DLC for your Pre-V Pam?

[Guest avitt]

I'm often asked if DLC is appropriate for a Pre-V, Pre-A, or other early PVD Panerai replicas. As beautiful and DLC is (and with all of the benefits that it offers over traditional PVD), up until now, I haven't been able to say that it's a perfect match for these pieces. The beautiful pencil-lead finish of DLC is just a little different from the slightly darker and slightly shinier look of AlTiN PVD.

Faced with my own 202A and 009 projects, I started to look at ways to change the look of DLC. I know that the finish of the parts before the coating can make a big difference in the final look. However, I feel that my glass-blasted finish is already just about perfect. So I thought about what could be done after the DLC is already on...And I came up with an idea

Here are the pics..."treated" DLC on the left, and standard DLC on the right...See the difference?

My secret "treatment"? A 30 second rubdown with a Cape Cod cloth! (As an added benefit, this also helps eliminate fingerprints.) Sometimes it's the simplest of things...

So now there's no reason not to go with DLC on your PAM 004's, 009's, 202/A's, 203/A's...

[blackbard]

Schweet!

[NoobyPanFan]

Oh my... That is amazing! Beautiful work Avitt. Excellent illustration If this doesn't lead to a 100% increase in your biz there is something wrong. The look of PVD with the strength of DLC, now that is a BFD!

[Guest avitt]

Oh my... That is amazing! Beautiful work Avitt. Excellent illustration If this doesn't lead to a 100% increase in your biz there is something wrong. The look of PVD with the strength of DLC, now that is a BFD!

Exactly, NPF !!! Thanks!

All the benefits of state-of-the-art Diamond Like Carbon coating, with the PVD look of yesteryear.

[asf]

That would look sweet even on a custom piece like on a 111

[fishgodeep]

Looks superb Avitt - I actually like the one on the right for that gen like gunmetal shade

Cheers

FGD

[Guest avitt]

I agree, FGD!

When you look at the pics of these aged gens, the color and texture seems to run the full spectrum:

From this:

to this:

to this:

to this:

...It seems the finish of a gen has as much to do with how it's been handled over the past several years.

Selecting which look to reproduce in a rep is a personal choice, as none can be considered more "correct". My preference tends to run towards the grayer shades, in the middle.

[HauteHippie]

Nice, T... And I with FGD. I like the one on the right as well.

Also, as Lani's recent post shows, the lighting in the pic makes a big difference. Since the PVD coating doesn't reflect much light, the intensity of the light appears to change the shade of the coating.

That last PAM pic you linked just looks wrong, though. That practically has Ti look to it. I wonder if the owner had the coating stripped.

[Guest avitt]

Also, as Lani's recent post shows, the lighting in the pic makes a big difference. Since the PVD coating doesn't reflect much light, the intensity of the light appears to change the shade of the coating.

No doubt. It's really difficult to show what a coating looks like with a single picture. The appearance will change with different lighting, or the use of a polarizing filter.

I posted some reference photos about a year ago, which included these attempt to show the color and texture of DLC under filtered and direct sunlight:

While DLC runs the range shown in the buckles above, if you like the lighter, steel-gray colors, then TiAlN might be the way to go (top/right in this pic):

[Guest avitt]

So here are the results of my first attempt to apply a vintage finish to DLC...

\

...Compared with FGD's genuine sample, I think it's pretty spot on

[fishgodeep]

Avitt that looks REALLY GOOD - the colour looks perfect in comparison to that gen 203/A photo!!!

Great work mate

FGD

[Guest avitt]

Thanks for the feedback, Fishgodeep!

[lanikai]

I think if your going for the genuine OEM look PVD is the way to go.. if you don't mind the greyish shinnier look with DLC..it is a nice look, PVD and DLC is like oranges and pineapples ..

viewing the genuine PVD.. it does look quite different from any DLC coating.. it's going to be interesting to see what the PVD looks with a year or so of good wear.. the OEM crown I have on my 202A is faded just from age.. so I hope the PVD will do the same.. that would be a real vintage look

looks good though regardless of the coating..

AC

L

[Guest avitt]

Thanks Lani

..it's going to be interesting to see what the PVD looks with a year or so of good wear.. the OEM crown I have on my 202A is faded just from age.. so I hope the PVD will do the same.. that would be a real vintage look

That's the key! The new DLC looks like the aged PVD...The real vintage look, with no waiting necessary! And it has much greater wear resistance. It's the best of both worlds!

