Superfranken 88 question (movement related)

[TK471]

I've got a super franken 88 build on the way and I have a question. I will be adding gen dial, hands, case, crown, crown guard, crystal and datewheel. Watch currently has an A7750.

Is it possible to upgrade to Swiss 7750, or do there need to be extra mods or modules added to the movement? Is it even worth upgrading, or is a serviced A7750 good enough? This one has the sunken DW fix.

thoughts and musings are appreciated.

[rolli]

7750 not possible.

the valjoux gmt movement is a 7754.

and all the valjoux movements come with H1 hand gear posts.

the inner measurements of the 088 case is too deep.

thats why the rep use the old 7750b1 modified with gmt function and has a distance ring on top.

and this movement has longer hand gear posts. ca. H5

and eta don't produce H5 length for their valjoux movements.

so no possibility to use a swiss 7754 gmt.

rolli

I've got a super franken 88 build on the way and I have a question. I will be adding gen dial, hands, case, crown, crown guard, crystal and datewheel. Watch currently has an A7750.

Is it possible to upgrade to Swiss 7750, or do there need to be extra mods or modules added to the movement? Is it even worth upgrading, or is a serviced A7750 good enough? This one has the sunken DW fix.

thoughts and musings are appreciated.

[TK471]

Perfect, thanks!

[jitai]

Another member you may want to check is kbiz.

He got 2 lovely franken PAM88 and 89.

I am sure you can find more useful advice from him.

Please post a pic when the project is completed.

Good luck

[rolli]

this member bought a 088 with a swiss 7754 inside and used the distance ring from the 7750b1.

but the hand gear posts are too short,

he said anyway.put the hands on it.

so he did it.

and the result is the hands sit too short on the gear post and direct on the dial.

there is no space between hands and dial.

only maybe that much that the hour hand works and has no contact with the small second hand.

but it looks terrible.

with all the force to do the modification to say i have a mod 088.

this is not professional and not watchmaking.

rolli

Another member you may want to check is kbiz.

He got 2 lovely franken PAM88 and 89.

I am sure you can find more useful advice from him.

Please post a pic when the project is completed.

Good luck

[jitai]

this member bought a 088 with a swiss 7754 inside and used the distance ring from the 7750b1.

but the hand gear posts are too short,

he said anyway.put the hands on it.

so he did it.

and the result is the hands sit too short on the gear post and direct on the dial.

there is no space between hands and dial.

only maybe that much that the hour hand works and has no contact with the small second hand.

but it looks terrible.

with all the force to do the modification to say i have a mod 088.

this is not professional and not watchmaking.

rolli

Hi rolli,

I didn't know that.

Thought it was something manageable from the watchsmith.

Thanks for the information

You are good.

[rolli]

i have two swiss 7754 gmt movements,

my watchmaker tried everything and i have talked with the eta chief watchmaker about longer swiss gear-posts.

no change.

i have here all measurements of all valjoux gear-posts, but they are too short.

result to use a swiss 7754 in a rep 088 means we need H5 hand-gear-posts length.

this is fact.

or the rep factory constructs a new 088 case for a swiss 7754.

and for sure this will be never happen.

they use the same bad case type in the future.

rolli

Hi rolli,

I didn't know that.

Thought it was something manageable from the watchsmith.

Thanks for the information

You are good.

[TK471]

Ultimately this isn't a huge deal, as the A7750 can be made to be reliable. Moreover, the biggest flaw - the sunken date wheel - is fixed on my watch. I just thought maybe I'd try to take it all the way.

[Watchmeister]

I always knew there was no direct ETA movement swap but never why. Thanks for the info.

[rolli]

read my text above then you know why.

the inner measuremets of the 088 rep case is too deep.

that's why the rep factory built-in the old 7750b1.

and this movement is too tall.

when you want to use a 7754 then you have to use the 7750b1 distance-ring for the deeper inner case measurement.

and for this the swiss 7754 hand-gear-posts are too short. not longer swiss gear-posts available.

so..you cannot install the swiss 7754 gmt movement.

and there is no purpose from the rep maker to construcs a new 088 case type for a 7754 gmt.

the joke is, they don't have an asia 7754 movement. and it would be too expensive for the rep maker to construct a new asia 7754.

because some members want a gen 7750 in their 088 case.

rolli

I always knew there was no direct ETA movement swap but never why. Thanks for the info.

[TK471]

Keep in mind, i have a genuine case. The Question then becomes will my asian movement fit. I know for sure that a swiss 7750 would.

[rolli]

in a gen 088 no asia 7750b1.

only the gen 7754.

all gen 77xx series are based on the mesurements of the 7750.

i only know in the ultimate 229 firenze 1st serie i could install without problems the swiss 7750.

rolli

Keep in mind, i have a genuine case. The Question then becomes will my asian movement fit. I know for sure that a swiss 7750 would.

[TK471]

Oh, crap. My project just got a lot more complicated. Either that, or I can't use the gen case. Not sure where I'd find the 7754. Damn.

[rolli]

try to find the watchpart distributors in your country.

normally they could manage to get one.

i did the same.

when i need something i always ask my local distributor.

or you find via google watch factories who have watches with the valjoux 7754 gmt inside.

maybe they have 7754 in stock and with a bit luck you can chatch one or two.

rolli

Oh, crap. My project just got a lot more complicated. Either that, or I can't use the gen case. Not sure where I'd find the 7754. Damn.

[kbiz]

Wrong member bud...

I only use the modified A7750 GMT movements in my GMTs...

The watches were built from scratch as you can see in the links in my sig...

obviously if I did the sunken DW fix they're not swiss

I prefer the rep case method personally with the asian GMT movement...

this member bought a 088 with a swiss 7754 inside and used the distance ring from the 7750b1.

but the hand gear posts are too short,

he said anyway.put the hands on it.

so he did it.

and the result is the hands sit too short on the gear post and direct on the dial.

there is no space between hands and dial.

only maybe that much that the hour hand works and has no contact with the small second hand.

but it looks terrible.

with all the force to do the modification to say i have a mod 088.

this is not professional and not watchmaking.

rolli

Edited August 20, 2010 by kbiz

[rolli]

i cannot understand this statement.

in all the rep gmt versions like the 088, 089 is always from factory an asia 7750 inside, this is the old 7750b1 with 21.600 bph.

there is nothing for a modification.

everything is bad, movement material and precision, everything. no comparison to a swiss movement.

worlds are in between.

at the moment there is no asia copy of the valjoux 7754 on the market.

that's why the factory used always the old 7750b1 which is modified with gmt function.

it is not necessary to make a new asia copy of a swiss, and this is a big investment for the factory to construct a new movement

and to give the order to seagul, because there are not enough buyer for this kind of gmt pams.

rolli

Wrong member bud...

I only use the modified A7750 GMT movements in my GMTs...

The watches were built from scratch as you can see in the links in my sig...

obviously if I did the sunken DW fix they're not swiss

I prefer the rep case method personally with the asian GMT movement...

[kbiz]

Let me make it more clear for you... you were referring to the wrong member by referring to my build and what was included swiss or not... maybe re-read your previous posts to connect the dots...

i cannot understand this statement.

in all the rep gmt versions like the 088, 089 is always from factory an asia 7750 inside, this is the old 7750b1 with 21.600 bph.

there is nothing for a modification.

everything is bad, movement material and precision, everything. no comparison to a swiss movement.

worlds are in between.

at the moment there is no asia copy of the valjoux 7754 on the market.

that's why used the factory always the old 7750b1 which is modified with gmt function.

it is not necessary to make a new asia copy of a swiss, because there are not enough buyer for this kind of gmt pams.

rolli

[rolli]

no special person is adressed.

this with the movement type is fact.

rolli

Let me make it more clear for you... you were referring to the wrong member by referring to my build and what was included swiss or not... maybe re-read your previous posts to connect the dots...

[kbiz]

I think babelfish translator is causing confusion for you... check your post, you quoted someone talking about kbiz...

no special person is adressed.

this with the movement type is fact.

rolli

[rolli]

no matter who has a 088 or 089 or feels adressed.

i have a 088 and it is fact, no installation of the swiss 7754 possible with a professional result.

take it as it is.

rolli

I think babelfish translator is causing confusion for you... check your post, you quoted someone talking about kbiz...

[kbiz]

I agree... it's possible but so much custom work would need to be done that it's not worth it at all IMO... The asian movement is not the best in the GMT but some are very good... they are cheap at just over $100... I've had some die early and some last several years and still going strong...

no matter who has a 088 or 089 or feels adressed.

i have a 088 and it is fact, no installation of the swiss 7754 possible with a professional result.

rolli

[rolli]

all 088, 089 and 156 gmt user have to live with this bad asia movement.

my 088 works without problems.

the other thing is, the asia gmt maker don't get a swiss valjoux 7754 from eta, to use it as sample for a 1:1 copy.

so they have no change.

otherwise they buy any watch with a 7754 inside.

but the investment for an asia 7754 copy is too much.

rolli

I agree... it's possible but so much custom work would need to be done that it's not worth it at all IMO... The asian movement is not the best in the GMT but some are very good... they are cheap at just over $100... I've had some die early and some last several years and still going strong...

[kbiz]

To get a good GMT A7750 movement I've ordered a bunch of movements and kept the ones that charge up the fastest... the GMT A7750 is known to be a weak movement typically... there's not enough demand for a new GMT movement...

[TK471]

Speedy says that the A7750 will fit in the gen case. He's putting it together today. I will report back with pics as soon as I can. Thanks for all the advice. Fingers crossed for a successful project.

[rolli]

which kind of asia 7750 and which kind of gen case ??

1.) we need the speciafication of the movement, all measurements + functions ?????

2.) gen 088 gmt case ????

but if it is the new asia 7750 ( 28.800 bph ) without gmt function, then yes, it will fit in the gen 088 gmt case and other auto pam cases.

rolli

Speedy says that the A7750 will fit in the gen case. He's putting it together today. I will report back with pics as soon as I can. Thanks for all the advice. Fingers crossed for a successful project.