OiRogers

That must be a heck of a watch for you to get so worked up By-Tor.

I look forward to wonderful photos when it does finally arrive....

And oddly, I just received a RM posted package in the CONUS... 3 days including the day in customs at JFK. I know the painful wait for parcels though... there have been days I've literally checked my tracking every 25 or 30 minutes and checked the mailbox hourly knowing full well that my postman always rings the bell when he drops a package for me. The anticipation of a new toy is always rough... and seeing a package stuck in the origin country for such a long time has got to be a killer.

)...not sure about this 100% but I saw some pics of members posting their 187 that seemed to have some sort of FACTORY AR that the 1st batch didn't have at all....

My 187 is one of the Honpo sourced 187s with individual serial numbers, highbeat 7750 and all.... it has a single side AR, pretty lightly done. I did get my watch 2nd (or 3rd or 4th..) hand though... I think the AR was done by a prior owner.

My 187 has been serviced and my bezel markers are of the pinned-to-the-bezel variety.... I think mines a franken, never saw a 187 with all the features mine has.

The biggest flaws I know of on the 187 are the AR (or lack of) and the fact that most of the chrono pushers are threaded too far up the pusher... i.e. when you have the screw piece screwed all the way down, a bit of thread is showing.... a flaw compared to the gen. The AR can be fixed by any number of options on this forum... the pushers are an easy fix, just don't screw them down entirely... a 1/4 turn off "tight" and the threading is covered.

I've also heard that some of the 187 reps have a flaw with the "1000" on the dial fading to an odd grey color after a while... mine is still nice and bright blue.

It should also sport a 7753 movement to be more like gen... and the He valve looks a bit wonky....the datewheel is a bit recessed (to be expected with the 7750 movement)... but honestly that is getting to the point of splitting hairs... its a strangely beautiful and very imposing watch.

As far as which watch to get between the 127 and the 187?... I'd say both. They are extremely different watches. I own both and the 127 is wonderful with a blazer/tie for casual wear, also great with jeans and a t-shirt for REALLY casual wear. My 187 is a spectacular sport watch... wonderful with jeans/t-shirt and even better with khaki-BDU pants and a polo. Be aware the 187 is a horse of a watch... the 127 doesn't *look* nearly as large on the wrist under any circumstances.

I love both and think they are probably on the short list of reps I'll hang onto for the long haul.

Now, if only someone could come up with that 26mm kevlar strap with the engraved buckle....

I usually book a ticket once a week to NY to visit Canal St. to buy my best fakes. I typically visit this one particular dealer- He's kind of difficult to purchase through, but if you follow protocol, he'll provide you with the best that $15 can buy!

First, I visit the third port-o-let over on the east side, and roll the toilet paper forward two turns; back one turn and then forward another 6. This acts as a sort of tumbler, which activates a rolling panel in the back of the stall to open up. Once out, I am led through a narrow alley way directly behind the port-o-let to the back of a Dunk'n Donuts location, which has a large dumpster to the right of the rear entrance of the building. There is a secret compartment to the side in which you can enter by pulling a nearby tree branch down to activate the switch lever. Once inside, travel through the tunnel in which the dumpster provides an entrance to and travel through until you reach a door that opens to the subway. Enter through the door and proceed immediately up the stairs to the street level. Right as you emerge from the underground entrance/exit, there will be a sewage drain immediately to the right at the curb. Tap foot three times, pause, three more times and whistle the National anthem. A hand will rise up from the drain, and at this point, administrate the secret handshake. Upon completing this successfully, you will be picked up by a taxi cab and delivered to the secret location after being blindfolded. Once arriving at destination, I am directed into a room, at which point I can buy as many genuine equivalent fakes as I desire for $15US per piece.

You know how I know your lying?

1: never seen a port-o-let with toliet paper in it that hadn't been pee-d upon... no one would touch that. Not even for a trip to rep-mecca.

2: A tree-branch in NYC?... come on... trees were removed in 1987 for additional parking... we all know that. Central park is a lie.

