is great too!! It's on my wishlist now. I love the disl. It's unique. Great looking watch for sure.

Hey guys, I've just bought the above watch. It hasn't arrived yet so I can't check if the sunken datewheel has been fixed or not on these reps. But if it hasn't, if possible, how would i go about raising it? Is there anybody you'd recommend i send it to who can do that for me?

Regards

Danny

Beautiful watch!!! I have three different models, 2 stainless, and one Rose gold. First, from what I understand, fixing the sunken datewheel is a pretty complicated modification. There's a post with some great pics of the entire process. Just put the whole name of the watch in the search field and look around. As far as the datewheel being a big deal...well if perfection is what you want, then you will have to buy gen. I can tell you that for me, its not a big deal. YOu have to be really close to the watch to even see it. Especially if you have a black dial. The dark dial conceals the shadow. I actually took my rose gold one into the AD and had them put a new brown Mont Blanc strap and deployant clasp on and they didn't say a thing. Just goes to show you that reps are getting better everyday and that most clerks working in the AD's are clueless. IMHO this is by far one of the best reps out there. It is as close as you are going to get to perfect, right out of the box. My advice, don't worry about it, and just enjoy the watch. You are going to get loads of compliments on it, trust me. If you got it in stainless, consider the gold one on the brown strap. It's very dressy. I wear a suit to work and I can't get people's eyes off of it. Wear and enjoy my friend. Merry Christmas.

I've only been into reps for about 6 months. I have only made 6 purchases...one a month is my self-imposed limit. Usually stuff only takes about 6 days to get to me from Josh, and a little longer from Watch Eden. So far I've been waiting for 12 days. I was very concerned until I read this post. I am curious however about one thing. Is it good or bad, in terms of customs grabbing my stuff, for the deliveries to take this long?

On another note, some of you may get a kick out of this. My NEW father in law, spotted my Mont Blanc Timewalker and loved it. When I told him it was a rep, he said that reps where garbage...that is until he hld it and put it on. He loved it. That was in October. I decided to get him one like mine for Christmas. In November I decided to go ahead and pick up another PAM for myself and just wait until December to order his. I figured "NO PROBLEM GETTING IT BEFORE CHRISTMAS" Ha!!! Little did I know. Another example of not reading the formu before I make a move. I think I may have finally learned once and for all. NEVER MAKE A MOVE BEFORE RESEARCHING IT HERE!!!! There is just so much valuable info here.

Regarding the highend gens.. your purchasing the "Brand" as opposed to what it is factually "worth".. your buying jewelry and not just a timepiece.. you are in effect purchasing a "statement" of sorts.. that of "success" etc. .. how many are treated differently when driving up in a German import rather than a Dodge .. ??

the rate of inflation being what it is .. what makes the Rolex's worth what they are ??

Would all the name brands appreciate in time if they were priced to their intrinsic value ??

conversely, we are paying for future R&D .. marketing .. advertising... and the whole ball of wax ..

but when you get a rep that is so good that it belies the need to own a genuine that is 10 times more than a rep.. obviously most of us are on somewhat of a budget.. or there would be no need for reps..

It is ..imo .. many times the "deal" that we feel we're getting in paying a few Benji's rather than 5k for a watch that is for our purposes .. and in our minds eye.. the feeling we are looking for ....

To each his own... if you had "crazy" money no doubt we would all own genuine .. or is it just the nature of the beast that some of us rather have the satisfaction of "building" a piece that would rival (to some extent) the famous brands..

dunno.. but I love this hobby an one should always follow their passions..

AC

Lani

Well said friend. Those are great observations. I agree with you regarding "The Deal". In the beginning I was more concerned with not getting ripped off than anything else. Now, having seen the quailty of the reps I have purchased I am beginning to realize that I should be worried more about getting ripped off by the gen companies. I'll make an educated guess and say that the percentage of rep collectors who get ripped off by dealers from our trusted dealers lists is pretty low...like "single digit low". Conversely the percentage of gen buyers who get ripped off IMHO is probably closer to 50%. I mean how many gens are actually worth the money. I know that is something impposible to track statistically speaking, or prove for that matter. But it's how I feel none the less. I know that something is "WORTH" whatever someone will pay...and now I am only willing to pay $500 or less for a watch. I have now purchased some great watches for that kind of money, so to me that is what a great watch is worth...$500 or less. It would go against my instincts to buy gen again at this point in my life. And I have always believed that there is something immorral about abandoning one's own judgement.

