automatico

"Get the worst 1675 you can find, and refinish the case. Buy a refinished or "rep" dial, if that's the piece that's bad and swap it out." Good advice! The 'deal killers' for me are hairspring/balance wheel trouble and rotted out cases.

A 1675 is nice but before I would spend $1000 to $2000 on a watch that you can buy genuine for $4000, I would build something that is currently selling for more than $4000 for about the same $$. A 1655 for instance. Advantages... No 'thin case' requirement. No rotating bezel to worry with. Lots of case choices that accept 6mm crowns. Easier to fit genuine spec crystals without the hassles with inner/outer bezel fit, getting knocked off/falling off etc. If you spend a little extra $$ on a 1655 dial rather than the 1675 case, you can end up with a convincing watch. You will have a replica of a $10k watch rather than a $4k watch. I have owned a few watches with DG GMT movements, both the old style with non adjustable 24 hour hands and the later models with adjustable 24 hour hands and even though they are Ok after c/o, I would try to use a swisseta with the Asian 24 hour hand modification in a 'keeper' watch because they are more reliable and all parts (except 24 hour parts) are easy to find. I have changed a few swisseta 2836 (already modified to GMT) over to 21600 bph by swapping the running guts out or putting the GMT works on a 2846 and they all worked fine. I tried one 1655 with a genuine rolex 1575 changed over to GMT with genuine parts and it sunk my boat ($$!). Lesson learned...stay away from genuine rolex movements in projects, especially GMT movements. eBay item 190878061947, probably a fair deal at today's 'no parts 4U' prices... http://www.ebay.com/itm/Genuine-ROLEX-WATCH-MOVEMENT-Cal-1575-GMT-1675-0-Recently-Serviced-Running-/190878061947?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item2c7138157b

"Apparently there are two versions of balance wheels for this movement caliber, one that runs at 18K and another that is 19.8K." All 1570 run at 19800...1530/1560 is 18000. Be careful if you buy another movement because there are sometimes 'put togethers' on eBay etc with a 1520 or 1560 movements sporting 1570 autowind assemblies. There are two balance staffs available depending on the collet. "I just had a situation with a 3035 balance and ended up getting a new one and when I received it the hairspring was tangled so I had to send the damn thing back." The 3035 is famous for three things: Hairsprings getting hung up on the balance [censored] from being slammed or dropped. Hairsprings coming loose from the collet (they are laser welded, the fix is a new balance complete). Broken top autowind rotor jewels. They are fairly fragile imho...I had one a while back on its third balance staff in a year. They seem to keep pretty good time though.

I like the 9015 but dials and hands for Etas will not fit them afaik and this sets it back quite a bit because so many project parts are made for Etas and mounting dials without dial feet is a hassle. This is where etaclones have the advantage. "It looks to be even better value when compared with a pre-sealed 2892 which is coming in at fairly steep £240 here in the UK. Over £60 more than the A10 and arguably inferior." £240 = $367US today and US supply houses are asking $275 to $325 for them. I passed on some nos watches in March 2000 with 2892-A2 for $200US each because I did not think they would ever be worth more. Looks like I was wrong. I did latch on to some nos Elgin automatics with Eta 2824-2 a few years back but did not buy many. 100% hindsight as usual.

"I bet some of those guys have no issue scavenging a 1570 from a Date or DJ to keep other watches running. Gee....one area where "matching numbers can't be proven" because Rolex is so tight lipped." You are 100% correct. Unless someone has the original registration papers with a vintage watch there is no way to tell if it has the original movement or not. On non chronometer models with no movement serial numbers it is no man's land...5513, 5514 etc. Only two things keep these watches from 'renewed production' today...perfect replica tritium dials/hands and cases. "Don't movements still have serial numbers (where year manufactured can be deduced from)?" I have never seen a list and I doubt anyone who does not work in the rwc switz main office could get the movement numbers vs mfg date/case number...even if such a list still exists or ever did. You can get within a few years of a 1520/1570/75/GMT movement production date going by if the movement hacks or not. I bet some of the TZ/VRF Vintage Purists have grail watches made out of parts from 6 or 8 different watches with a replica part or two thrown in (crystal retainer ring etc).

