perfect PAM88 ?

[tgchrono2]

i asked DSN & mentioned 320,00 usd (shipped) for his Pam 088. The Cartel sell it for 428,00 + 45,00 shipping = 473,00 usd... Its a great $ difference but is DSN a ''trusty'' seller ? He accepts oblt WU payments////,,,,

[mwee]

I have been reading this thread with a lot of interest. I have looking in getting a GMT Pam and the new Pam 88 from the cartel, the so called best version is really good. Yes, a bit expensive. There seems to be another problem too! the Date windwo cut-out is too small. I took this pic from a member from RG on his "Best Version" Pam 88. As you can see, the numerals on the DW is obstructed. Not sure if this is a one-off or a stock issue.

Other than that, I think it is very good!

[babola]

$428?!?!?!?!?!

Yeah, the first time I saw that on Andrew's Web site it made me almost vomiyt in my mouth...insane rediculous pricing for what you actualy get. For a moment I thought I clicked on a Hublot Big Bang rep link...LOL!

Scoobs, great comparo, love the posts like these. The old cartel dial was made by a diferent more 'mainstream' Pam rep factory that ceased production of numerous Pam models, since. The new 088 comes from another factory that now also makes the "ultimate" 104, 164, 111E etc. There's just something odd looking about these new reps, I just can't put my finger on it. Not the standard 'Davidsen odd-looking' but still odd, IMO.

[scoobs1971]

Scoobs, great comparo, love the posts like these.

Thnx!

Yesterday I had the opportunity to have a gen 088k in my hands again.

The silver subdial isn't recessed anymore and also lost the small circular patterns. I guess Panerai changed this over time.

I also noticed the complete lack of a blueish AR-hue - thought it actually has AR. This makes the rep with the strong blue AR look a bit silly.

The biggest flaw however, was the magnification of the date. The magnification on the gen looks almost double the size of the DSN rep. I don't know about the Cartel cyclops.

So in the end to me there's no 'ultimate' to both Cartel and DSN PAM088 rep, just another average PAM rep.....

[Watchmeister]

I have never studied the PAM 88 reps but I have to say I thought the latest ultimate 88 which I procured for a friend was a step up (albeit too expensive) from anything I had seen so far. I thought the dial looked fairly close in terms of dial shade, sheen and font/ boldness of print. The CG dimensions actually looked fine but the crown sits too flat against the case so a proper T crown would fix that. The date section will always be a problem as gen crystals are simply far superior in terms of optical clarity and overall magnification. I did not have a gen sitting in front of me at the time so I will defer to everyone who has done such thoughtful analysis but have handled or worn at least two different versions of the gen. And the dials on the two gens I spent time with were fairly different.

By the way, much thanks to all the contributants here. This is an illuminating and enjoyable thread.

[cskent69]

This has been a question that I have been wondering for quite some time - which I have not been able to answer because I have been reluctant to put the dollars down on the new "best Version" 104. What are really the improvements of the new Best Version over the old Ultimate.

I have an old Ultimate 104. These are my observations on what I have pertaining to some of the topics we are discussing:

1. The cyclops of the old 104 is good - but by no means great. The first problem is that the optics are too "centered". Meaning - it started to distort the numbers too quickly when you look at it off center versus the genuine. I think that it means that the curvature is off. This is why a lello DW actaully looks better in the old Ultimates as the Lello numbers are closer togethor than the cartels.

2. The AR is way too heavy. The heavy bluish tint of the AR on the old Ultimate version is not at all what Panerai's really look like. The fact that the cyclops has the tint in it as well (and can be more pronounced in fact) is a major giveaway.

Finally - there are folks who have written that the DW is too small for the 88 because the Datewheel is sunken and too far away. Apparently - the Datewindow cutout - which was the same for all the new Best versions (104, 88, 164, etc) is the same - and was in fact - meant to work for the non GMT's. (no sunken DW).

I would like to know if the new Best version 104 cyclops is better than the old Ultimate 104. By guess, is that it is the exact same thing - hence why I have not bothered to purchase it yet.