automatico

"So, the Cartel 1680 isn't even worth looking at for less than $150? What are the issues?" They are hit or miss in specs and overall quality. Most are made for Eta 28xx or Asian '21 jewel' movements, not rolex. Some are oem spec as far as case neck etc and will accept ST/Clark oem spec bezels, crystals etc but some are out of spec. Most have the correct case tube threads but the cases may not be machined for oem gaskets between the case tube and case. "Yuki said 1680 case is discontinued, though Ruby has them for $650 (ouch). If one were willing to drop $650 on the Ruby, what's needed to get a 2846 working? Spacer? And will an overlay solve the ETA datewheel location issue?" Iirc a Yuki 1680 was that much or more up until they were discontinued. Their 5512/13 cases were $600 each in mid 2014 with random serial numbers, special s/n were more. They discounted $50 each on two cases when I got a 5512 and a 5513 at the same time so it made them $550 each. The cases were top quality. An Eta 2846 is smaller in diameter than a rolex 15xx so any case made for a rolex movement will need a special spacer. DWOs come in different versions so you will need to zero in on one that suits you and track one down. They are a pain imho...hard to index/glue down over the original DW, then you will have to be sure there is enough room between the DWO and dial, next you have to make sure the hands mount far enough away from the dial...if not you will need a taller hour wheel, CP, center sweep pinion, hour wheel etc. And on and on... A 5512/13 project is much easier. "I like the idea of using an MBW, but they're hard to come by and when they do, the Ruby case is a small jump in $$ more." True. Since the last batch of MBK watches were over $400, an empty case will probably be that much by now. I posted some info about MBK cases at the top of the rolex section in the stickies. "The winding crown is too low on the Cartel cases and they are far too thick. They are pretty much all the same case, so 1680 is actually a 5513 and the dial opening is too small, so won’t take the good aftermarket 1680 dials if I remember correctly." Same with MBK...they are 1680 spec cases with a 5513 spec dial window. They are not overly thick though and the quality is first rate. Free advice: Find something inexpensive that you like and buy it now to wear while you go through the long drawn out process of putting a project watch together. It may take a few months...or a year. This is not meant to discourage anyone, it is just a word of advice from someone who has been around the block. Example...my '1655' project has been on/off for 5+ years. Why? Because GMT part$ are expensive and hard to find. Looks like someone else found this out the hard way, a 1575GMT rolex movement just went for $3600 on eBay: ROLEX GMT MASTER MOVEMENT Ref. 1570/1575 for GMT MASTER 1675 Explorer II, 1655 VINTAGE MOVEMENT / Fully Serviced / Sold AS IS eBay item number: 163171371202 Ended: Aug 06, 2018 , 10:29PM Winning bid: US $3,600.00 Shipping: $50.00 Expedited Shipping

On genuine watches a cal 3135 will not work in a case made for a cal 1570/5 date movement because the stem will not line up in the case tube. A 3035 will fit, depending on dial size. The beat rate is also wrong with the 3035 and 3135, both running at 28800 bph and a 1570/5 at 19800 bph. Cal 1530/1560 run at 18000 bph but they were not used in 1665 watches. The beat rate is really not important except it is a 'tell' because the second hand travel is much smoother on faster beat movements.

"I'd believe Rolex made it." I saw a 5514 on a genuine watch forum a few years back with a sidewinder clasp on it but can not find it now. The clasp I have looks much like the one in the picture except it has 4 holes toward the open end of the clasp, a small space, then three more holes where the one in the picture has 8 holes in a row. Mine has the 'bracelet keeper' notches between the first and second holes like the one pictured. It has a stamped sheet metal dive extension like came on earlier replica 16610 etc and hollow mid links with dead end screw holes...no hole on the side opposite the screw head. There are two pictured on here, six rows down: https://www.bing.com/images/search?q=rolex+5514+with+prototype+clasp&qpvt=rolex+5514+with+prototype+clasp&FORM=IGRE