BTW, I am really pleased with the responses I have gotten from this post. They have all been thoughtful and articulate. I am so new to all of this, that I find real comfort in knowing that I am not alone in my quest for information and better reps. I have gotten so much out of this forum already, that I feel guilty for not having joined. That is going to be my next transaction...the Concord C1 and ROO from Josh are going to have to wait I'm affraid. LOL. Anyway thanks again for everyone's input.

Your story and the subsequent analysis are intimately familiar to me. There are several things that intrigue me about rep collecting. One, I have found that this community of reps collectors is uniquely comprised of a demographic tremendously fascinated with attention to detail and with the nuances of horology. Conversely, I used to be part of a "gen" watch forum for a fashion watch line (Invicta - "Watchgeeks" forum) and I found that the vast majority of the participants exhibited a "cult-like" adherence to resist any type of honest analysis of the focus watch company. Most rep collectors I have found can and usually do own gens and, in many cases, high-end gens. This goes against the common belief that rep collectors are generally people of low moral character that live lies to satisfy appearances. Lastly, I also concur with you that reps are certainly more of a conversation piece than gens. I own several gens and the amazing thing is that someone might compliment me with "That's a nice Rolex. Which model is that?" And, the answer is usually clean, clear and final: "It's an Explorer II; it has a GMT function." That's it. Conversation ends. However, when this happens with a rep, there is just so much more room to discuss the case design, the movement and how it may relate to the gen, etc. People are usually amazed by the quality of the rep and are just so curious about how it's possible that they approximate the gen so closely. To me, reps are just so much more fun and interesting. My gens are almost an end onto themselves. My reps are a prelude to further refinement and discovery (other models, modifications, etc.).

It's funny, I have a rep - the Rolex Yachtmaster Rolessium - that I acquired from Josh about three years ago and it STILL runs beautifully. I polished it recently to bring it back to like-new condition and it has maintained a level of time-keeping accuracy up to par with my gen Rolex Explorer II and my Submariner; which it's crazy.

Thanks for you input. My purpose in starting this thread was to solicit some honest opinions about the watch industry in general...I feel that a lot of people do collect reps for the wrong reasons. I am usually more excited about telling someone my watch is fake than I would ever be about a gen being real. I am just a mid level associate in a rather large law firm and most of the watches I look at are ones that are within reason for someone with my income. Now don't get me wrong I love some of the more higher end reps and may purchase one in the future. I love one of the PP's on one of the dealer sites, I don't care if its realistic or not, I just like the d%^& watch. There's no way i would ever pay that kind of money for a gen though...even if I had it to spend. I would buy the rep and have 50k in the bank. And I agree that with a gen, the watch is the end of the matter...with reps its just the beginning. I will say that there is virtually no difference in the "feel" of my MB Timewalker and the gen. Now maybe I am just not that informed on the matter, my knowlege of watches in general is perdestrian at best, but I really saw no difference in the two...except that I still had four grand in my pocket. I picked up a Mont Blanc Brown Croc strap and stainless deployant clasp for another $500, and now I have about $800 in the watch...and its great. Looks great. runs fine, keeps time reasonably well (I checked it against my laptop's clock) and next week I am going to get it serviced. I should have a great watch for a long time. The way I look at it is that I came out way ahead and I found a great new way to waste time and money. And who knows I like that watch so much that I may have to eat my words and buy the gen one day...MAYBE...

Wait a minute- which of those was $1500 and which was $3k? From what I know, those watches would fit more closely in a $600-$1500 range.

The price range was a quick approximation...after all I am at work...ever been there?

Tissot T Touch Expert Titanium...$1100

Hamilton Jazzmaster Chrono Automatic in RG...$1800

TAG Carrera Day Date....$2500

QUIT SHOPPING FOR WATCHES ON EBAY MAN...Just kidding. I probably got worked over on the prices anyway, as I did buy the Tag and Tissot from a department store. But that's the point I am trying to make here. I mean, I actually prefer the Timewalker I have now over my Hamilton. And I like Hamilton watches personally. But I will never own another gen as long as I continue to get my hands on quality reps. Now I should say that my tastes are very basic and in a sense classic, so the reps I would purchase are probably easier to make than some of these really great Rolex or Panerai watches I have seen. And I am probably not as critical as some...I'm just loving the fact that I am having fun and that watches are no longer about utility.I will NEVER pay for a gen again...I mean who cares anyway if its real or not. I don't...not anymore. I am having fun with this stuff and I was curious what some people with much more experience than I, have to say on the matter.I meani f you are insecure about something like wearing reps,I would think you have bigger fish to fry than watches.

I am very new to the rep world, and have only purchased a few reps at this point. But I now understand fully the attraction of this little hobby of ours. I have always been a fan of watches, nice watches specifically. Over the past 7 years I have purchased 3 gens that where IMHO "nice watches". I have a Tag Carrera, a Hamilton Jazzmaster, and a Tissot T Touch. As I'm sure you will notice all of three of these watches fall basically within the same price range: $1500 - $3000. With each purchase I did my homework and made, at the time, what I considered to be "Informed Decisions". I researched the watches and purchased the ones that I felt were appropriate for my purposes. I was done with watches in my mind. As a young proffessional in his twenties, I was of the opinion that my watch collection was complete and that it would be many years before I would have the need or means to add more variety.

I stumbled across the rep world by accident. I was reading an article on the Christophe Claret Dual Tow, which is an amazing piece and obscenely expensive at around $300k, when I saw some websites about replica watches. The rest I'm sure is almost identical to many of your own stories so I would never presume to waste everyone's time going there. Several weeks later, when I recieved my first rep, I was blown away. I spent Less than than $200 on a PAM that wouldn't fool many of you, but none the less was amazing to me. The 111h I got was heavy, solid, and with it's diplay back, very pleasing to look at. I was hooked. Since then I have purchased a few more reps, and each time I am shocked by the quality.I should preface this by saying that I do wear my reps everywhere. While I'm not trying to fool anyone, especially myself, the majority of people walking around could care less. I find that people are more interested in my rep than a gen. It's a great conversation piece. I actually went to the Mont Blanc store near my home and let one of the clerks hold my Timewalker and put a new strap and clasp on it...he had no clue. I was LMAO in the car on the way home.

So all of this begs the question...What in the world are we paying these Gen watch companies outrageous prices for. IMHO, I feel that if the reps are this good and this accurate, some of them even have the exact same movements in them, then the watch companies are taking the public for a ride. I am using the Mont Blanc Timewalker rep as an example b/c I own one and feel like it is one of the better reps around...sorry just not into Rollies...yet. But I purchased the rep for under $300 and the gen in the same model is around $4500. Other than where it was assembled, what's the big differnce. I am having a hard time believing that there is over $4000 worth of differences between the gen and a rep that even the clerk at an AD thought was real. I have lost all faith in the gens.I feel like a sucker for ever having purchased mine. I am keeping my Hamilton b/c I have yet to find a rep of it, but the rest are already gone...blew them out. And if I find a good Hammy rep...its gone too. I'm using the proceeds from my watches to finance my new hobby...and loving it!!!

So my big quesation is this: Does anyone feel that the Gen companies are really charging prices that in no way represent the actual value of their watches? Is there that big of a difference when all you are really after is a certain look, style,or general aesthetic? I say NO!!! I am done with gens. I now have something that many gen owners from a similar tax bracket will never have...VARIETY and OPTIONS. I can have as many reps as I want, and get rid of them at will. I have turned luxury watches into "Just another accesory"

Anyone ever hear about a guy called Sead, from the RepGeek site. Several people have told me that he is great if you're in the U.S. He says that he can put a good 111 together for me with a black and brown strap for $150...sounds okay...right? I don't see him in this forums trusted dealer list though. ANy thoughts?

