Mrkampa Posted October 7, 2009 Report Share Posted October 7, 2009 Ok, so im going to try out my watchmaker skills. but i cant figure out where to get some movement oil. Bought some tools from birdman, but he diddent have this! Thanks for all the help! I love RWG! -Kampa Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RWG Technical Posted October 7, 2009 Report Share Posted October 7, 2009 The oils are sort of the last thing you need, not the first. You can't oil a movement without fully taking it apart, to the last spring and screw. Then you have to clean the parts in special watch cleaning chemicals in an ultrasonic cleaner, then you have to rinse them twice, and dry them. Once dry, each part is inspected in detail, and as you assemble the movement each part that you install is tested to make sure it fits correctly and has the proper clearances. If everything is ok, the pivots and friction points are lubricated, with the correct type and amount of oil. A typical movement requires exact measured amounts of oils or it won't work correctly (miniscule amounts, in some cases the size of this dot "." is the correct amount of oil). For an automatic movement there are 6 different types of oils and grease used, a handwind normally uses 5 different types. One drop of oil is enough to fully lubricate a complete movement. If your not set up to do the above, and you simply "oil" your movement without doing any of the disassembly and cleaning, the movement will come to a grinding halt because of the friction caused by too much oil. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
offshore Posted October 7, 2009 Report Share Posted October 7, 2009 We will have a range of oils, and oilers, available via the shop, in about 10 days time. There are more than 200 items to catalogue yet!! Offshore Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jmb Posted October 7, 2009 Report Share Posted October 7, 2009 What kind of properties need to be adhered to as far as the cleaning solution? I have an ultrasonic cleaner and use it on motorcycle carburettors so the cleaning crap I have is rather "robust" and probably not suitable for watch gears! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bike Mike Posted October 7, 2009 Report Share Posted October 7, 2009 I just fully service a friends rep DD under the watchful eyes of my watch maker friend. Of course listen to The Zigmeister on this one....Side note, being a engineering I am very well mechanically inclined, I wrench on my motorcycle and cars, however I was not expect to be humbled by my first movement overhaul..... Taking the movement apart and cleaning it was the easy part. Inspecting each part, every thing straight, not out of round and clean little time consuming but still no big deal. Assembling the movement seemed straight forward and not that big of a deal. Placed a small amount in the mainspring barrel, closed it up and installed it, followed by the gear train, escapement wheel and pallet fork. Okay time for a little oil.....WHAT A PAIN IN THE A$$! Little too much oil, take movement apart, clean with Rodico and reassemble. Not enough oil, the time set felt very stiff when turning the crown. Flipped movement over, remove all the fun stuff on the dial side, apply a little more oil to the cannon pinion and drive wheel and reassemble. Flip movement back over and install balance wheel (oh this is fun too making sure the hair spring is in tension while getting the jewel that engages the pallet fork on the right side (sorry forgot the name of it). Apply oil to all the jewels. Removing and installing the cap jewels springs was a World of fun. Winding bridge on, dial, hands, movement cased, rotor installed and sealed up. Total time: 8hrs! Love the experience, and I can not wait to do it again, but as The Zigmeister said, getting just the right amount of oil takes skill and patience. Zig, Relative to oiling a movement, which do you prefer, needle dip oilers or the micro-capillary oilers? Pros/Cons of each? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RWG Technical Posted October 7, 2009 Report Share Posted October 7, 2009 @ JMB Your better off using L&R or Zenith watch cleaning solutions specifically designed for ultrasonic cleaners. You could also use Stoddard solvent and rinse with Methly Hydrate or Denatured Alchool. I use L&R cleaners and rinses. @ Bike Mike Congrats on getting it all done, it is very time consuming, even more so when something doesn't work properly and you have to find the problem. Oilers, yes, I use both types. Bergeron automatic 1A filled with 9010, Bergeron automatic 5 filled with D5, oiler pots filled with everything else and aluminum handled dip oilers for the other oils and grease. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bike Mike Posted October 7, 2009 Report Share Posted October 7, 2009 @ Bike Mike Congrats on getting it all done, it is very time consuming, even more so when something doesn't work properly and you have to find the problem. Oilers, yes, I use both types. Bergeron automatic 1A filled with 9010, Bergeron automatic 5 filled with D5, oiler pots filled with everything else and aluminum handled dip oilers for the other oils and grease. Thank you sir, that means a lot coming form you. Thanks for the info on the oilers. I am now in the process of deciding which ones I will need. Can't wait to do another movement....a soon as my right eye can refocus after looking through a loop for 8hrs....and hopefully complete the task in under 7hrs. this time. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mrkampa Posted October 7, 2009 Author Report Share Posted October 7, 2009 Thats why i need the oil, to start trying it out, learning and so on. but in order to start trying out oiling movements, i need some oil:) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vlaletom Posted October 7, 2009 Report Share Posted October 7, 2009 @ JMB Your better off using L&R or Zenith watch cleaning solutions specifically designed for ultrasonic cleaners. You could also use Stoddard solvent and rinse with Methly Hydrate or Denatured Alchool. I use L&R cleaners and rinses. As the master said. If you are in euro, in some country like france L&R are not distributed, but you will then find Elma range of product. Elmasonic cleanear, and Rubisol for cleaning and F80 to rince (used to be F45 but it has been dicontiued) On the oiling note, as The Zigmeister said, this is the most challenging ting to do in a typical service. I am just an aprentice, but i am now very confident witha basic ETA 28xx... I have no skill to build parts, but i have assembled & disasssembled many many ETAs. When it comes to oling, it is still so hard for me. Picking up the exact amount on the black oiler is a pain, you need to pick up from as little as the very end of the tip, to about olmost the full tip, depending on the part, and trust me the tip is soooo small. I try to do things correctly, so i somtime have to retry 15 times befor i am satisfied with the oling of one of the balance cap jewel. And each time you fail, you have to clean it again, befor retrying .... But if all this doesn't discourage you, i sugest you do the timezone course, to know where to oil, what oil to use, and what amount you need for each part. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RWG Technical Posted October 8, 2009 Report Share Posted October 8, 2009 Thats why i need the oil, to start trying it out, learning and so on. but in order to start trying out oiling movements, i need some oil:) The last thing you need is oil. In order to start, you have to begin at the beginning, not the end...re-read my first post and the others from learned members. Either your not understanding what is being said to you, or you're simply choosing to ignore the advice and keep on asking the same question over and over until you get the answer you want. If you don't believe our comments, please ask the same question on Time Zone and see what type of response you get there (bring your Nomex suit). I want to be a Surgeon, I am not a Doctor, I have zero medical training, BUT I have a scalpel and a thread and needle, now show me how to operate on someone. Sound dumb? You bet... Good luck. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vlaletom Posted October 8, 2009 Report Share Posted October 8, 2009 to add to what i just said. when you see The Zigmeister precision works in luming a dial, it will give you just an idear of what expertize a watchmaker has in handling such evil things as a black oiler .... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vlaletom Posted October 8, 2009 Report Share Posted October 8, 2009 @ vlaletom You beat me to it... this probably the one and only time i will ever beat you to somthing related to oiling Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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