chris5264 Posted March 26, 2006 Report Share Posted March 26, 2006 I got the 112 with the new swiss 6497 and it still had a recessed pin problem. I got a new hour wheel (HT 1.65) and canon pinion (HT 2.62) and got everything apart to discover these were the same size as the rep movement. It looks like the only real problem is with the hands. If I took the min hand down a bit so it would sit lower on the can pin, it looks like that should fix the problem. Does this seems right? Also, sometimes I'm curious if this is the right hobby for me, I ended up doing more damage than good. I scratched the dial and almost broke off one of the legs of the dial. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RWG Technical Posted March 26, 2006 Report Share Posted March 26, 2006 I got the 112 with the new swiss 6497 and it still had a recessed pin problem. I got a new hour wheel (HT 1.65) and canon pinion (HT 2.62) and got everything apart to discover these were the same size as the rep movement. You need to order the correct longer ones at 3.15 and 2.15mm in length... It looks like the only real problem is with the hands. If I took the min hand down a bit so it would sit lower on the can pin, it looks like that should fix the problem. Does this seems right?It won't work without the longer cannon and hour wheel as you need the height above the dial to be able to cut the hand tubes down and get them closer to the correct length. Also, sometimes I'm curious if this is the right hobby for me, I ended up doing more damage than good. I scratched the dial and almost broke off one of the legs of the dial. I can't help you with that part, you have to take your time with any watch work, buy good quality tools, read how to do the procedures, and practice and learn the skills. Nothing should ever touch the dial face, nothing should ever be forced. If you try and force anyting in watch work, you will end up with damage somewhere... RG Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chris5264 Posted March 26, 2006 Author Report Share Posted March 26, 2006 You need to order the correct longer ones at 3.15 and 2.15mm in length... It won't work without the longer cannon and hour wheel as you need the height above the dial to be able to cut the hand tubes down and get them closer to the correct length. I can't help you with that part, you have to take your time with any watch work, buy good quality tools, read how to do the procedures, and practice and learn the skills. Nothing should ever touch the dial face, nothing should ever be forced. If you try and force anyting in watch work, you will end up with damage somewhere... RG Thanks for your time and advice. In the end I totally messed up the dial and hands, but did learn something from it, I ended up spending some time with the keyless works. I find myself amazed that someone came up with that. I found the 6497 keyless works much easier to appreciate then the eta 2801. anyway, thanks again, the correct sizes will help alot! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RWG Technical Posted March 26, 2006 Report Share Posted March 26, 2006 It's all a learning curve, and don't get discouraged at all by the mistakes... You may have seen some of my lume work of late, but what you don't see is my own personal watches that were damaged as I practiced and taught myself to lume, and I am an artist and accomplished oil painter as well, so I can do some fine work, but lume is really hard... Everyone starts somewhere, and just because someone can do something you can't - remember they were in your place at one time, don't let it get you down... Quality tools, asking if your not sure, and taking your time and being careful to never force anything, and you will catch on. Having the correct attitude helps, and being willing to try, go a long way to being successful.... Don't give up, it's very satisfying when it starts coming together... RG Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chris5264 Posted March 27, 2006 Author Report Share Posted March 27, 2006 Thanks again, I do have one additional question I hope this hasn't been covered. It seems so confusing why the reps would have such decent movements but then have a recessed pin. I took my measurments from a genuine eta 6497, so panerai must also use a longer cannon pinion and hour wheel than the original movement they started with due to a thick dial? Is the recessed pin problem due to the rep movements actually being too accurate to the eta movements? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RWG Technical Posted March 27, 2006 Report Share Posted March 27, 2006 Thanks again, I do have one additional question I hope this hasn't been covered. It seems so confusing why the reps would have such decent movements but then have a recessed pin. I took my measurments from a genuine eta 6497, so panerai must also use a longer cannon pinion and hour wheel than the original movement they started with due to a thick dial? Is the recessed pin problem due to the rep movements actually being too accurate to the eta movements? I can only answer based on my opinion. If you order a ETA 6497-1 or -2 movement, it's going to come with the shorter cannon and hour wheels as standard. You can order movements with longer cannon and hour wheels (there are up to 6 lengths on some movement models), but this is a special order from ETA. What are the chances that anyone is actually custom ordering these movements, probably zero, the movements are from the surplus market. So since ETA produces the standard model, this is what they buy, and what ends up in your watch... What pisses me off, is the Asian copies of the ETA 6497 model, especially the -2 one. If your going to copy and make your own parts, why not make the longer cannon and hour wheel...and fix the problem? So we are left to order the correct parts, and they are hard to get, I guess Paneari must be using them all... RG Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
