Old/new Pam250, Side By Side

[MJP]

you probably got a really bad one

Exactly. Make sure your dealer or his peeps look it over before sending it out to make sure it looks like eddies (sans sexy, fuzzy photography)--otherwise you'll get stuck with return postage ($16) like I did, not to mention f**kin PayPal fees which are probably more than the postage--neither of which my dealer offered to cover.

If you really don't know what I'm talking about, go back and start from the beginning of the thread--esp. my photo.

Here's another to refresh your memory. This one shows the bench grinder buttons and the non-flush crown guard pin:

Edited September 16, 2006 by MJP

[archibald]

I have a 4 day degree in this type of thing so I'll defer to the OP if I'm wrong, but I think the bezels and dials are done by 2 different processes. The dials are probably made exactly the way you say--reconstructed in illustrator using vector fonts and/or Live Trace then laser engraved (sweet technology: the equivalent of 1400 dpi and fonts that appear to be truly raised even though they are engraved) onto some substrate (mylar maybe), lumed, die cut, and stuck on the blanks, or at least that;s how the one dial I deconstructed was done (Rolex TOG).

The bezels are more than likely CNC milled and engraved. Obviously the bezels on this model are not 3-D scanned, but raher are done in a CAD program.

I think the repmakers just have a different view of things--they make these things to make money and the understand that in the real world, nobody knows what a Panerai is, nobody enlarges their wrists to 10X, and if you know how Tachymeter is spelled on a 51 you've already figured out a rep is a rep long before you notice the fonts on the bezel. It has no beneft to them to spend the extra time and money to get these things perfect, and they want a couple visible flaws anyway.

That being said, I'll make a deal with you: you rovide the artwork for an accurate dial and I'll see to it that it gets made and offered as an aftermarket part if no dealers will take on the project. Probably the best one to do would be a simple 111 dial with accurate placing of L-Swiss-L and the correct crossbars on the A's. I'm dead serious if you are...

[MJP]

they want a couple visible flaws anyway.

Pardon my ignorance...Why?

That being said, I'll make a deal with you: you rovide the artwork for an accurate dial and I'll see to it that it gets made and offered as an aftermarket part if no dealers will take on the project. Probably the best one to do would be a simple 111 dial with accurate placing of L-Swiss-L and the correct crossbars on the A's. I'm dead serious if you are...

EZ. Check yer PM.

I wanted to add that "auto-tracing" programs and plug-ins are for people who never mastered the bezier curve tool. It takes some flight time to use it properly, but it's the only way to trace in Illustrator properly.

Also this whole TACHYMETER TACHYMETRE isn't a huge problem for me.

Edited September 17, 2006 by MJP

[eLiNK]

... Probably the best one to do would be a simple 111 dial with accurate placing of L-Swiss-L and the correct crossbars on the A's. ...

111H would be a really good start.

[MJP]

111H would be a really good start.

You are so right on about that one. You nailed it on the HEAD, brother. Couldn't have re-said it better, or with a more appropriate emoticon.

Edited September 17, 2006 by MJP

[Watchmeister]

Arch-

You are asking for it.

[slay]

'Sasch5' dealer could be on the money...the PAM250 rep he sells is the best one I've seen so far, at least cosmetically. I believe it also comes with an updated A7750 mov't.

Check the fine details on the dial - 5, 10, 15 etc numbers are almost exactly as on the gen, comes with A/R sapphire, 6 o'clock subdial is close to "perfect"...se below:

http://www.replicacollector.com/members/in...showtopic=25624

Maybe we have a 'PAM250 version 3' here ?

cheers,

babola

I think it doesnt look good. The Tachymeter is spelled wrong, the Panerai font is really bad, two things which anyone can spot. IMO

[MJP]

I think it doesnt look good. The Tachymeter is spelled wrong, the Panerai font is really bad, two things which anyone can spot. IMO

Well, if your aim is to front a fake at a premeire party like youre Matt Damon, I agree whole heartedly. I wouldn't wear either one out in that case, for fear of attention and inspection. That model just needs some quality control and one more revision and it would be [censored].

TTAndy is great to deal with--he stands behind his product--to a fault. He has had so many successful sales that when a bad one goes out he has a hard time believing it. I wish his guys that mailed it, who are sending it from elsewhere (where he can't control what's going out), would have picked and mailed one without production flaws, I might have kept it despite it's re-design flaws. The splotchy 9 is just unacceptable by anyone's standards, it shouldn't have been sold and sent. Same when my 196 arrived with a small dent in the case. I didn't even see it until scrutinizing it for a few minutes. I think maybe because of the volume of sales he and his peeps do, some slip by. I don't want even slightly defective watches, which are meant to be admired for thier attention to detail and asthetic. Luckily he takes care of the problem quickily and I thank him for that at least.