Spoken like a Pro! I love it!

My take......don't be so Anal like some folks! If it's close enough, it's good enough, my mantra! Just get some good straps for your PAMs and they're good to go!

Here's two examples of the PAM111, first one is a DSN H...

and one I just built for around $150....not counting the strap!

and both side by side:

Which one do you go for?

Hope that helps!

Hike

What's a DSN H ?

Yeah that does help. The second one looks fine. The only difference I can see (or think I see) is the crown guard. But this watch looks great w/ a black or brown strap. Any good places to get straps? Can you pick them up at a jewelry store or watch store rather?

Thanks for the info...get the girlfriend a watch...never occured to me. That would shut her up... this month. As far as my level of pickiness goes, I am more concerned with the function and durability of the watch. I am no perfectionist and wouldn't notice most flaws. I just want a watch that I can wear and that looks good from a few feet away. I don't plan on trying to fool anyone...myself included. If I was looking for perfect, I would throw one of these things on the AMEX and not look back. I will probably be picking up a gen Mont Blanc Timewalker b/c I wear a suit to work and the watch is just so tasteful and classy...and affordable relatively speaking. But the Pam is a different story. I am the Operations Manager of large manufactoring company, so I am in the plant some of the day. SO this thing may take a beating. That is why I have grown fond of these watches. They look rugged and refined at the same time. Plus I doubt if any 10/hr laborer is going to know the difference. I can't wear the Timewalker out here though, it would get smashed for sure. So I just want to know if you think i can get a good rep for 150? One that will work properly and that doesn't feel like a cheap piece of garbage when you hold it. Thanks man.

I hated these watches when I first started looking around the forums. They have grown on me. It doesn't hurt that my Step father has a gen...Yeah I may have to sneak it out one night. Anyway, I was curious about a few things. I am by no means an expert and my knowlege of these watches is pedestrian at best. I want to know about the 111h. What dial colors are available? And what is all this talk about "Superlume" and does it matter? I am talking with Sead about buying one this week and hopefully being able to rock it this weekend. However he said that the reps of the 111h range from about $110 to $400. What are the major differences in the reps? He said he could get me a great deal on one if I didn't want "superlume"...what the f*&@# is superlume? Can you actually get a good looking rep of the 11h for around $150? Any tips from you guys would be appreciated. I got such great feedback from my questions reguarding a Mont Blanc that I figured I'd ask again. I swear these forums are a great tool for people starting out. The flipside to that is that I now have a new reason to spend more time in front of the computer and less time with the Mrs. Yeah...she's already [censored]. She said if I show her another picture of ANY watch that she may choke me. LOL. Any tips on how to deal with women who don't understand this sickness would be great too. Thanks for the help.

Any watch...money is no option...Christophe Claret Dual Tow. Period.

Go with Joshua (Perfect Clones - jpc8118) - he is the best dealer on the boards.....period!!!

Just checked out that site...good prices. Thanks man.

I have been in contact with that guy. He has answered all my questions quickly. I also got a good feeling for some reason when I noticed his prices weren't posted. I don't know why but that makes it seem ...I don't know...genuine for lack of a better word. Thanks.

Being new to all this is a bit overwhelming. I have taken a look at the "trusted dealer" lists, and visited there repsective websites. I am contemplating my first purchase, a Mont Blanc Timewalker Chrono. I feel like its an elequent watch that is realistic for my income. Having made up my mind about the watch, which in itself was excruciating, I now need to pick a dealer. I have had more trouble making up my mind about this than I did the watch. Now that I have decided to pick up a Pam too, I don't want to get ripped off.

Question #1: Who is the best all around dealer for these watches? Price, quality, service...all around BEST!

Question #2: Would it be better to buy them from seperate dealers?

I have been taking a look at everyones' photos and reviews and if I get a good response from this I would be happy to provide a step by step review of this process for other newcomers. I feel like I can handle it...aside from the technical review of the watches themselves. I will leave that to the experts.

Thanks for ANY advice you can throw my way.