WM 1680 - Loose Bezel Problem

[leitztozeiss]

I'm having issues with my recently acquired WM 1680. The watch is fantastic, but suffers from a very loose bezel. Actually, when I first received the watch, the bezel was too tight - would not turn at all. So, I popped it off with a credit card and tried to re-install it. Then, during the re-install, the bezel insert fell off. So, I removed all of the old glue and tried to check the fit of the bezel insert, and then noticed that the insert would not seat properly in the bezel. So then, I took a little material off the outer diameter so that it fit perfectly. Then, everytime I tried to reinstall the bezel, the fit between the inner diameter of the insert and the crystal was so tight that the insert would pop off. So then, I took a little material off the inner diameter of the insert so that there was some resistance, but not enough to push the bezel off during insertion.

Now, I cannot get ANY kind of tension on the bezel and the case. If I turn the watch upside down, the bezel begins to fall of the case. I have all of the parts, according to the threads I've read. I've triend flipping the retainer ring upside down. I've tried giving it a little bend - nothing.

What is supposed to hold the bezel down - simple press fit or tension? If it is the press fit that holds everything in place, then is it possible that I took too much off the inner diameter off the insert?? Maybe I have a bad insert? Or retainer ring?

Thanks in advance for your help.

Edited April 29, 2006 by leitztozeiss

[ubiquitous]

What is supposed to hold the bezel down - simple press fit or tension? If it is the press fit that holds everything in place, then is it possible that I took too much off the inner diameter off the insert?? Maybe I have a bad insert? Or retainer ring?

The tension from the bezel fitting to the retaining ring is what holds the bezel on. Should be able to press it on with your fingers; the bezel should snap on with a slight bit of effort with a reassuring click.

Just to confirm, you only removed material from the bezel insert only, right? i.e. the bezel and retaining ring have not been trimmed in any way?

[ubiquitous]

BTW- I meant to ask... What happens when you try to fit the bezel to the case without the insert? Like this?

[leitztozeiss]

The tension from the bezel fitting to the retaining ring is what holds the bezel on. Should be able to press it on with your fingers; the bezel should snap on with a slight bit of effort with a reassuring click.

Just to confirm, you only removed material from the bezel insert only, right? i.e. the bezel and retaining ring have not been trimmed in any way?

Right, only the insert, not the bezel ring itself. Maybe my retainer is not correct, or something. I've tried flipping the retainer, bending the retainer, not installing the retainer - none of these things work. It seems to me that the only thing that was holding it on before was the fit between the insert and crystal.

[leitztozeiss]

BTW- I meant to ask... What happens when you try to fit the bezel to the case without the insert? Like this?

It is loose. I must be missing something.

[ubiquitous]

Hmmmm... The bezel assembly should be in 4 parts-

-bezel insert

-bezel

-bezel washer

-retaining ring

The retaining ring is a very thick ring of metal that is seated around the crystal to create a seal for water resistance. Since you mention flipping it, I'm assuming you mean the bezel washer (very thin metal awsher that is in place to provide enough resistance to the bezel to prevent it from turning easily).

The washer is at the lower left.

Try fitting the bezel on without the insert.

[leitztozeiss]

Ok, wait. I've been calling the bezel washer the retainer. Wrong terminology. Ok, going by your thread, I do have the following parts:

*Retaining ring

*Bezel washer

*Bezel ring

*Bezel insert

I never removed the retaining ring. I never shaved any material from the bezel ring - ONLY the insert. It is the WASHER that I have been bending, flipping upside down in an attempt to get some tension. So, it is the press fit between the bezel ring and retaining ring that keeps everything together? I'll post a pic shortly.

[leitztozeiss]

Ok, here's where I'm at (see pic below).

[leitztozeiss]

I've tried without the insert, and it is loose even without the insert. I'm still not understanding what creates the resistance for turning and what prevent the bezel from being displaced axially. Maybe my bezel has too large of an inner diameter (the one that seems to interface with the outer diameter of the retainer ring)?

[ubiquitous]

Hmmmm. You do indeed have everything accounted for, and present. That bezel should snap right on; the insert should have nothing to do with the actual hard parts going together...

Might sound like a dumb question... But, are you pressing the bezel on hard enough? It does take a little effort to make it snap on....

[leitztozeiss]

You know what - my retainer ring outer edge looks MUCH thinner than yours. In fact, the top surface of my retainer ring slopes downwardly toward the outer edge, whereas yours is horizontal with the dial. I think I have the wrong retainer ring on mine. I'll post a pic in 2 minutes.