Back to the first subject--Here's a helpful guide to showing off your watch without actually lying about it's authenticity. Try these evasive answering (EA) techniques:

------------

Q: That's a nice watch! What kind is it?

EA: You ever heard of Panerais? A lot of stars wear them. The PAM250 like this one sells for 10k. Panerais have been around since...[segue, change subject.]

------------

Q: Is it real?

EA:I hope so! I paid a lot! (Ha Ha) I saw a fake a Rolex in Thailand last...[segue, change subject]

or

EA: As if they meant not holographic or illusory--tap it, feel it, then:

"Yep, it's real! (Ha Ha) Do you watch Star trek where they have the Holodeck..." [segue, change subject]

------------

Q: It's made by Panarai?

EA: You know, I think most of the fakes out there are Rolex copys. My sister saw this TV show...[segue, change subject]

Any more than that I think you'll have to lie or 'fess up.

Edited September 17, 2006 by MJP

[Everythingape]

I thought it was supposed to be spelled "Tachymetre" ..can't find any with "tachymeter" on it.. -shrug-

Oh nm, I found it now

http://www.panerai.com/s_page.xpd?id_lingu...id_categoria=39

[MJP]

I thought it was supposed to be spelled "Tachymetre" ..can't find any with "tachymeter" on it.. -shrug-

MMM...keep those sig pix coming

TT Andy's got it, Josh, that's the one I'm talking about. All the newer ones out there(2006 PAM250s) spell it right. Look at the dealer sites.

The diff between "meter" and "metre" is that the latter is an actual unit of measure and the other is added to words to mean it measures or "meters" something, in this case Tachy- or speed. There is actually no english word "Tachymetre".

Edited September 17, 2006 by MJP

[babola]

I think it doesnt look good. The Tachymeter is spelled wrong, the Panerai font is really bad, two things which anyone can spot. IMO

This is the best PAM250 rep currently being offered.

There will always be 'something' wrong with the rep, my aim is to find the one with the least amount of 'issues' out-of-wack with the gen. I'm happy with this one as-is.

cheers,

babola

[MJP]

This is the best PAM250 rep currently being offered.

There will always be 'something' wrong with the rep, my aim is to find the one with the least amount of 'issues' out-of-wack with the gen. I'm happy with this one as-is.

cheers,

babola

It is the best for it's "Panerai Luminor" font and the Tach spelling, for sure--big noticeable improvements. I have a Tantalium that is perfect looking compared to that 250, tho. One more dial and a Tach bezel (basically) and the 250 could be too. I'm glad there are a lot of satisfied people though, sincerely.

I really think they should go back to older datewheel though, with bolder numbers, right? This is a big issue for me personally. It's set so deep in there in the first place, then that skinny incorrect font. Someone please at least back me up on that one. Or is the datewheel an integral part of the new movement?

I know the vets around here are getting really sick of this thread--I can feel it. This is MY model though guys, the first watch I was attracted to and bought (w/ my B&R 2nd). I have all kinda love and passion for it.

HAIRMPH!!!

[MJP]

Arch-

You are asking for it.

At this point, I don't know much about the watch-making process, this is true.

But I will GUARANTEE you that somewhere in Italy, there are prima donna graphic designers comping and specing out fonts and layouts in Illustrator for watch designs and dials and casebacks, which they hand off to CAD production or industrial designers to start the real work. There are plenty of intermediary steps between them and a finished product, no doubt. And I have a pretty vague, maybe even naive understanding of that part. I just want it known what I can do, so that those of you that do understand and are involved with the complete process can use me if possible. It's just a way to contribute(hopefully) to my new hobby. If it's all over my head and my skills don't fit into this process, thats cool. School me, please. But from the PMs I've gotton so far, it sounds like maybe I can pitch in. Either way, I'm doing it for fun and not my $85/hour freelance rate so if I do create something and it's unusable, it's unusable. This is reverse engineering design, so it sounds even easier. I might be completely wrong, but there seems to be one step in the rep process that could use some tightening up on some models.

Just putting myself out there. I want to re-do this 196(this is gen, notice METRE):

This is probably a REALLY stupid question, but I still don't see why it's advantageous (as some of you say) to have flaws and inconsistancies. Is it really just because if they are too "real" looking, the hammer might come down on the little market? If so, it's time to ramp up the aftermarket parts and alterations market.

Edited September 19, 2006 by MJP

[Chronus]

That being said, I'll make a deal with you: you rovide the artwork for an accurate dial and I'll see to it that it gets made and offered as an aftermarket part if no dealers will take on the project. Probably the best one to do would be a simple 111 dial with accurate placing of L-Swiss-L and the correct crossbars on the A's. I'm dead serious if you are...

Do a 111G series so it can be used in the great 001's too!