davidsenjpn Posted March 27, 2006 Report Share Posted March 27, 2006 I can only answer based on my opinion. If you order a ETA 6497-1 or -2 movement, it's going to come with the shorter cannon and hour wheels as standard. You can order movements with longer cannon and hour wheels (there are up to 6 lengths on some movement models), but this is a special order from ETA. What are the chances that anyone is actually custom ordering these movements, probably zero, the movements are from the surplus market. So since ETA produces the standard model, this is what they buy, and what ends up in your watch... What pisses me off, is the Asian copies of the ETA 6497 model, especially the -2 one. If your going to copy and make your own parts, why not make the longer cannon and hour wheel...and fix the problem? So we are left to order the correct parts, and they are hard to get, I guess Paneari must be using them all... RG Dear The Zigmeister, Well,i have ordered some cn 6497 -2 movtments with longer cannon pin and hour wheel already more than 2 months.I am still waiting for for thier delviery to me.These longer pin movt cost me a few dollars more than the standard one.But i will have to wait longer than expected.Hope they will get it done properly. If ok,this long time recessed pin problem will be gone pretty soon.I am not too sure unitll i have the movts on hand.May be i will send you a fresh one to make a review on it,ok? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vaccum Posted March 27, 2006 Report Share Posted March 27, 2006 Dear The Zigmeister, Well,i have ordered some cn 6497 -2 movtments with longer cannon pin and hour wheel already more than 2 months.I am still waiting for for thier delviery to me.These longer pin movt cost me a few dollars more than the standard one.But i will have to wait longer than expected.Hope they will get it done properly. If ok,this long time recessed pin problem will be gone pretty soon.I am not too sure unitll i have the movts on hand.May be i will send you a fresh one to make a review on it,ok? Good news !!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RWG Technical Posted March 27, 2006 Report Share Posted March 27, 2006 (edited) Dear Ziggy, Well,i have ordered some cn 6497 -2 movtments with longer cannon pin and hour wheel already more than 2 months.I am still waiting for for thier delviery to me.These longer pin movt cost me a few dollars more than the standard one.But i will have to wait longer than expected.Hope they will get it done properly. If ok,this long time recessed pin problem will be gone pretty soon.I am not too sure unitll i have the movts on hand.May be i will send you a fresh one to make a review on it,ok? That is excellent news. Now if you could get those who are manufacturing the Asian copies of the ETA 6497 to make the longer parts, as standard parts, and not the shorter ones, and make spare parts also, then this would be great and fix the problems for everyone... It would be so easy to fix this at the factory, rather than after the watch is delivered to the customer. If you need a review on anything, I would be my pleasure and I would be honored to do it... I must say that your the first one to bring much needed spare parts to the members here, and we have been crying for spare parts for a long time. I know it's hard to get them, and Jos Nana (who I consider a personal friend) has helped me in the past, but only on a one to one basis. I appreciate his helping me out, and I also appreciate and understand how hard it is for you to source these parts, and certainly am glad your willing to help us here. Thanks you for all you bring to us here. RG Edited March 27, 2006 by ziggyzumba Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sssurfer Posted March 27, 2006 Report Share Posted March 27, 2006 Wow, is a collaboration The Zigmeister / Davidesn rising here? That would be outstanding! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
woody Posted April 1, 2006 Report Share Posted April 1, 2006 Rob, Did you get David's hands in yet for a review? I am still waiting to possibly order the 127 dial and hands set from David, with no caps on the hands, and hope that the recessed pin will be gone. can we do a specific review just on those 2 parts mounting on a CN 6497? lol one can always dream, right? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RWG Technical Posted April 1, 2006 Report Share Posted April 1, 2006 Rob, Did you get David's hands in yet for a review? I am still waiting to possibly order the 127 dial and hands set from David, with no caps on the hands, and hope that the recessed pin will be gone. can we do a specific review just on those 2 parts mounting on a CN 6497? lol one can always dream, right? Haven't seen them yet, but I have a parcel at the post office, and will be picking it up today when I go to ship this week's work out... It may be them and the dials I ordered... Once they get here, I will post a review... RG Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
woody Posted April 1, 2006 Report Share Posted April 1, 2006 Can't wait Rob. so you have actually ordered David's 127 dial and hands that have no caps, is that right? This sounds exciting, and hopefully promising. Eagerly await your reviews..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
timestamp Posted April 4, 2006 Report Share Posted April 4, 2006 someone should just make a plug. like a cork but out of aluminum or something. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blackseal Posted January 30, 2007 Report Share Posted January 30, 2007 just to prevent a misunderstanding. maybe i´m blind but: the cannon pinion has a regular heigth of 2,62 mm and has to be changed into 3,15 mm. the hour wheel has a regular heigth of 1,65 mm and has to be changed into 2,15 mm. is this right ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chris5264 Posted January 30, 2007 Author Report Share Posted January 30, 2007 just to prevent a misunderstanding. maybe i´m blind but: the cannon pinion has a regular heigth of 2,62 mm and has to be changed into 3,15 mm. the hour wheel has a regular heigth of 1,65 mm and has to be changed into 2,15 mm. is this right ? Sounds right to me,,,,but I think the easist thing would be to order the replacements from Davidsen, his are the correct size. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RWG Technical Posted January 30, 2007 Report Share Posted January 30, 2007 All the info you need is here. PAM Cannon upgrade. You want H3 size replacement cannon and hour wheels, I keep these in stock. RG Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blackseal Posted January 30, 2007 Report Share Posted January 30, 2007 All the info you need is here. PAM Cannon upgrade. You want H3 size replacement cannon and hour wheels, I keep these in stock. RG thanks The Zigmeister. of course i already have read this thread.... what do you think ? on my 183 G i did this modification in another not really satisfying way. i just shortened the minute hand untill it fitted roughly. so i´m really interested in your parts. please send me a pm. thanks for all the answers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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