[ubiquitous]

I've tried without the insert, and it is loose even without the insert. I'm still not understanding what creates the resistance for turning and what prevent the bezel from being displaced axially. Maybe my bezel has too large of an inner diameter (the one that seems to interface with the outer diameter of the retainer ring)?

Well, it's the tension from the retaining ring's o.d. and the bezel's i.d. that provides the tension to hold everything together- The washer acts like a spring to provide resistance to keep the bezel from moving too easily- To turn the bezel, one must theoretically press the bezel to the case to flatten the washer to eliminate the tension in order to turn the bezel...

Everything prior to disassembly fit fine? Nice and tight?

...Only thing I can think of is that perhaps in the process of removing the bezel, the bezel got bent slightly out of round. If you place the bezel on a flat tabletop, do you notice any high spots where the base of the bezel looks like it might not be level?

[ubiquitous]

Here is mine- Retaining ring only. Does this help?

[leitztozeiss]

Ok, here's a pic showing the thin outer edge of my retainer ring:

[leitztozeiss]

OR IS MY RETAINER RING UPSIDE DOWN????

[leitztozeiss]

Ok, I removed my retainer ring and found that there is NO gasket. So, maybe my retainer ring was sitting TOO LOW on the case, so there was no edge for my bezel to grab. If there is a gasket, then my retainer ring would sit slightly spaced apart from the top surface of the case, which would the better present the outer edge of the retainer ring for engaging the bezel ring. In your pictures, it appears the the retainer ring sits higher than mine. What do you think?

I think I need to get a gasket . . .

[leitztozeiss]

I think that's it. If I try to install the retainer ring into the bezel ring, it has a nice snap, snug fit. I think if I get a gasket, the retainer ring will sit higher, and my bezel ring will have an opportunity to fully engage the outer edge of the retainer ring. Well, I hope that is it anyway. So, gotta order parts and wait . . .

[leitztozeiss]

Last post before going to bed . . . is the gasket a standard Rolex part? If so, may I please know the part number, or good source in U.S.? Thanks! And, good night!!

[Sherrington]

The retaining ring on my MBW 1680 and MBW DRSD sits flush with the case as there are no gaskets fitted underneath the ring. Even sitting flush the bezel clicks on on both watches without any problems. I suspect as Randy does that maybe the bezel ring is slightly to big internally. Even without the tension washer the bezel ring should click on and STAY THERE. The tension washer only provides friction to stop the bezel spinning freely.

I don't think I would press the retaining ring down only part way as you may loose the bezel ring and crystal if it's not on tight enough.

BTW when I received my DRSD the bezel insert wasn't the correct size and only glued on badly. I changed mine for a gen.

[leitztozeiss]

Ok, my retainer ring outer lip is clearly thinner than Ubiquitous's and Pismo's shown below. Though, with the bezel and retainer ring removed, I am able to snap them together and get a nice fit. A gasket, as shown, will help keep the retainer spaced apart from the case top surface. The bezel will then be able to engage the outer lip. Sherrington, I suspect that even though the bottom surface of your retainer ring immediately abuts the top surface of the case, yours is at least as thick as Ubi's and Pismo's. See my last pic below.

[leitztozeiss]

Side view of my retaining ring:

[leitztozeiss]

I'm convinced that the fix is two things:

1) If I keep my currrent retainer ring, I will need to keep it slightly spaced apart from the top surface of the case to ensure that the bezel has a chance to properly engage with outer lip surface. A gasket should help in this regard;

2) If I obtain a thicker retainer ring, like Ubi's and Pismo's, I could then press the new retainer ring so that it's bottom surface immediately abuts the top surface of the case, or at least comes as close as a gasket will allow.

Either way, I'm going to put in a proper gasket - I don't know why that wasn't there in the first place. Ordered that LATE last night - couldn't sleep. Also ordered a replacement bezel insert. Both from Helflands. For fun, I removed the bezel from my WM 1665. The retainer ring looked totally different, but I guess that makes sense given the different (correct) bezel geometry. I didn't feel like venturing further and screwing things up.

[Sherrington]

Good luck, let us know how you get on. Just be careful the retaining ring is far enough down on the gasket to securely clamp the crystal in place as it's this that gives it waterproofness around the crystal.

[ubiquitous]

I've got an extra bezel you can try. Just found it digging through my parts box. Snapped it on my MBW Sub, so I know it's compatible...

[ubiquitous]

Some pics of my spare bezel...

Let me know if your planned methods don't pan out. You can resort to this extra bezel as 'Plan B'.