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automatico

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Everything posted by automatico

  1. "My only advice, is NOT to twist the stem slightly (as advice is sometimes given) when reinstalling." I turn the stem so the square on the stem will slip through square hole in the winding pinion and not unseat it.
  2. "Given my long history of screwing up keyless works by removing the stem in the wrong position - where should the crown be when I pull it out?" From my experience (and screw-ups): Seagull ST6 works best in setting position. When installing the stem it usually helps to push the detent button down a bit while inserting the stem. DG, CH etc '21' jewel movements work best in winding position. No need to push the detent button. Eta 2824/2836 etc seem to work better in setting position and it helps to push the detent button when inserting the stem. 1...Push the detent button. 2...Slowly turn the crown/stem while gently shoving the stem all the way into the movement. 3...Release the detent button and gently pull the stem out to setting position in order to align all the parts. Check to make sure winding, time, and date setting works Ok. Q...Why push the detent button on ST6 and Eta but not DG/CH when installing the stem? A...Because the slope on the Seagull and Eta stem collar is so short and steep that it sometimes pushes the detent/set lever out of place when inserting the stem. The DG/CH collar has a long, mild incline. Eta 2824/2836 etc notes: **Use a screwdriver to push the detent button because using a pointed tool can result in dislocating the set lever/set bridge alignment. If the stem pulls out when setting the watch...do not cram it back in because it will sometimes shove the set lever out of place. **If you do push the set lever etc out of place...push the detent button in and install the stem and push it all the way in, pull it out to settinig position and see if everything works. If it does, you lucked up. **If the set lever is shoved out of place...most of the time you can reset the set lever by removing the autowind assembly and mainspring bridge and moving the parts around with a screwdriver etc. If not you will have to remove the hands, dial, and calendar works as exolained below. **If the detent button is pushed in too far...the hands, dial, and calendar works will have to come off...then remove the set bridge, line everything up, put the MS bridge on, install the stem, and see if everything works. **After installing the calendar wheel...remove the hour wheel and turn the date flipper to where it rests just under the next tooth on the inside of the calendar wheel. This is so when the dial is installed, it will only take a few degrees of crown turning to flip the date so the hands can be installed at midnight. **On older 2824 etc watches...the stem hole in the mainplate will sometimes wear (especially if the stem is in a bind), and the stem will sometimes pull out when setting the watch. The cheap fix is to swap the detent out with a new or like new part. If this does not work, try a new stem because the collar on the stem may be worn down or damaged. Be careful when holding a stem in a pin vise because if the pin vise is tight and you spin the stem while tightening the crown...it can shave a little metal off the collar and allow the stem/crown to pull out of the watch. ***There used to be oversize stems for older manual wind watches but I have never seen one for Eta automatics. The best way to learn about the setting works is to buy an old Eta 2824/2836/46 etc, remove the balance and autowind assembly (they are just in the way), then take it apart and put it together about 25 times. After you master the setting works...move on to the train wheels...autowind assembly...and last, the balance/balance jewels etc. No kidding.
  3. "Your crown looks too big (wide). You definitely need a gen for that watch." "It is Gen, Monobloc 703/704. I have a non-Monoblock here that I will most likely swap out." I measuerd seven slightly used (very little apparent wear) 24-703-0 monos and they all measure between 3.75mm and 3.85mm high across the cap skirt to the top of the cap right up against the crown tube. None are damaged and none appear to have been polished. A new mono 24-703-0 right out of the pack measured 3.85mm. Also measured a few 3 dot 'crimped' styles and they measured 3.7mm to 3.75mm. Earlier 'no dot' crowns measured 3.6mm. Someone else could measure a 704 crown and see what they get. I have a few replica crowns and some look a bit tall so I measured a couple and they are 4.15mm high and will not screw down on a genuine case tube because the crown threads are too small. Next, I looked on bernardwatch.com at submariner 16610 made ca 2005 (bernard number RLX4961) and the crown, probably a 24-703-0, looks a bit tall. Maybe it's the angle.
  4. "I haven't, and won't use epoxy/JB Weld because I know that someday I will want to remove the insert to do something stupid to my watch again." I don't blame you...I'm not looking forward to it. I have used regular two part epoxy and removed the bezel insert later without a lot of trouble but JB Weld might be harder to deal with. I figure the insert will be ruined upon removal. On this case the bezel is held on the case by a spring wire so I will have to remove the crown, crystal, all gaskets, movement etc and heat the bezel insert to get the JB Weld to turn loose. There is no plastic or rubber left after removing the crown, crown gaskets, crystal, and crystal gaskets on this particular case and there is no gasket between the case tube and case. Crystal gaskets...this case has 2 crystal gaskets...one flat gasket on the bottom of the crystal seat to raise the crystal up a little and a regular 'I' type band gasket that the crystal presses into. Usually when a crystal needs to be raised up, a one piece 'L' type gasket is used. On the regular two part epoxy insert removals, I used a small torch that has a Bic lighter in it. It makes a blue pin point flame and works fine on this type of project. There is one similar to it on eBay, item number 170668364878 If I remove the insert later on, I will post how much trouble it was.
  5. I started buying 'Swiss' eta powered replicas 20+ years ago and back then the ones I got all had new swiss made etas in them, mostly 17 jewel 2846. I found them in an ad in USA Today and you called an 800 number and left a message for 'Jay' etc to call you. 'Jay' called back in 30 minutes or less, took the order, and the watches arrived COD in a few days. I still have a couple and they still run. Fast forward to the WLD, River, Abay/WO Mart etc days of RWCC and TRC replica collector forums(late 1990's/early 2000's) and you still got new etas as advertised, sometimes as low as $159 delivered. This was the norm (except for prices!) up until around 2005/2007 or so when Swatch cracked the whip on China watch factories who did contract work for swiss brands and used genuine swiss etas...the swiss etas were leaking out under the doors and winding up in replicas and Swatch wanted it stopped. They announced they were cutting production and started getting very particular about who got the movements. Enter the 'etaclone'... Today we have Asian and swiss (Sellita) 'etaclones', and genuine swiss eta movements. When you buy a 'swiss eta' replica watch, it may have a genuine movement but it also might be a 'take out' from a NOS or used watch and they come in every condition from new and clean to worn out and dirty. Sometimes you get what you pay for, sometimes not...you just have to take a chance. Many times the watches are 'drop shipped' from a location not related to the seller and the seller does not know what is really shipped out. Sometimes you hit it lucky and get exactly what you paid for although imho the chance of this is getting slimmer by the month as supplies or new and used etas in the replica market are rapidly drying up. I always got what I ordered up until about 2007 when I got an Asian etaclone after paying for a genuine eta. Since then, I do not buy much and if I do buy something, I choose the etaclone because they are cheaper than 'genuine eta' and you can always swap the etaclone out with a genuine eta if the etaclone bites the weenie. So...If I could be dead sure I was getting a clean genuine eta, I would pay extra for one. If I was in doubt, I would go for an etaclone and be on the lookout for a genuine eta movement.
  6. I have stuck bezel inserts in bezels with all kinds of glue including the ever swelling Gorilla Glue. First time I ever used anything like GG was in the late 1970's when I bought some urethane glue. Next day the parts I had glued together were STUCK all right...but they were about 2mm apart. So...I stay away from GG on bez inserts. What I use is mostly 2 part epoxy. I tried RTV (silicone) and it is Ok but I just do not like it...the 'boogers' are a pain to remove. Tried 'waterproof' two part epoxy on a couple inserts but the 'waterproof' claim means little as regular epoxy seems to hold up Ok under (now and then) wet situations. I'm more worried about the case filling up with water anyway. Yesterday, I stuck a bez insert in a watch using the (motorcycle) trail rider's best friend...JB Weld because it was all I had. I put a thin layer of JBW on the bezel after cleaning the bezel and bottom of the insert with acetone on a Q-tip. I mounted the insert and double checked to make sure it lined up Ok at 12 with the clicks. Then I put the case on a cup in a BB crystal press with another cup on top with a layer of wax paper between the insert and the press cup in case some JBW leaked out (there is a notch in the cup to clear the pearl). Last, I tied the press lever down with a few stiff rubber bands to provide pressure overnight. For what it's worth, it turned out just fine. When using 2 part epoxy, I stick a couple toothpicks etc together with the excess so I can check hardness after a few hours to make sure it sets up correctly. JBW sets up harder than a $10 hooker's heart. Free short story: Motorcycle trail rider's around here carry 3 emergency tools...duct tape, contact cleaner/brake cleaner, and JB Weld. After busting a case or side cover on a sharp rock: 1...lean it over so the oil runs away from the damaged area 2...spray it down with CC/BC 3...spread JBJ around the damaged area 4...eat a sandwich and take a nap while it dries Contact cleaner/brake cleaner is also good in emergencys for cleaning dirt out of gouges in your arm etc and duct tape is good for coverinig up the gash...or makinig splints for broken arms, legs etc. A couple guys I know were riding around a deserted coal mine a few years ago and one turned a flip and landed in a pile of rocks. After he got back up he said he was Ok except his hand was hurting real bad. When he pulled his gloves off...his left little finger was missing. It got between the end of the handlebar and the rocks. They shook the finger out of the glove and put it in a little bitty cooler they had strapped on one bike and taped the end of the severed finger up with duct tape to slow the bleeding and took off to load their MCs up and go to the hospital. Iirc it grew back but does not work very well. Once again, duct tape saved the day although no JB Weld was needed.
  7. "I know this is an old thread, but what size dials are being used in those 5514s?" I have one of these watches from Paul/Wo-Mart (ca 2004/5)...the dial is 26.5mm and (get this!) the dial seat in the case is 29.2mm outside diameter. What saves the day is that the dial opening in the case is only 25.9mm. The dial is a lot smaller than the outer diameter of the dial seat but since the opening is only 25.9mm, it all works Ok thanks to the brass movement spacer that holds the movement centered in the case. So...this particular case will accept a dial from 26.5mm to 28.5mm+/-. If you use a larger dial with the markers close to the outside, they may be partially hidden by the wide dial seat. The dial seat inner diameter would be easy to cut out to work with a larger dial but this will reduce the width of the reflector/rehaut as seen from the front of the watch. This line of watches from Paul/Wo-Mart did not have crystal retaining bezels...the crystal was cemented to the case with a space between the crystal and the top of the case. The rotating bezel has a spring wire in it and the spring wire fits in the space between the crystal and the top of the case, thereby allowing the bezel to turn. Now we pay $500+ for basically the same (empty!) case with a better bezel assembly.
  8. "A few years ago, it was pretty cost effective to just build a DJ frankenstein using a genuine case and dial with an ETA inside; the total cost was not much more than some of the old TW Best reps. But the cost for gen case kits has gone up. Still doable, just more expensive..." For sure! About 5 or 7 years ago I bought a few tutone DJ with ST6 movements and the cases would take genuine DJ 16200 crystal gaskets and crystals. Maybe you can find a similar case. I installed gen spec crystal gaskets, sapphire crystals, and case tubes from Star Time on a couple along with a used genuine crowns and they did not leak at 100 psi (6 or 7 atm in my water tester)...Bergeon 5555/98 with a Shrader valve on the cap so I can put air in it from a small air tank. These cases are 'no hole' cases (sapphire crystal models) and I ruined one trying to drill the lug holes out but a 135 acrylic crystal will also fit. I put a couple together with the ST6 replica dials and eta movements and they looked just like a genuine case except they do not have any numbers on the case between the lugs (one had 'fuk u watch co' stamped in the caseback showing they had a sense of humor). The ST6 had 9mm offset dials and date wheels so I cemented the dial to the eta 2836 calendar spacer and the ST6 date wheel to the eta calendar. They also make good sapphire explorer cases if you can find a dial...and no date wheels etc to worry with.
  9. It seems to be a test to see how high retail prices can go before buyer resistance causes a loss in revenue...if they can make $1billion profit with a production of 950,000 pieces, making the same profit while selling 800,000 pieces would be much better. Otoh, maybe they are trying to move upmarket by raising prices every few months, thereby weeding out low class price hagglers (like me). For what it's worth...they weeded me out 13 years ago. I have not set foot in a rolex AD since May 1998. Since later model used rolex watches tend to rise with retail prices, modern watches in the used market will keep going up as long as retail prices rise. The 16610 may rise ahead of other models because they are no longer in production and still in demand. I guess if I wanted a late model DJ, sub, XI, XII, GMT etc, I would keep my eyes open for a motivated seller who needs $$ and does not read watch forums on the internet (TZ, WN etc 'for sale' prices have always been quite a bit higher than what I would pay). The last modern rolex I bought was a 'like new' (I don't like that term) 14010M AK for $1200 a year or so back. It really was 'like new'...except the idiot who owned it used pliers on the crown. I doubt Germany is the same as the USA though...in the USA many rolex owners will sell their watch for half what it is worth if they need fast $$. To catch this type of seller, you might place a WTB ad in the local paper and meet prospective sellers at your bank. If you like the watch, make an offer...if they say "Ok", draw the $$ out of the bank and pay them. I bought a few watches this way and it is safer than meeting a stranger at a potentially unsafe location...a stranger who knows you are carrying enough $$ to buy a rolex watch.