"I take it that there is not a lot I can do about this problem." When you swap a 2836/46 out for a 2824...the dial/movement combo is too thin and will be loose in the case and the stem/crown will not line up. There is no easy fix except to use a 2836/46 base movement. "So let me ask you guys this, what about a 2824-2? ..Dimensionally the same as 2824?" Exactly the same. "I tried to get one of the 2846 serviced by a reputable member on another board, but he wasn't as familiar with them and reluctant to take on the work." To get it fixed, dial MD2020.

"But I'm telling you right now, its like the crown isn't even attached to anything." The crown clutch might have bit the weenie. If you can shake it back and forth 20 or 25 times and it runs for 15 minutes or so...the movement is probably Ok.

Imho TZ has really gone downhill since Richard Paige sold it...too PC and not much of a sense of humor. http://www.timezone.com/2013/03/13/8350/ Typical TZ question... Can I wear my new submariner in the hot tub?

I looked on eBay and 1570 balances complete are going for over $400: http://www.ebay.com/sch/i.html?_odkw=rolex+parts&_osacat=0&_trksid=p2045573.m570.l1313.TR0.TRC0.Xbalance+wheel+rolex+parts&_nkw=balance+wheel+rolex+parts&_sacat=0&_from=R40 Imho, that's a lot of $$ for this part because you can usually find a running no date 1570 for about twice that much. For example, a local pawn shop has a ratty 1570 powered 34mm OP no date tutone with a stretched out swiss tt bracelet for $900...probably plus tax, not otd. It's worth more for parts than as a watch in the condition it is in because it needs c/o, case tube, crown, crystal, gaskets. springbars, bracelet repair etc. Iirc rolex watch co did not make the balance assemblies but they were made exclusively for rwc by Nivarox-FAR same as the later Clinergic 21 balance assemblies in the 3035 etc.

The only generic 1530/60/70/75 parts available are train wheels, sweep second pinions, canon pinions, balance staffs, intermediate wheels for autowind assembly, mainsprings, jewels, standard screws, rotor axles, stems, date wheels etc. Search for 'generic rolex movement parts' to find them. Movement plates, pallet forks, balance wheels, escape wheels, mainspring barrels, reversers, hairsprings etc are not available. "A rolex is forever...or until you run out of parts."

I always ask myself a few questions... The questions might be: How much $$ is it going to cost? How much is it really worth? How much $$ would it cost to have one just like it made by a trustworthy modder (or do it myself)? Is a genuine rolex movement important or would an Eta suffice? (Rolex 1530 escapement parts are getting hard to find) Rules of thumb: Eta = half price. 3-6-9 dials scream Fake! Alternatives: Make one just like it with first class dial and a lower cost case with Eta movement. Helenarou has one with all but the crown and dial for about $550US...but it has a sapphire crystal. Buy one ready made from a TD and have it modified. Buy a genuine 5513 etc.

"I just believe they really ruined the "submariner" as I know it with the new ceramic sub." +1 My favorite 'modern submariner' is the 16800 with printed markers although I am not a fan of the 3035 movement. The 16610 with lug holes and stamped bracelet hoods is probably the 'modern classic' submariner. The no date 14060 never seemed to catch on until it went out of production. My generation's classic submariners were the 5513 and 1680.

