Gatchaman

Sorry, Zigmeister, but nothing you've told me has made any sense.

In your first response you said, "ETA Day wheels will not fit the older A7750 which is a popular upgrade."

I don't want to mod the cheap Asian movement. I want to replace it with a gen Swiss ETA 7750.

All I want to know is which incarnation of the 3717 should I buy, the cheaper 3717 based on the low-beat 7750 or the high-beat (and still Asian) 7750? I plan to take out whichever 7750-copy and replace it with a genuine Swiss ETA 7750 movement.

We're talking about 3 different movements here:

• Asian low-beat 7750

• Asian high-beat 7750

• Swiss 7750

Which of the Asian movements would require less modifications to the hands (i.e. broaching) for this type of swap?

Also, don't be afraid to try the search feature.

Be afraid. Be very afraid.

ETA Day wheels will not fit the older A7750 which is a popular upgrade. Due to all the variations in the sizes of the hands between different A7750's, it's not a DIY project without the tooling and skill.

If I wanted to purchase a 3717 that could eventually have its movement replaced with a Swiss 7750, which one would you suggest? The one with the low-beat movement or the high-beat Asian 7750 clone? If the Asian 7750 is a true clone, then the stems should be the same to that of its Swiss counterpart, no?

Are all low-beat 3717 crap for a 7750 movement swap?

Can it be done or don't bother?

Further to this the original clasps have a date stamp as well. It is just above the Steelinox. For instance on my DJ has S S8 stamped which means it is a "service" clasp built in August 1994. The first S means it was replaced during a service and the second S indicates 1994. The 8 means August.

Cool! Let's get our own stamps and make our own dates!

You had me at picture 3.

Un-freaking-believable!

I hope that IWC realizes the passion we have for their watches. Whether we may be sporting gens or reps on our wrists, we LOVE IWC WATCHES! This shows true passion. Its not just some guy hacking together a fake. Its a passionate watchmaker. Bravo!

Great post, ubiquitous!

Hands arrived today. A quick measure and I have:

Hour = 11mm

Minute = 15mm

Second = 17mm

Are those measured from hole to tip or the entire length?

Regardless, the minute and seconds hands on the DateJust are the same length, when measured from hole to tip. Both hands should superpose each other and should reach to the top of the minute stick markers.

+1

The extra little coronet did appear on some legit clasps found on Jubilee bands in the late 70's to early 90's.

Also, it could also be found on the ladies version of the Jubilee band.

This is a gen:

On the eBay one, the scroll work around the coronet is incorrect. Its a fake.

On a gen, on the left side of the coronet, there are two ending lines of scroll work with one end "flipping" upward and longer than the other end which is straight.

The same can be found on the right side. On the gen, this should be on the top and the straight line should be on the bottom. This one on eBay has scroll work that is the same on both the left and right side of the coronet. Rolex never made scroll work like this, hence this clasp is 100% fake.

Here's an enhanced photo of the eBay fake:

Found this clasp on eBay.

I think its a fake. What do you think?

Unpimp your flieger!

Val, do you know the diameter of the 3706 rep dial? The gen is 31mm.

Hey Val,

Thanks for the info. In all the reviews I've read about the rep 3706 none mentioned the rehaut depth issue.

The 3706 is a great watch. I had a chance to buy one 5 years ago for $1500. Don't know why I didn't jump on the deal.

Has anybody tried to make a Franken 3706 with gen case, gen dial and Swiss 7750 movement?

For the 3717, how hard (and how much) is it to get a gen dial? I see quite a few 3706 dials popping up on eBay on occasion.

I've never seen a 3717 dial for sale.

I'm looking for a 3706 rep. Just wondering if the whole dial issue has been resolved with the rep dealers?

A couple of the rep sites I've been to show photos of what appears to be a gen watch. But, the dial problems with this model of watch could have been fixed. Anybody know for sure?

This one dealer, who I was chatting with in Live-Chat, insisted that his $217 3706 had a genuine Swiss 7750 movement in it. The photos of the watch looked to be of the gen too.

I'd like to find the low-beat 21k movement so that I can replace it with a gen 7750 and gen dial.

This is a little late but those sizes I gave you were for Rolex hands.....

Gotcha. Thanks!

ETA/Tudor

H:11mm M:15mm S:16mm

Rolex

H:11mm M:15mm S:17mm

So that the factories can try and argue in court, that they have not produced a 100% identical item...

Its not a question of 100% accuracy or not. Its the fact that companies are using registered trademarks to sell merchandise. For example, in the replica clothing market, one can easily find Gucci, Dior, D&G clothing that is nothing like what the particular company actually sells. Those aforementioned labels (just like watch companies) hate the counterfeit market whether or not the item is 100% to the original or not.

Also, you think Swatch AG is going to take Fung Dung Wu Heavy Industrial Corp., which is a subsidiary of Yamaha Corp., to court? Not bloody likely. But, Swatch AG would take legal action if reps of their product were being sold as legit watches in legit stores beside other legit merchandise.

Case in point: Rolex Milgauss replica. Why is the rehaut so wrong on the 40mm when the 42mm (totally wrong size!) is correct? Its reasons such as this that I gave up on getting a rep of it (and all other reps) and decided to build a Franken of the Datejust instead. IMHO, the best rep is a Franken (pseudo-rep?) made with all gen parts but using a generic Swiss ETA movement. You could even add the gen movement later (with proper hands)...and have a super Franken...which, is essentially a "restored" gen.

Grinding down a rep case, AR'ing the crystal, reluming, changing crown tubes, etc... will never get you close to a gen. (My FrankenJust even has an authentic Rolex serial number that allows me to trace its history. Try that with a rep!)

If the factories made perfect replicas, you would only buy one and keep it for years and years instead of upgrading to the latest reincarnation of it. Hence, V1, V2, V3...ad nauseam...waiting for them to get it right.

Top 1 to 5?

A Franken with all gen parts except for the movement (and with correct seconds and minute hand lengths ).

All others have external flaws.

But, the big question is, are the Tudor hands for a 2824 movement the same length as the Rolex hands for a 3035 movement? From seeing various photos of Frankenjusts, my conclusion would be no. The Rolex minutes and seconds hands are longer by ~1mm. I just want to be 100% sure so that my Franken, other then its internals, are as close as possible to a gen DJ.

freddy333, the tube diameters don't match. I already looked into this.

ETA 2824 hole sizes: 90/150/25

Rolex 3035 hole sizes: 95/140/22

kbh, thanks for those ETA lengths!

I'm making a Franken and wanted to know how close the Tudor 2824 hands are to those of the Rolex 3035 hands.

Anybody know what the hand lengths are for the DJ?

At $10100 now.

How can you tell its fake?

Can a Rolex dial from a 16200 watch be fitted into a Tudor Prince watch?

I do believe the copyright infringement has more to do with companies using registered trademarks then it has to do with accuracy of product being sold.