https://www.ebay.com/itm/-/221920434323?nordt=true&orig_cvip=true&rt=nc&_trksid=p2047675.l10137 Supposedly a 5513 with a 'prototype' sidewinder clasp. My guess is it was a project watch that got removed from eBay because of complaints. It disappeared saying "This listing was ended by the seller because the item is no longer available." a few days after it was posted. The listing is a few years old and the link may be dead...if it comes up showing something else, scroll down or click on 'listing' in the highlighted banner at the top. I've mentioned this clasp before but would like to see what others have to say about it...did they make some or not? I never saw one except under suspicious circumstances. I have a similar clasp (Paul/Abay!) and thought about putting it on a later bracelet and making a 5513/5514 type project watch with HE valve. Since the 5514 was made in the early 1970s it would need a later oyster bracelet, not a rivet type. Some 5514 info: http://www.drsd.com/watch-info/comex/comex-5514.html They show one with a folded oyster so maybe some had them...or it is what they had handy at the time.

"Am I right?" Yep.

"I recently bought got a gen rolex date 15000 case set, it came with everything except a dial, dut im wondering if a dial from a 1500 date will fit, so i can expand my search." Same OD, different dial foot location. 1530 base dials: OPD 26.9mm AK 27.0mm Slow set DJ dials are easy to spot with 'pie pan' shape. Dial feet approx. 30m and 54m A 1575 slow set date movement/dial will work in a 15000 case but not a 15200 case. Movement/dial from a 15200 case will not work in a 15000 case. 30xx/31xx dials are interchangeable. OPD 26.9mm DJ 27.85mm Dial feet approx. 13m and 37m Newer oversize DJ...the dial feet and date are farther from center. "Also, is the hand length the same as a datejust?" From the factory, no. Aftmkt, probably yes. Most aftmkt dress hands for eta/tudor are made for 34mm or 36mm cases. They may be the same hands. Hand length is measured from the center of the hole to the tip of the long end. Center hole sizes are in mm...a #130 hand hole is 1.3mm. A #25 sweep sec hand hole is .25mm. https://blog.esslinger.com/how-to-measure-watch-hands/

"I considered to make some (case clamps) out of old mainspring according to an old post I remember reading here." I have made quite a few sets out of steel automotive 'feeler gauge' stock. They come in different thicknesses and are easy to drill and form to size. Use the thickest gauge you can get by with but make sure it allows the winding rotor to clear. Make sure the casing screws are long enough to fill the threads in the movement plate but not so long that they pass through and hit anything inside the movement. 1...Drill the hole first. 2...Form the end with the hole in it first. 3...Trim to length and width. I use a battery Dremel with a fiber cut-off wheel. 4...Bend the clamp if needed. 5...If it does not want to start into the groove in the case. you may have to sharpen the tip of the clamp or grind a shallow notch in the spacer to lower the clamp. One of the most important things is to have a movement spacer that is a precise fit around the movement and inside the case to keep everything in place when pulling/pushing on the crown. The clamps help a lot but the spacer takes most of the side loads. Being able to mount the dial to the top side of the movement spacer is much better (imho) than mounting it directly to the top plate of the movement or a flimsy calendar spacer. Depending on case clamp pressure to hold the dial in place may or may not work. Otoh I have had so much trouble with dial dots that I have stopped using them to hold a dial in place. I did use a few between the movement spacer and movement on my '1016' project to tighten the fit between the ID of the spacer and OD of the movement and to keep the dial and spacer from turning on the movement. I glued the dial to the spacer with clear Gorilla Glue. So far so good... https://rwg.cc/topic/183724-dial-with-no-feet/ https://rwg.cc/topic/192105-jmb-1016-project-update/ https://rwg.cc/topic/167880-the-built-of-my-franken-rolex-explorer-i-ref-1016/#comment-1397861

"I think it's safe to say you've (JMB) still got the 1016 case set market cornered." Yep. Bought two, one went MIA in my shop. Put out a BOLO. No show. I'm thinking it had a string tied to it and he yanked it back. 850 miles of string gotta show up sooner or later...