I have a 5 or 6 year old Citizen Eco-Drive with Luminova that I have charged many times by laying it out in the sun while doing yard work and the Luminova looks about the same as it did years ago. Sometimes I forget about it and it gets too hot to touch but it always keeps running. The dial appears to be plastic and still looks fine too. Flashback... When I was a kid in the 1960s, I used to hang around a gas station/truck stop on a busy highway and I saw a lot of 'Florida Watches'. I called them 'Florida Watches' because most trucks did not have air conditioning back then and the truck drivers would drive for thousands of miles back and forth to Florida hauling watermelons etc with their left arm (and watch) on the window sill in the hot summer sun. Many of the dials were faded to brown and the plastic crystals turned yellow. They had one sun burned arm and one regular arm. There was a sign on the highway back then that said: "30 Killed in 30 Days in the Next 30 Miles" "Speed Limit 65" "Drive Carefully" I remember a smartass guy from Ohio asking me if that was really true (while I scrubbed a thousand bugs off his windshield). I said "Yes." (it really was true) He said "Does that bother you boy?" I said "No." He said "Why not?" I said "Because they were all from Ohio." No such thing as PC back then.

"I found a local watchmaker that worked on vintage watches. He had a pretty good rep from the 2-3 people I talked to." I think this needs to be said: Anyone who can work on an automatic Eta 2824, AS1903, Bulova 11BLACD etc without screwing anything up should be able to work on a rolex 1530/60/70/75/GMT. Period. The only difference is there are no spare parts readily available for rolex. If the guy could not fix the watch (cp?) because of parts, he should still be sharp enough to diagnose the wrong screws and put the date in correspondence with the hands. I think maybe this guy needs to stick to changing batteries. "I've personally come to the conclusion that I'd rather spend the extra cash on other things rather than the Gen movements." I agree. I have some rolex parts and that is the only reason I can make a Frankenstein now and then. As for chasing rolex parts down...it is just not worth it imho. Especially 1575 GMT parts. Otoh, it's hard to justify a $400 dial, $500 bracelet, and $1200 case with a $75 Eta or $25 DG grinning at you when you remove the back.

"I love those water proof " do not take near water" watches" Me too. Much of the time '200 METERS' really means 200 meters horizontally from the boat dock, on dry land or in a boat, not vertically in the water.

The ISA 1198 usually does not give much trouble if they run to begin with. Were they new or used? One thing to watch for is sometimes the little 'crown' wheel that the stem goes through inside the movement will drop out of place when you remove the stem. I also got a few that did not have dial foot screws in the plates. The last batch I got have 'Geneva stripes' on the top plate. Fancy! I have used a lot of them in projects and replaced a few that went doa in watches of all types. They used to come in a kit to put them in 218 Accutrons but the kit was not too hot because the date numbers on the 1198 did not line up very well in the 218 dial window. The kit came with a piece of white plastic tape to stick under the dial so you could not see the movement. The 1198 used to be a favorite in pot metal fakes of all kinds. I threw an old submariner away a while back with one in it. Some of the 'pot metal' used in the old replicas should be called 'pop metal' because blisters 'pop up' all over them when the plating starts wearing off. I bet it is good for your skin too. They still can a bad one now and then...I bought three new 'canteen' style retro dive watches a while back with ISA 1198 in them and one was doa out of the box. They look pretty good with bead blasted steel screwback cases, big crown caps on a chain, khaki straps etc. ...with a warning to keep them away from water.

Bending dial feet to break them off can sometimes make a dimple on the dial that will show on the front side. On thin dials, it is usually better to cut the feet off with nippers then file or grind the rest of the dial foot off. Be careful not to allow the nippers to touch the dial and lever the dial foot up or side to side when cutting because it might make a dimple in the dial. When cutting a dial foot off, do not hold the dial tight or the cutter may bend the dial foot enough to make a dimple in the dial. Put something soft in the palm of your hand to rest the dial on without holding it and cut the dial foot off being careful not to allow any pressure on the dial...a piece of soft chamois etc . Paper might scratch a gloss dial.. You can sometimes get by with twisting dial feet back and forth to break them off without damage...no guarantee. When using a Dremel tool etc to grind the dial feet down, be careful not to get them hot enough to raise the paint on the front of the dial.