However, if your telling the truth... next trip, on your way through the Dunk'n Donuts please grab me an extra-large Toasted Almond / Cinnamon coffee with light cream.

A day off work calls for the beast.... (with different shoes naturally)

I've got them in on a few of my PAM's, they really are awesome and save a lot of hassle and grief. I got my first sets from River very quick and easy , also DSN has started to send them out. Rivers have the screw head in place and are pretty thick. You really can't tell the difference once they are in

ST4

+1 to the above... have them in all my pams except one... really need to locate another set for that last watch. I've been lucky with mine, haven't had any issues with explosions as Old Skool mentioned.

Makes strap changes a breeze.

If you put them into a PVD pam, just color the end with a sharpie... lasts several weeks and is a fairly close match.... put them into a Ti and the color match is close enough "stock" that they don't stick out.

Wow... very nice looking.

The Graham offerings are really growing on me. For some reason the chronofighter never quite did it for me... the swordfish and black knight on the other hand are getting a reaction.

The E vs H movement is basically a question of "will you take it off and allow someone to inspect it for authenticity"... 127's were made with E movements, the H movement is an obvious flaw. If your dead set on spot on accuracy, you wouldn't want the H movement. However from a mechanical/wearer standpoint, either would work fine.

Vac is Vaccum.. he can be found on this an other forums... PM me if you like and I'll send you his email address. I've had some work done by him that is stellar quality and well worth the effort.

That strap and lume look like they will go wonderfully together... PLEASE post a photo of them once they are united!

For those that know my tastes... this next line will be a first (and maybe and only).

That may be the first (non-white)Gold watch I've ever seen that I would actually put on my own wrist... Beautiful watch and tastefully done.

Odd... I also go to Phobands' bedroom... He's almost caught me twice.

But I figure, I went in half on the purchase... I should at least have visitation time.

The person that gave out his PP addy to 3 people....that's messed up...that means if he gets paid 3 x, he intends

to refund 2 (assuming his honest). Sort of a stupid way of doing it....

Just "sort of"? Reeks of potential scammer to me. I had two transactions fall through like that... both died as soon as I got the "I sent my PP info to "X" many others... whomever sends funds first gets the watch".

My reply to that was always..."good luck with your sale, I'm no longer interested."

As everyone else has posted... relax. Its pretty much normal... specially with a weekend. I can't count how many watches I've had on my wrist before the tracking showed "outbound from customs"

"I basically only go to RG to see what is for sale."

Funny... I got banned from RG for posting almost the same exact thing on RWI. But I must say, your experiences over there are about the same that I had experienced there.

In the past several years I've purchased several watches from pretty much every board... but after several experiences very similar to those you posted I never once purchased a watch from a member of RG... think the only watch I ever sourced off that board was from WackoBirdKeeper (WBK) a dealer on several other forums (not here though... odd, I'll have to research that a bit)

After finding several times that watches had been "poached" out from under me after an agreement to transact had been made... and a few sellers that retracted established deals and refunded sent funds and attempted to start a "bidding war" on an item... I pretty much quit reading the forum. The tone there never quite fit with me.

I'm thankful daily that I've found this forum (and TRC and RWI)... where I know what to expect from my fellow members. Its nice to know that there is a level of honor among this group of trademark-infringing-item-collectors.

Nicely boiled down to the essence there Shundi...

It saves about 40 pages of posts on RWI... Andrew and Josh stand accused of price-fixing and threatening smaller dealers. RWI made a judgement that effects RWI only... but threads ensued anyhow here and on other forums.

RWG2 here addressed the issue nicely, linking back to the discussion on RWI but remaining neutral.

RG put their heads into the sand and promptly banned everyone that might have had *any* input (positive or negative) at all... me included. I'm still somewhat confused by that.

Other than that entire mess of shenanigans, its been pretty much business as usual... "battling over membership contributions, the affordability of Tourbis, QC and high prices etc..."