Every rolex guy knows the 1655 is the McQueen watch even though he did not often wear one. McQueen wore a 5512 on and off movie sets so that is probably the 'real' Steve McQueen watch. He also wore a Heuer Monaco and others in movies but they are all expensive today and I for one can not afford any of them if I wanted an iconic 'McQueen' watch. Otoh, one affordable McQueen watch that goes relatively unnoticed is the Benrus 'Bullitt' watch...a Benrus 3061 manual wind watch with military style black dial. They got hot enough a few years back that the Benrus brand owner at the time made another batch of them. Here is one on eBay (sorta pricey imho): https://www.ebay.com/itm/Benrus-Military-Watch-Re-Issue-50th-Anniversary-of-D-Day-17-Jewel-Like-New-/253776097776 I do not have a shiny case Benrus Bullitt 3061 with signed military type dial but do have a couple 1960s milspec issued Benrus watches. They are similar to the Bullitt watch except the cases are Parkerized and the (tritium) dials are unsigned. Since I bought the milspec watches they have gone up a lot so looking back I did Ok. I have a few Benrus 3061 watches with dress dials but they are not worth much compared to a Bullitt. Quote from 'BAMF Style': "As a watch aficionado well-known for his Rolex Submariner and TAG Heuer Monaco in real life, McQueen sported a much more practical timepiece that would make sense on Frank Bullitt’s wrist. The watch has been positively identified as a Benrus Series #3061, a commercial version of a watch issued to U.S. GIs during the Vietnam War with a more civilian-friendly polished steel case on a well-worn black leather strap. The 17-jewel hand-wound watch has a branded black dial with a red-tipped second hand arrow, which Worn & Wound notes as differentiation from Benrus’ military Mil-W-3818B and GG-W-113 models that used the same Benrus DR 2F2 hacking movement." https://wornandwound.com/review/affordable-vintage-bullitt-benrus/ https://www.mywatchmart.com/benrus/ McQueen Bullitt movie BAMF Style article: https://bamfstyle.com/2012/10/01/bullitt/

"The correct hands can be found on a bunch of Nivada watches, but for some completely inexplicable reason, Nivada dive watches are suddenly expensive." Nivada is a sub brand of Croton. Maybe some vintage Croton watches had similar hands.

Looks good! Just now looked at my JMB '1016'...the minute hand almost touches the minute markers and the second hand covers about .5mm of the marker. The minute markers are a hair shorter than yours. The hands are from ST. Most of the aftmkt mercedes hands are made for 5512/13/1680 with 26 or 26.5mm dials so they might be a bit short on 1016 projects. I have a set of nos 1016 tritium hands somewhere but do not want to hunt them out right now to measure them (no telling where they are). They may have sent submariner hands anyway (early to mid 1990s). I wore the '1016' for a few weeks after I got it together but parked it and have not worn it since. It seemed to run Ok considering that the 'combo' movement was made up using parts from two different beat rate movements. First it had a regular clasp hollow mid link replica '78360', then a 'Mary 7836'. One good thing about these watches is you can go from 'early vintage' to 'late vintage' just by changing bracelet types. I'll probably go with the '78360' next time around because the '7836' is on an F-stein '5512.' I changed the connecting link on the '7836' (the mid link that connects to the spring bars) to the proper rounded type to make it look a little better, it came with 'figure 8' connecting links. I like straps too but hot humid weather is rough on leather. Never cared much for NATO type straps. The case has no 'lug notes' so a bracelet is probably the better choice. Lug notes?