"If aftermarket crystals are the same quality how comes a lot of Franken builds go the gen crystal route and say that the difference is noticeable?? What do we think about this one??" My comment was about sapphire...acrylics are a different matter. Aftmkt acrylic crystals go from excellent to horrible. Genuine is usually best but cost much more. When you find a high quality aftmkt crystal, buy a couple spares because the next batch may be from another manufacturer and not as good.

The easiest fix is to trim the bracelet hood to fit the narrow end after a little careful filing to straighten the inside of the bent lug. Rolex watches may be Heroes but they are not very tough. They are more Higgins than Magnum. I have spread a lug or two.

Pink sapphire is pink sapphire no matter who made it. The difference between genuine and aftmkt is in the polishing, inclusions, cut of the edges etc. High grade aftmkt crystals from trusted material houses are as good as genuine except for the coronet emblem on later models. I have compared sapphire 295 DJ crystals from ST, STI, JB etc with genuine and they are identical. Be careful buying crystals on eBay from 'fly by night' websites...buy from known sellers like Clark etc. Most high quality aftmkt sapphire 295 for DJ/sub are now $30 to $40 because of competition. They used to be $50 to $75.

Careful...this is the same question I saw on TZ 15 years ago except they were concerned with genuine watches. This is a bad sign...

My favorite watches are the genuine 1675 GMT and 1016...with the 5513 and 1680 a distant third and fourth. If I was a 'rich guy', I would buy a genuine 1016. Being the 'poor guy' that I am...I already have a genuine 1675 and will not pay today's 1016 prices. No one makes an accurate replica 1016 that I know of but I could make a passable 1570 powered Frankenstein 1016 for $1500 or so and still be able to recover the $$ by selling the watch off a piece at a time as parts. Since I can do all the work myself, all I would have in it is the cost of the parts. I had one that looked pretty good but I sold it...16234 case, 2846 etc. If I had a pile of $$, I would not blow it on an overpriced new genuine watch because most of them fall in value like a rock. It's like drinking expensive beer and whizzing off a cliff...into the wind. Cheap beer will do the job.

"I find the serifs of the EXPLORER and ROLEX text look a bit strange..." Me too, the coronet, OP blurb and 'ROLEX' appear to be compressed. Compared to pics of genuine 1016 dials...this dial is only close, no cigar. There are not many affordable choices though.

Many will not agree with me but if I had an Asian etaclone that runs Ok, I would let it go until it stops or runs erratically...no service ahead of time. If it only needs c/o when it acts up, I might do it because I can do the work myself for free. If it needs parts...it goes in the parts box. I would not pay to have one serviced because imho they are simply not worth the $$ to c/o or repair because genuine swiss etas and swiss eta powered new and used watches are still plentiful and affordable on eBay etc. When the Asian etaclones do go doa, replace them with a new or properly serviced swiss eta...or start over with a new watch. Buying a new 'swiss eta' watch is a gamble because most are Asian etaclones no matter what the dealer says and if you do get a swiss eta, it may be a referb or needs service/parts. There are not many new swiss etas in replicas since swatch/eta cut the supply down and jacked the prices up. http://www.chronometrie.com/eta2824/eta2824.html

The way I see it (for vintage models anyway)... The better the case and dial...the more the basic watch will be worth. The more unaltered genuine parts in the watch...the more the watch will be worth. The higher genuine watches go...the more a genuine movement, crown etc Frankenstein will be worth (hopefully). As time goes by and the supply of genuine complete watches and parts dries up...the more a genuine movement Frankenstein will be worth. The only thing you can really count on is they will always be worth the current selling prices of the parts. Some free advice from experience... Go easy on artificially ageing vintage watches. You might like the wabi but very few buyers want watches that were beat up on purpose. Wear them to age them. Do not cut dial feet off of good genuine dials...that is what Yuki dials are for.