  10. "Do you want that old style clasp with the dentation at the end? Then a gen clasp is the only possible choice and it is worth it!" I agree genuine is the way to fly but 'Paul' supplied them on some of his vintage submariners when he was 'Abay' 5 or 7 years ago if you can locate one. Some came with the coronet stamped sideways on the clasp.
  11. "No aftermarket part looks "exactly like original" and you know that." I agree this is true for most external parts but aft-mkt movement parts such as stems, mainsprings, train wheels, screws etc can not be detected...but since they cause no malfunction, they will not decrease the value of the watch. Some aft-mkt case tubes are undetectable and probably as good as genuine...same goes for springbars and a few other parts. As rolex cuts off parts, more and more aft-mkt internal parts will emerge. This is good (imho) because it allows vintage watches to keep on running. Some say to buy another watch with the same movement for parts but I can not see paying $1000 for a watch just to get a $25 part that is available as aft-mkt. Example: I bought an aft-mkt intermediale wheel (for 1530 autowind assembly) a few weeks back and compared it with a genuine part. They are identical and many other wheels etc are the same way. "While some cases might be fine, all dials, bezels, crowns etc. are flawed in one way or the other, so you are obviously advertising your watches under false pretences to your customers. In numerous of your posts you are suggesting selling frankens on ebay to unsuspecting buyers is common practice among members here, while in fact it is absolutely unacceptable and nothing any sane member would tolerate." Many high grade aft-mkt cases, dials, and bracelets are are very, very good and many will easily fool me...although I am not a 'case, dial, and bracelet expert' by any stretch of the imagination. These parts will also fool the average vintage rolex buyer and they greatly decrease the value of the watch, especially when the watch has been sold as genuine. Replicas exist in a gray zone and are tolerated by most watch guys except for Looney Tune Brand Purists etc and I am sure the vast majority of replica owners know exactly what they have. Top of the line Frankenstein watches are in another league and I have no doubt there are a whole lot of them being sold as genuine. After all, RWG members can name three or four vendors who make a living out of selling the parts to make them. Why do I make up Frankenstein watches? Simply because I like vintage rolex watches and will not pay the Current Fool's Price for one. I hope no RWG member would sell a Frankenstien watch as genuine, but a few might. I for one would NEVER try to pass off a Franko as genuine. It is simply not right. I also think anyone who publicly says they want to buy parts to make Frankenstein watches for resale should maybe keep this little tidbit of information to themselves for the good of the forum.
  12. "yeah i d like to understand as well how you can do this for $1600." I had a 1680 project going but it went south when the DW 1680 case did not suit me. Here is what it would have cost more or less... I traded a diamond ring for a rolex 1570/75 with a pretty good genuine 1680 dial (the 1680 case rotted out and the dial/mvt was installed in a 1500 case). I had $900 in the ring. The 1500 case is probably worth about $100 if I sold it and then I could deduct it from the total. dial/mvt...$900 mainspring...$12 stem...$4 used genuine crown...$20 J Borel case tube...$20 replica hollow link bracelet with clasp...$50 springbars/gaskets...$10 DW case...$99 from eBay total...a little over $1100 I cleaned and oiled the movement for about $10 (chemicals and oil) but have a friend who is a super repair guy and if he cleans/oils a rolex movement for me, I pay him about $100 for auto/dates and $75 for manual winds and no dates. If you know someone who can do the cleaning, you can get a better deal by taking only the movement for repair...no case, dial or hands. For some reason, repair guys are not afraid of naked rolex movements and will usually clean one fairly cheap but when they see the complete watch...they get scared and the price skyrockets. It's called 'Rolexiti$'. I figure projects using genuine movements etc are Ok as long as the watch is still worth the sum of the parts. I did not follow this rule on my 1655 project though as it is around $3k and not running yet. Otoh, I have a V72 and if I bought a DW case and dial, I could probably come out Ok if everything went all right with the movement. Maybe I will get a case and see how it goes. Do it in steps... 1...clean and oil the V72 movement and get everything working right before putting the dial and hands on it 2...install the dial and hands 3...get the case ready - case tube, crown, crystal etc 4...make sure the bracelet fits the case 5...install the mvt/dial in the case 6...road test 7...don't drop it
  13. "I always appreciate your insight!" Thanks! Now I favor the 160xx over a 1600 or 162xx because: 1...They are close to a 1016 in appearance and usually cheaper than a 162xx. 2...My spare 1603 case is too rusty to use. 2...I already have a 160xx. Subject to change of course... "I've always wondered about that switch to a 5.3mm tube, though. Oversupply at one of the Rolex warehouses? My 16203-based Explorer actually has a 6mm tube, following modifications by jmb. But that was due to an order screwup by a seller that rhymes with 'jeweler's fools', not because I was that obsessed with accuracy and rodeo robustness." I figure they went to the 5.3mm tube with 6.0mm crown so all dressy gent's rolex models...DJ, OPD, OP, AK, XI, etc could use the same machine tools and parts for the case tubes. Just use 5.3mm OD crowns on smaller watches and 6.0mm OD crowns on larger watches. This way they can make a new DJ for $392.15 instead of $392.35 (including box/paps).
  14. "I just bought a DW case and will try that for this project. I will only use his mid case as his bezel is not gen. like construction but the upside is his case will accept a gen. 1570." I had two of the DW '1680' cases that we got on eBay a while back and they were not gen-spec as they were claimed to be so I sent them back. Does your case have rounded sides like a DJ? These did. They also had a very shallow gasket groove in the caseback so a gen-spec gasket would not work...you have to use a thin flat gasket. The rotating bezel was held on the inner bezel by a spring wire and the inner bezel would not work with a gen-spec 127 crystal...it just dropped down over it and the springbar holes were too small for submariner spec springbars. A 1570/75 with genuine dial fit just fine though. I came out on the short end on that deal and suspect that DW did too. A guy who worked for us handled the deal because I did not have a PayPal account. There was a delay on delivery of the cases so DW refunded the $$ after a couple months. Then they arrived (ordered 11-26-10 and arrived 2-8-11). Because they were not gen-spec, I gave them to the PayPay guy to send back. He still had the DW PP refund in his bank account when I gave him the cases to send back because I was still looking for a good 1680 case. Shortly after I gave him the cases to send back, he quit his job for other reasons (too lazy to work) and dropped under the radar with my $$ and probably the DW cases as we had not heard from DW up until he took off.
  15. "I recently bought a 16000-series case (for $66!) so I could put together a Datejust franken. However, I'm still waiting for a few parts to come in, so I've had this case sitting on my desk for the last month. And the more I looked at it, the more I started thinking about Explorers. (Naturally). Specifically, I wondered how it would look with a Tropic 22, and a spare jmb bezel I had in my parts drawer." I have a 160xx and it will be the next '1016' project. The main difference in assembly is that a 3035 is about .4mm taller from the stem centerline to the top of the dial than a 3135 so the Eta etc will have to be 'thickened' somehow to work in a 160xx case compared to a 162xx case. "So why not a 160xx? It's like a mix between the 16xx and the later 162xx. The lugs of this 16014 are a bit thicker than the 1601's--by 0.5mm at the center of the case. And compared to the 16203, the tops of the 16014's lugs have that gentle curve seen on older Rolex designs. Finally, while I didn't photograph the casebacks, I can say that the 16014's has a greater resemblance to the 1016's caseback than the others do." I agree the 160xx is closer to a 1016 than a 162xx and I really think the 160xx is a better choice...and they usually cost less than a 162xx. Someting else...I bet the 6.0mm crown on a 5.3mm tube on a 162xx is not as rugged as a 6.0mm crown mounted on a regular 6.0mm tube on a 160xx because the little skinny 5.3 tube looks like it would be easier to knock off in a plane crash, rodeo, bar fight etc. It's very small where it screws into the case. "Another feature that I wanted to check was the rehaut. The depth and profile of the 16203's rehaut is spot-on with the 1016's, while the 1601's is noticeably shallower." The 'pie pan' dials on 1601/3 etc were an attempt to make the watches appear to be thinner like the 'pie pan' dial Omega Constellations of the same era. Since the center of the dial and the hands were mounted higher in the case, maybe they could use a shallower 'rehaut' than the 1016 with a flat dial. This is one good reason why the 160xx is a better case for a 1016 project than a 1600 case....and the 160xx has a 6.0mm case tube where the 162xx uses a 5.3mm tube with the goofy 5.3/6.0mm combo crown. "The 16014's rehaut isn't as deep as the 16203's, but it has a more vertical profile than the 1601. A pretty good compromise, all things considered." I agree 100%. "Am I missing something that disqualifies the 16xxx from the "Best 1016 Impersonator" contest?" Nope, ya hit da nail on da head.
  16. "The feet on the dial are at 25 and 55 minutes - I'm guessing that's for an ETA movement?" Rolex 1530/60/70 etc dial feet are at 30 and 57.
  17. "I have been doing much research and found a possible source for a Gen tropic 116. However, it costs US$200 for it. When you decide on the Sterny crystal, did you do much comparision b/w the gen, Sterny and Clark's version?" Sternkreuz 30.15 OD 28.9mm ID 4.65mm high close to the edge 6.08mm high at magnifier Genuine 30.25 OD 29.0mm ID 5.1mm high close to the edge 6.45mm high at magnifier The 'close to the edge' measurements depend on how close you measure to the edge. If you move a few mm toward the center, the figure rapidly gets higher because of the slight dome.
  18. "I was searching for these, too, and found that same supplier. I simply bought one for my project from PBDad since he was going to be doing the installation, anyhow. It was also fully serviced and regulated. Of course, it cost more than $80." I bought a couple a while back from a supply house in the USA for about $100 each and they were new but needed to be cleaned/oiled so you did Ok. When I ordered them, they told me they were probably dried out. My guess is a new 2846 fresh cleaned/oiled is worth $125 to $200 now with all the price increases etc. In another year they might be $300... Saw on TZ that the swiss government gave swatch permission to cut movement production. This was posted June 8 on TZ public forum... June 8 (Bloomberg) -- Swatch Group AG, the biggest maker of Swiss watch motors, will be allowed to start reducing deliveries to competing timepiece manufacturers next year as it seeks to end a regulatory requirement that it sell components to rivals. Swatch, the Biel, Switzerland-based maker of the Omega and Breguet brands, will be permitted to scale back sales of mechanical movements to third parties to 85 percent of the level sold in 2010, the country’s competition regulator, Comco, said today in a statement. The world’s biggest watchmaker has been required to supply movements to third parties because of its dominant position. Swatch’s ETA unit manufactures as many as 80 percent of the mechanisms made in Switzerland, according to a Sanford C. Bernstein estimate. Swatch has sought permission from Comco since 2009 to choose who it sells movements to. The company has shown that it’s willing to accept a “gradual” solution, Comco said. Swatch rose as much as 40 centimes, or 0.1 percent, to 403.60 Swiss francs and was trading at 403.50 francs as of 9:48 a.m. in Zurich. Next year’s permitted reduction in motor deliveries forms a provisional measure while the regulator conducts an investigation into the matter, Comco said. 'motor' = movements
  19. "The saddest part about this is that with Rolex tightening restrictions on the parts supply, independent watchmakers, many of whom were Rolex-trained & who do not have the luxury of spending hours/days/weeks trolling ebay, are no longer functionally able to repair a Rolex watch." Rolex is one of the very few outfits in the world who can get by with this...sell a man a common item but refuse to sell parts to the repair shop of his choice. What if your Swastiki computer needed a $10 part and you were forced to send it back to Swastiki and pay $400 for a 'overhaul'? I doubt this policy would last very long. Otoh it seems like AD shopper type rolex owners are Ok with 'bending over' when service is needed and rarely complain. I doubt I am the only one who laid down their genuine rolex and put on a replica/Frankenwatch because of this.