"No, not that modern crap." Cool project! I have a watch with a similar case that I've had for many years and iirc it has an AS movement with the dial signed 'Waltham' and the rotor signed 'Elgin' (the rotor has been swapped out). I have not seen it in years and looked for it but can not find it. If it turns up I'll post a note in this thread if there is anything interesting about it. Waltham had quite a few case designs and mine may not be the same as yours. I did find a nos Benrus diver salesman's sample (case/dial/hands/crown/signed bracelet complete but no movement), a 1960s/1970s steel/auto Croton 200M diver, and a vintage Stowa Seatime in the project box while I was looking. I might have more projects than runners... Waltham info: https://www.timepiecechronicle.com/features/2017/1/9/lost-to-time-waltham-watch-company

"Never believe the 1:1 hype. Believe what you see, and read the reviews on the boards please. No genuine parts will be used in replicas, and no design will be 1:1, despite their blatant claims." True, true, true. Otoh they probably could make almost identical to genuine cases and bracelets IF they wanted to. Dials and hands...Maybe. Movements...Not likely. The "1:1" movements (tongue firmly in cheek) seem to have Many Gremlins. Make that Many, Many Gremlins...more than AMC ever made in the 1970s. As time goes by, some of the 'Boutique' vintage replica cases may pass for genuine, no telling about current models even though some are very close to genuine straight from the factories. Genuine vs replica Gremlins! Gremlin X Levi's Edition. I leased one of these new in 1973, $91.81 a month including tax, $0 down...258 six shooter, AC, three on the floor. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oI5e8qSbEgA

Btw, It might not be a good idea to keep winding it. The winding parts in Asian etaclone movements are not known to be overly rugged...or in swiss Etas either for that matter. When you hand wind Eta 2824/36/46 etc type movements, the reverser wheels are turning faster than normal and can cause more wear than usual. The little 'nub' cast on the movement plate that the crown wheel turns on can also wear if not properly lubricated. There is also some wear on the plate where the stem passes through when hand winding if not lubricated properly but it is usually not much of a problem. It's probably an easy fix though.

And I thought eBay was pretty bad. Genuine 1675 case back on VRM: https://www.tapatalk.com/groups/vintagerolexforum/fs-rolex-1675-case-back-only-t243109.html Junk like this is showing up for sale at ridiculous prices all over the inter-nut. It makes me wonder if these characters are looking for a green horn noob dumb enough to buy it or they actually believe scrap-crap like this has this much value. Looks like a $40 obo item to me. Otoh it may have value to someone who has almost all of the parts to put a genuine! 1675 together but needs a genuine! case back to go with their genuine! swiss cheese case to complete the project so they can sell it to a noob walking sideways with $100 bills falling out of their pockets. Btw, this case back is...wait for it...Now On Sale! It started out at $1600. Marked down to $1300! Now Blow Out Priced At Only $1200! Canyoubelieveit! Tell your friends! https://www.tapatalk.com/groups/vintagerolexforum/fs-rolex-1675-case-back-only-t244173.html Better hurry, looks like it's melting around the edges.

"Those 2 rolex sold now would have fetched a nice margin." That's for sure. Since the tutone 1675 had the same reference number as an all steel model you could change it to all steel if that is what you want. I looked the Hamilton auto chronographs up. The last four new Hamilton 'Chronomatics' I bought were $275 each with b/p October 7, 1997. Flash forward...bought a 'like new' late model 25 jewel Hamilton 7750 Khaki with SEL type bracelet, machined steel clasp (not stamped), and sapphire crystal March 23, 2015 for $250 at a friend's pawn, gold/jewelry buying shop. It had the wrong box and a short bracelet (2 links missing) but was in same as new condition. Have seen few good Hamilton deals since then except 992/992B RR grade pocket watches. The PW were relatively cheap because no one knows where to get them fixed at a reasonable price...and I know a PW guy. Last good rolex deal was a 'like new' silver dial 14010M AK for $1000 about a year and a half ago. It was a 25 year award watch but had been stored a while. It has stamped hoods and clasp with cal 3130 mvt. Thanks to eBay, everyone jacks their prices up now and good buys are few and far between. My 'like new' = 95% condition and showing no wear. Links may have been r/r. No scuffs or scratches. 'Same as new' would be in new condition but maybe missing stickers. I have see a lot of 'brand new' watches at ADs that would not pass a 'like new' condition standard. I would call them 'slightly used'.