It's not my intention to produce a coating that looks like the Panarai factory PVD of 15 years ago. Instead, I'm trying to recreate the color, texture and sheen of watches that have been out in the field for 15+ years, while using higher quality coating.

Search for the 202A on Google images, have a look around, and you'll see that I've come pretty close.

[lanikai]

It's a different look though.. DLC.. hard for me to see that it looks like PVD, in pics or in person it still looks like a enameled grey.. in person PVD and DLC look very very different.. DLC has a grey sheen to it, a "hardened" looking surface, non porous, like comparing flat black paint to enamel.. put it in indirect strong natural lighting and it shines a bit much (in pics) as well as in person.. .. unlike PVD which "absorbs" light, and appears more porous, and the PVD will appear to turn to a different shade as it absorbs the light waves...

I like the DLC look but no matter how you play it .. it still has a totally different look from PVD... harder finish .. not only in physical looks but in practical purpose .. DLC is a harder coating ergo the look reflects the element of the coating .. more sheen .. I would suggest a PVD coat over the DLC.. if you want it to look like the real deal..a DLC coat may look good but no matter what you do it still looks like DLC..

AC

L

[Guest avitt]

Take another look at the DLC and gen pics in this thread...Do you really think that they look that different? (Or different at all?)

[lanikai]

Take another look at the DLC and gen pics in this thread...Do you really think that they look that different? (Or different at all?)

yes .. I have looked at different pics of the genuine 202a and have seen the genuine in person also.. else I wouldn't of made the comments in my pictorials of the PVD version.

for the sake of discussion view the genuine PVD.. this is the buckle, it was in the direct.. rather strong flash.. and it absorbs the light and "flattens" in color and texture, the pic has been enlarged, and a little blurred, but see the flatness of the PVD.. something that the DLC cannot perform in this type of lighting.

the same effect on my 202A pvd coating.. this is very very strong natural lighting.. streaming through the window.. and the PVD flattens out instead of contributing to more sheen and glare

another angle, some of the pvd looks grey but still rather flat.. and the portions in the most light again flattens

maybe take a pic in strong lighting streaming through a window , and outside in the sunlight and see how the DLC fairs.. the pic of the genuine in the thread is outdoors.. I think you need the same lighting with pvd and DLC to compare ..else you may get the same look with totally different lighting.. but side by side in the exact lighting I think DLC and PVD react differently.. ergo the genuine effect is lost with DLC.. although an amazing coating, not the same effect..

AC/L

[fishgodeep]

One of the beauties of PVD is the chameleon like character in different lighting - I couldn't say for sure what the original colour was back in 93-95 but there's a wealth of different shades and textures on the gen images I have seen.

I suppose it's down to a number of factors and each batch of production could be different from the last - in true Panerai style.

I have Rolli's and Rob's PVD and love them both - Avitt's new shade shown above just adds another variety to the collection and looks damn close to a the gunmetal shade photos I have loads of

In some Pre-A it also looks a purplish/blue colour - so there's another colour for consideration!!!

Cheers

Simon

[Guest avitt]

Avitt's new shade shown above just adds another variety to the collection and looks damn close to a the gunmetal shade photos I have loads of

Thanks Simon!

I don't want to get caught up quibbling about the subjective interpretation of aesthetics. I'd prefer to stick to the facts, which as I see them are:

• DLC is currently the coating of choice in the watch industry. DLC offers hardness and durability which is far superior to traditional PVD coatings, making it the choice of the high-end Swiss manufacturers. DLC is the reason why Panerai abandonded PVD several years ago.
  
• Up until now, the only limitation of DLC was the fact that it was not a perfect match to the PVD coatings found on vintage Pam pieces. That all changed this week, when I introduced a method of "vintagizing" DLC (as shown on Tanya's 202A).
  
• Choice is good! There are a couple of choices available for those who prefer the fresh-from-the-factory, "safe queen" look. I am also offering a choice for those who prefer the steel-gray look of vintage Pam pieces, and/or prefer the other benefits offered by DLC.
  

Base on the feedback that I've received over the past day or so, I know that I'm onto something It looks like this "vintagized DLC" provides a look that many people have been waiting for...It has even been called the "Holy Grail" of coatings!

Here are a couple more pics: