Vintage datejust

[Lewis12]

Currently in the making of a 16xxx raffles datejust build does anyone have any tips

Also looking to gold plate it if anyone knows anything about that also

Raffles have gold straps but I wonder how accurate they are?

 

 

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[freddy333]

I cannot help with Raffles, but gold plating is relatively easy. However, due to the expense, unless you have multiple watches to plate or plan on going into the plating biz, it is usually more cost effective to have a jeweler perform the gold plating for you. You are likely to spend close to $1k on a decent gold plating system & alot less to pay a jeweler who already has the equipment.

[Muhammad556]

Make sure everything is aligned properly—those details really matter. Good luck with your build! Can’t wait to see how it turns out!

[Jimmythree]

Good advice from the posters above!

 

I have a few friends in the jewelry business and they have gold plating equipment but most of the plating they do is rhodium or white gold plating over yellow gold on solid yellow gold rings where the stones are mounted. In other words, small jobs.  They keep GP equipment in their shops because many of the rings they buy for resale come without stones and the stone mountings are yellow gold same as the ring.  White gold settings give diamonds more 'flash'.

 

That being said...gold plating is very expensive today because of high gold prices and the solution used to gold plate things (gold dissolved in cyanide) has gone from maybe $50 to $300+ and it will not go very far on something big as a watch case...depending on thickness of the plating.

 

Any item being plated must be very  smoothly finished and very  clean because every imperfection will show and/or the plating may not stick as well as it should.

Because of the cost, most 'gold plated' watches today do not have any real gold on them at all.  Watches with real gold plating may have the gold thickness marked on the case with 5, 10, 20, and sometimes 40 microns being the most common.  One micron only equals .001 mm so it is not very thick at all.  A case with 10 or 20 microns of plating will usually last quite a while and a 5 micron case will usually not last very long.  Cases with 40 microns will hold up for many years if taken care of.  Cases and bracelets with less than 5 microns are called 'flash gold plated' and will wear away fairly quickly...denim jacket sleeves etc.

 

There used to be a lot of 'gold top' cases and bracelets on mid upper priced watches but most have disappeared by now.  They were regarded as better than gold plated or gold filled cases although gold top cases were in reality, just heavy gold filled cases. 

One type you still see is the 34mm Rlx gold top 1550, 15505 OPD etc. from the 1960s/1970s.  The cases and bracelets were stainless steel with a thin gold cap soldered over them and the bezels were solid gold.  The backs of the cases were not gold capped.  Some examples had cheap base metal plated bracelets that would 'rot away' with corrosion.

 

FYI on gold prices...about 24 years ago, I bought a new 'Italian' 18K aftmkt 'replacement' case for a Rlx DJ cal. 3035 movement/dial, it was around $800/$900.  The same case today retails for $7000!!  You can find them for much less of course but this one was 'top of the line' back then and still is.  I put a Rlx 3035 in it for a guy and away it went.

 

Still have an aftmkt 18K 'Italian' Prez case (weighs 30.9 grams with bezel, no crystal/crown) similar to the case above and iirc, I allowed about $400 for it in a trade.  The trade was made in the same deal where the 3035 and DJ dial were put in the 18K case mentioned above.  The 'Prez' case has a larger dial window because it was made for an ETA 2836-2 day-date movement with a larger dial.  A regular 27.9mm DJ dial is too small and falls through the window.

Q...Why trade cases?

A...The guy who ended up with the new 18K case also had a tutone DJ with a 3035 but his 18K case with the Prez ETA movement and oversized DD dial would not work with the smaller 27.9mm DJ dial. 

Long story.

 

Btw, I had some YGP Prez type watches with Asian movements years ago.  They were about $100 back then, I wonder if any of the TDs still sell them today?  It might be a lower $$ way to get a case. 

 

Example of GP supplies...

https://www.riogrande.com/product/tools--equipment/plating/gold-plating-solutions/?sort=Bestseller

 

FYI...here is a video from Stuller showing how some 'die struck' gold items are made...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LYf5Y9Zg64M&t=29s

 

Many solid gold watch cases are die struck, others may be cast or soldered/laser welded together out of gold strips, castings etc.

 

Stuller is one of the largest gold ring and gold 'findings' etc. suppliers in the USA.  Many rings at high end jewelry stores come from Stuller.

 

Here is the 18K 'Prez' case...

 

 

Typos are free.

jimmythee is automatico   

 

Edited February 8 by Jimmythree

[Lewis12]

Wow man this is descriptive! Wish I could get my hands on a case the same price as you paid years ago!

love it 

[Jimmythree]

Wow man this is descriptive!

 

Thanks!

 

Wish I could get my hands on a case the same price as you paid years ago!

 

Me too.  One that will accept a 27.9mm DJ dial.

 

The only good Rlx deal I heard about lately was a friend got a 16233 in very good condition for $1500.   

He was bragging about it until he found out the jewelry store/pawn shop where he bought it paid $600 for it.

Then it was my turn to laugh.  

[Lewis12]

Hahhaha that’s funny man,

I absolutely love the full gold look I just can’t afford A to replate every 6 months max or B a full gold watch 

[Jimmythree]

I absolutely love the full gold look...

 

I always liked yellow gold watches on leather straps. 

A group of watch traders met for many years close to where I live and over the years, many of today's 'classic watches' passed across the trading table.   I got my share of them but most have been traded away or sold by now...they were not 'classics' when I had them.

Gold was $200 to $300 per Troy ounce then and a nice vintage 14K Hamilton, Gruen etc. would go for $150 or $200.  'Waterproof' type common brand gold watches went for a little bit more but not much. 

 

I mentioned 'gold cap' 34mm Rlx 1505 models earlier and I still have two runners and two not running from back then...one I bought in January 1996 for $150 with the gold bezel missing and I just happened to have a bezel.  Ha! 

Got another one from a friendly Rlx AD about the same time when the fellow who owned it decided to let the AD sell it rather than pay  for service he had done on it.  The other two are in parts. 

I guess I could put one of the 1505 cases, an ETA 2846, a no date 34mm OP dial with gold markers, a no mag crystal, croc strap etc. together and have a 'gold Rlx'.

 

What is hard for me to believe now is not the prices back then so much as the fact that there used to be 'friendly' Rlx ADs. 

Now it is like walking into a den of sharks while wearing a bloody T shirt.

 

jimmythee is automatico   

 

[Charles Bailey]

For your 16xxx Raffles Datejust build, make sure to check the case size and dial fit to avoid compatibility issues. Raffles parts are decent but may need extra finishing for a more authentic look. If you want to gold plate it, electroplating is the best method look for a local jeweler or a DIY kit with proper surface prep. Raffles’ gold straps are decent for the price but may not match the exact tone of Rolex gold, so compare with references before buying.