Another bracelet comparison: https://www.tapatalk.com/groups/vintagerolexforum/new-fake-bracelets-t244233.html With a few exceptions it looks like the replica holds its own. Then there is the price...$700 or more vs $125 or so.

No one answered yet so I'll give it a go. My guess is the coronets are die struck and the rep dial guys just never took the time to make a 100% accurate stamping die to make them. Btw, the coronet on my 'first batch' ST19 Daytona has turned shiny black from originally being silvertone. The rest of the dial is fine and the watch has never been apart. I wonder what's up with that? 'First batch' = oversize case, glass crystal, equally spaced pushers, 20mm lug spacing, good dial.

From time to time I post some watch prices from the past. I have a mail order list from Jeff Bernard dated 11-29-97, here are a few prices. May have posted some of the same prices before...can not remember. Aristo NOS SS 7750 auto chronograph...$490 They are still around. There is a new Aristo Val/Eta 7750 Automatic on eBay now for $1157 + $42 shipping (from Germany). eBay item number: 323201567695 ($490 in 1997 is $763 now) Brietling Navitimer quartz, titanium in 90% condition...$895 (not much of a buy imho but they were hot back then) Omega 14k bumper auto, 85% condition...$450 Sector ADV quartz SS, 98% condition...$225 (can buy them now and then new or like new for $100 or so) Rolex GMT Master SS/14k slow set, 90% condition...$1900 Rolex Submariner 1680 in 90%+ condition...$1795 Hamilton Khaki 7750 SS chronograph on steel bracelet, NIB...$350. I bought some for $250, they were blown out when Hamilton closed their outlet stores and they all had 17 jewel movements, not 25. A guy who worked for SMH back then (now Swatch) told me the cases, bracelets, dials, hands, boxes etc were made in China. Only the movement was swiss made and it was the lowest grade available. Omega 'Bond' Seamaster automatic, NIB...$1050 TAG Heuer quartz 6000 SS/18K, 90% condition...$1050 (probably be lucky to get $600 for one now, except maybe on eBay) Omega SS auto chronograph with Eta/Val 750 on bracelet, 95% condition...$650 Omega Seamaster 120 quartz, SS with bracelet, NIB...$550 Omega Shumacher SS auto chronograph w/BP...$890 I bought a few for as low as $450 new in the 'Indy tire' box. Tutone SS/18k dress models in regular boxes - not Shumachers - were $650 to $750. The movements were fairly new and quickly earned the reputation of being junk. They were basically an Eta 2892 with a 'piggyback' Dubois-Depraz chronograph module. Many High Brow brands use them now so they must be better than they used to be.

First off...my advice is not worth much, if anything. Yuki dial...be very careful having it 'vintagized'...this is when many good dials go bad. The 1016 dial is a hard one to 'relume' because it has markers and numbers. Numbers are hard to do. I have a Yuki '1016' dial and it has rolex 1530/1570 dial feet but two versions of Eta '1016' dials are shown on the Yuki website. Rolex 1530/70 feet are at 30 and 57 minutes. Yuki hands...I have used them with pretty good luck. Some of the 'gen spec' examples had to be broached to fit. I use ST hands a lot but I am not very particular and what suits me may not pass inspection for others. Your case choices are fine imho. Movement...I used a swisseta 2824/2846 'combo' movement in my JMB '1016' and it worked out all right. Had to go with the slimmer 2824 plate set because the case was made for a 2824 and I used 2846 running gear for a slower beat rate. A hassle for sure but it fits the case and runs Ok. The 2846 is basically a lower grade movement and they are subject to running errors but they work better than Asian clones imho. Everyday wear is fine but if you rapidly spin it around in a tight circle (with dial up or down) to 'spin wind' it, the movement may gain a few seconds. Most movements are prone to gain a bit when this is done but lower grade movements gain more. I have a cheapo '5513' with a Seagull ST16 and I can spin it around for a couple minutes and it may gain 5 or 6 seconds. Many lower grade movements will gain time when they are getting low on mainspring reserve too. Q...Why spin the watch around to wind it? Why not just manually wind it? A...Because I can 'spin wind' the watch without unscrewing the delicate replica crown. 'Delicate' = subpar threads/gasket on crown. I rethreaded the JMB case and installed an older style ST 6mm case tube but used a replica crown and these crowns usually only have a few dozen 'ons' and 'offs' in 'em. The spring and hex clutch in the crown tube are not very reliable either and they often go bad.

My guess is that it would be hard to repair the 4 on the dial because the repair would have to match the color, thickness, and texture of the original number or it will look worse than it does now. The other dial is not bad enough to repair imho. Something else...I doubt many dial refinishers will have an image plate for this dial and if they add the cost of having a plate made to the job, it will be expensive. Very few dial refinishers will attempt such a repair because it is easier to refinish the complete dial. Otoh very few dial refinishers can duplicate the factory's first class painting and printing so paying $75 to $150 for a refinishing job usually results in disappointment (in my experience). I am in the USA and have had 100+ dials refinished over the years by 4 or 5 different refinishers. The only dials that ever came back 'good as new' were vintage dials for Elgin, Hamilton, Ball etc watches. Most rolex, omega tudor etc were only fair at best, and that is being generous. Some of the best jobs were vintage Ball Trainmaster RR dials done by International Dial Co in Ohio. There was a catch though...the white base color was so slick that a few of the printed black numbers slid out of place inside the glassine shipping envelopes. Never saw that before. Saw you have a 6694. One of my favorites, have one in 85/90% condition (561xxxx) and one nos (882xxxx), both with silver dials. Paid $925 at AD for the nos in June 1989 and $850 for the other one in like new condition August 2001. I wore it quite a bit.

"It's a nice town. No watchmakers tho." I live in a county with an area of 569 square miles...28,000 population. One retail watch repair shop with a part time AWI certified repair guy age 80+/-. Does good work but slowwwww... Next county over is 526 square miles, population 432,000. Two or three watch repair crooks. None I would trust. None certified. Meanwhile there are retail cell phone shops on every corner. The cell phone/smartyass watch is now the watch of the day. It is getting to be like this everywhere. Gotta go, cell phone call.

The 1600 models have a 'pie pan' dial that allows the movement to mount higher in the case to give the illusion of a thinner watch. Omega and a few other companies also did this in the 1960s because 'Thin Is In". Back then. This means you may need to use a genuine type pie pan dial in order to stuff an Eta 2824 etc movement into the watch. An Eta 2836 may be a 'no go' in this case but I have never tried it. Others on the forum can chime in. The bottom line on genuine 1600 cases is that they are thinner than the average project case. A rolex 16000 case uses a flat dial and cal 3035 movement. There is room for an Eta 2836 in one. A rolex 16200 case has a cal 3135 and it is thinner than a cal 3035 so a flat dial and Eta 2836 with DWO may not work. Never tried it. An Eta 2824 is 28800 beats per hour and is faster than the 1600 DJ with a 1530 base movement. They were 18000bph and 19800bph depending on the year the watch was made. Rolex 16000 and 16200 movements were all 28800bph...same as Eta 28xx movements. A 2836 date movement will have more room on the top side for a DWO after the day of the week parts are removed. The 2824 does not have as much room. Eta 28xx movements are 11.5 ligne size (26mm) and rolex movements are 12.5 ligne size (28.2mm) so you will need a special case spacer when using a genuine spec rolex case and Eta movement. I put a few DJ projects together using replica 16200 cases made for an Eta 2836 with DWO with aftmkt or genuine dials and tudor hands. A relatively low hassle/low buck solution but most of the cases have blind lug holes...aka 'no hole' cases so if you want the vintage look you will need to have the lug holes drilled...NOT as easy as it sounds. Easiest route is a replica 16200 case made for Eta 2836, proper dial, spacer, DWO etc. Go with fresh swiss 2836. No Asian Clones! (imho) Drill lugs if desired. There are quite a few threads on these projects on the forum. A good start: https://rwg.cc/topic/25638-want-to-put-eta-movement-in-gen-rolex-oyster-34mm-case/ Btw, I have the T69xxxx 15200 project watch with the nos chronometer grade Mido/Eta 12892 that 'Stilty' posted about in this thread. Bought it from him March 5, 2009. Best 'Frankenstein' I have...complete genuine case (like new), genuine dial, genuine modified hands, genuine date wheel etc. Still has the faded original green sticker on the case back iirc. FYI... The Mido/Eta 12892 is 12.5 ligne size same as rolex. The internal dimensions of the 15200 case are the same as any rolex case using the cal 3135. Rolex 3135 date wheels turn in the same direction as Eta 28xx. Rolex 15xx and 3035 DW turn in the opposite direction. Go to Google and search the projects out, most will come up from RWG. Find DWO on eBay under 'Eta date wheels'. Good luck!

GK: "I only swear by Vietnamese cases for vintage builds. They have the right general proportions and thickness (especially for the 1675), and they all have the correct crown/stem/tube height (unlike the Cartel / BP vintage / JKF watches which are designed to house the 2836-2 @ 2.25mm stem height or the 21j). Vietnamese cases might cost $800 each for a complete case set, but it saves me from headaches and paranoia from getting called imo. I wished there were more options between the price jump of a cartel/ BP vintage / JKF and a Vietnamese case. I could already confirm that a Helenarou 5513 case is very inferior to my Vietnamese 5513 case." I noticed the case has the O ring groove on the top side like later genuine watches...and MBK cases. Afaik MBK were some of the very few mainstream (affordable) replica cases with this groove and fairly accurate genuine specs/dimensions. So...I wonder if MBK and Vn cases are close to the same? IF they are...a first rate detailer (Rolojack!) could probably turn an MBK case into a masterpiece as well for a lot less $$ spent up front for the bare case. As I have said before, standard 55xx/1680 MBK cases are all 1680 spec and will accept a rlx 1570/5 and Eta 2836 with the only problem being the dial window is too small to properly work with a 26.5mm 1680 dial, an easy fix. Also, since the MBK case will take a rlx 1570/5 date movement, the crown location is correct for a 1680 but it is a hair too far toward the back for a 5512/13, but few will notice. The reason I posted this is because some members may have an MBK case and would like to have it 'souped up' to a top line case and not have to buy the $800 Vn case. Otoh one big problem with MBK cases is the ratty laser etched letters/numbers on the case and case back. PG: "...on your caseback where it says Rolex, it is stamped or engraved?" RJ: "This is stamped. However, the "stamped" look can be achieved with engraving: after engraving polish to clean edges, then wash the surface with acid to give a sandblasted look to the bottom of the letters/numbers and finally do the final brushed finish. Result will be perfect." Thanks. Good info. Acid = common muriatic (hydrochloric) acid maybe? I've cleaned a lot of rusty motorcycle gas tanks out with it.

"My build is linked below in my signature." A lot of good info. I should have snagged one of those dials. "Here's one that I did back 6-7 years ago." Looks good! Nice dial too. Looks a lot like the one I finished a few weeks ago. Mine has a JMB case, average dial, and same bracelet. "Never drilled the lugholes - too close for comfort!" This is a problem with a lot of these projects. Genuine 16xx cases do not have much metal on the lug tips, JMB cases might have a little more. I have seen pictures of genuine 1016 watches with holes pretty close to the lug tops too, probably polished too much. "...as I recall it ran around $500." Mine ended up about the same price: Dial from 'Stilty'...$60 more or less iirc (been a while, about 10 years). JMB case...can not remember exactly so I'll make it $200. Combo 2824/2846 movement...$100 more or less. Mary 7836 folded bracelet...$65 iirc. Spring bars, gaskets etc...$15. ST hands...around $15. Replica crown...$10. Case spacer...$5 Aggravation…$100. Btw, how much were the JMB cases 3 years ago?