  20. "I find this to be an interesting topic as well. The Chinese ETA is cheaper, but at the end of the day, if i'm buying a replica of a high quality watch that i'm going to enjoy, having a good movement is a plus, and if i ever have to sell it, there looks to be more interest in a swiss movement over chinese. If it's just entirely for show, and to try and get laid here and there no one is the wiser.." It's like FxrAndy said: "My opinion is to get the chinese copy of the ETA at least it will be new. But a swiss one can be serviced and spares are available." If I was going to buy a watch to wear for a few years...I would probably buy the etaclone version and wear it until it quits, then put a genuine swiss Eta in it. When you pay extra for 'guaranteed swiss Eta' there is no telling what you might get...new swiss Eta (unlikely)...new old stock dried out swiss Eta (maybe)...worn out/dry/dirty/ swiss Eta...(probably)...Asian etaclone (usually). I have purchased two watches 'guaranteed to be swiss Eta' in the past couple years and they were etaclones. Both quit in a few months and I am putting a genuine eta in one now. The good thing is everything fits the swiss Eta...dial, hands etc. Have a 2836 etaclone apart now...the roller jewel fell out. That' a new one! They usually just grind to a halt because of being dry or dirty. I will say this...if an etaclone is cleaned and oiled they seem to run just fine. Not many etaclone repair parts available in the USA though. Same goes for Asian '21 jewel' movements...but they are cheap to replace.
  21. "Heck, I'm thinking it's around 1960. Like a 6694 Oysterdate Precision- these were produced into the early 80's, later models had the stick markers. This dial has the earlier hour markers, but the later straight hands. I agree with JAG's evaluation- $850+ or -." I agree. Oysterdate on the dial = manual wind with slow set date, cal 1215/1225. Dial markers look like 1960's and the hands may be later replacements. I have a 6694 (882xxxx serial number) made in the mid 1980s with flat top cyclops crystal, rectangular applied markers with luminous dots at the edge, and luminous square tip hands. It looks a bit more 'modern' than the one in the picture but they are essentially the same watch. Genuine hoods and bracelets are hard to find. One of the best watches rolex made imho.
  22. "The crown height difference is not much between a 3135/3035 compared to a 2892/2824 but miles out with a 2836." A 3035 will not work properly in a case made for a 3135 as the stem will be in a serious bind because of the (approximate) additional .4mm distance from stem to dial with the 3035. This offset is amplified because the rolex movement takes up most of the space in the case so the movement is very close to the case tube and this will not tolerate much stem misalignment. Smaller movements that are farther from the case tube can stand more offset. A lady size Eta 2671 in a submariner case can stand quite a bit of stem misalignment for example. "If you start putting 3135's in these things they're getting too close to gen cost to build once you figure gen dial, insert, hands, crystal etc. If it was a rare ltd edition or rare vintage then yes that would be worth while but no way on a common regular modern sub." True, and I do not trust these replica cases to be WR to much depth. I do not want a waterlogged 3135. A waterlogged 2824/2836 is bad enough. I've had a few of them. "i dont get this fanaticism over having a gen movement, i know modern 16610s that are true to 3-4secs a day, compare a 2892 at $200 to a 3135 at over $1200, whats the point really. that extra $1000 buys all sorts of other visually gen goodies. even vintage, ETA is good enough for the COSC certified RADO diastar one at 21.6bph , Bulova, Enicar, Doxa, OMEGA, etc etc. is a gen rolex movement really worth 6X the price?" I agree 100%. It is not just the initial cost of the genuine movement/dial/hands/repair parts, you also have to figure the cost when the watch is dropped, drowned, lost, or stolen. Things like that happen everyday and I can take a $600 hit a lot better than a $2500 hit. The major reason for replicas in the first place is to save $$ and have fun. Too much genuine = too much $$ and not as much fun. I rest my case... (pun!).
  23. "The old bezel with the 'bent paper clip' is the old bastard rep style. Ironically, Rolex used it on early subs- 6538, 5508, 6542 (GMT), etc, but changed with the 5513/5512/1680." I have seen a few replica vintage subs with spring wires, the first one was from Paul at Abay and it had the crystal just barely pressed/glued down on the case neck and the retaining wire in the rotating bezel held the rotating bezel on by catching in the empty space between the top of the case and the bottom edge of the crystal. If you pulled on the rotating bezel with your fingers or bumped it against a door frame etc...both the crystal and rotating bezel fell off. Have also seen a few with an inner bezel (crystal retaining bezel) with a lip at the top where the spring wire slipped under the lip to hold the rotating bezel on the case. The spring wire is captured in a channel cut in the rotating bezel. This setup works Ok although it is not original to 5512/1680. On two DW sub cases I had a while back, this was the method of mounting the rotating bezel. The problems with the spring wire mounting method come about when you pry the bezel off. You can: 1...Bend the rotating bezel. 2...Chip the spring wire channel in the rotating bezel during removal or chip the inner bezel lip when the spring wire slips past it while removing the rotating bezel. 3...The blade used to pry the rotating bezel off can chip the lip on the inner bezel. Genuine construction has a crystal retainer bezel with a lip and the rotating bezel snaps over the lip. The catch is that every time you r/r the rotating bezel, you shave a little metal off both bezels making the fit a tiny bit looser. This method is the easy to r/r but it also allows the rotating bezel to be knocked or pulled off when it gets caught or bumps something. On genuine submariners with gold bezels, you can sometimes pop the rotating bezel off with your thumbs from the bottom side or snap it off from the top with your fingers. "Don't know how much mixing and matching you can do with the two cases you have, all you can do is try." AG is right, it depends on the case and it's hit or miss...if the case neck is the same as a genuine 1680...you can mount a genuine spec crystal and look for an inner (crystal retaining) bezel and rotating bezel set to fit the crystal. On the DW 1680 case mentioned above, the crystal and inner bezel were not genuine spec...the case neck was Ok but the crystal wall was too thick and a genuine spec inner bezel will not fit. The DW 1680 cases had rounded outer sides like a DJ so maybe this is the way to spot one. No reflection on DW, he may not have been aware of this.
  24. Karma or 'what goes around'... I can recall four or five 'Karma Incidents' plus a rash of minor 'Karma Events'. I'll not write them out because some are pretty rough. I guess it is like Earl said on the 'My Name is Earl' TV show..."You may not believe in Karma, but Karma believes in you." The last things I had stolen were an aluminum bird bath out of the yard and an electric leaf blower out of a garden cart. The blower thief must have took off running because the 100 foot extension cord was stretched all the way to the street before it pulled off the blower. What does a thieving lowlife dildo need with a cast aluminum bird bath and a worn out leaf blower? The extension cord was worth more than the blower. On a lighter note, everybody has a bad day now and then... Earl: [drunk] I got a story about Hank. It was Steve Coco's bachelor party. And like all bachelor parties, there was some entertainment. Hank: Uh, Earl, maybe this isn't the best time... Earl: No, no, don't worry Hank, I won't tell the bad part. So anyway, Hank goes into the bathroom with this stripper, and, uh, you know, some stuff happens. So Hank comes out ten minutes later with his tongue down the stripper's throat, sayin' how she's gonna be his wife, and all of a sudden, somebody says to Hank, "I think she'd make a better husband, 'cause she's a duuUUUuuuUUuuUUUUUDE!"
  25. "Grease always seems to work its way to places that it shouldnt be...." True! Now and then I put a very small amount of Silicon 7 on a bezel when pressing it over a crystal to prevent it from sticking on the way down but I still worry about it making its way into the watch. So far, so good...if it will keep water out, it should keep grease out. "I wouldnt worry about that gasket unless you are planning to actually dive with your watch. I put them into mine because they are cheap, but I dont think its necessary for everyday use." I agree. No worry for desk divers. Since the early models did not have this gasket anyway, it was probably not that important. My guess is later cases were cut to accept this O ring in an attempt to keep water out from between the top of the case, the bottom of the bezel, and the base of the crystal because once water (especially salt water) gets in such a small space, it can stay wet for a looong time and do a lot of damage by starting and feeding corrosion. Corrosion = leaks. This is why you see corrosion around where caseback gaskets are mounted, under bezels, and between lugs...these areas trap dirt/moisture and feed corrosion. Three things to make steel watches last longer (Official FTC Ratings). : 1...Don't wear it (Foolproof). 2...Keep it dry (Fool Resistant). 3...Take it apart, clean the case, and change gaskets every few months (Fool Folly).
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