I'd love to hear the input of a strapmaker...

I for one have always used mink-oil on cheaper straps.. I'm pretty certain its mink fat rendered down into a tub-of-goo state... but it makes my boots waterproof and only slightly darker. Smells a bit the first day though.

I haven't used anything on a nicer strap yet... I should probably inquire with my maker of choice for his input.

Even without a poll.... a quick read-through has put this watch firmly in the "hold off" category for me.

I'm well aware that those that have functioning watches that they are happy with have no incentive to post and may be the majority of owners of this piece... but I'm still a bit put off by the alarmingly large number of members that have had issues.

how can it be sent out with the rubber like that?? surely its not so hard to miss that.

Simple answer: Dropshipping.

Long answer: has been done before... at least a 20 page thread.

Like many collectors, I have a mixture of gens & reps. My daily beater gets worn almost daily, but I keep a stable of rotatables for dinner & special occasions or for when a particular watch just fits a specific outfit or activity. I also have some watches that I keep just because I appreciate their beauty, but which never (or rarely) see the light of day.

+1 to this idea...

I've got a few in my collection that have been with me for well over a year and a half but have been worn probably twice... not that I don't like them, but I find that they don't *fit* with every occasion.

I have four beaters that I tend to rotate through... a gen SFSO, a gen PO a rep SSD and a rep Ram 5218/218A (would love to have 1 of the 5 gens that exist of that one though)

I have several other watches that I tend to wear on more casual occasions... which watch depends on the occasion and the dress code.

Even though I live in a fairly watch-barren part of the world, I've now seen two tourbys in the wild... one the B&R and the other a Piaget. Both were breathtaking and both wearers were happy to have a quick discussion.

I even got to handle the B&R... talk about a spectacular watch. I never thought that a tourby would go well with that "tool" watch look.... I was wrong.

And I'd be willing to guess that rep timex and casio's do exist.... anything that a repmaker can make money on will be repped by someone. I'd be willing to guess they can be found at your local flea-market.

I think if you were to replace any pam reference with "black rollie sub" in the OP you'd be looking at an age old rep argument/problem.... many years and many many versions and we still don't have a 1:1 rep of (what I would assume to be) the most sought / commonly recognized watch in the rep game.

One would think that a watch as simple as a pam 112 would be a breeze to make a "perfect" rep... yet it hasn't been done. Simple fixes such as the canon pin, crown guard and its pin, crown itself and the lume... never seen those fixed other than on "modded" watches. Only reason I can think that the rep-makers continue to make such products is a lack of incentive to correct the problems...

The pams they make now sell in sufficient numbers to turn a good profit, what incentive do they have to re-tool to correct the flaws? I do not believe that rep makers intentionally introduce flaws to keep reps from being perfect, they would sell and continue to sell a "perfect" rep to many people as long as they could be produced. I firmly believe that the designers of reps get them to a "good enough" point for visual accuracy and cost to produce and call it a day at that point.

I'm sure that myself and many others would leap at the chance to purchase 1:1 perfect copies of many watches... but I just don't think the factories/makers have the incentive to correct their current flaws as long as their watches continue to sell.

I love this forum because the vast majority of us love Watches as the works of mechanical art they are.

Ah yes, and some of us appreciate the rep industry as well.

I'm also here biding my time waiting for Nanuq to tortue test another rollie.

Overall one of the most amusing reads I've had on any forum in quite a while. "Real *aftermarket* dials" "25, no wait... 27 jewels" "904L steeL, maybe"... best thread I've read in quite sometime.

I must sadly admit that I was within minutes of ordering the "PERFECT AAA++++ MADE BY SWISS-NYMPHO-SCHOOLGIRLS" black sub from Bestswiss or one of his ilk....

Then somehow... a google search turned up this wonderful site and TRC. Thank whatever deity was watching over me that day.

At least one of the cartel dealers still has 42mm Rads and 40mm (auto) Luminors listed on his site... but that might not mean much, I've found that the dealer isn't the fastest in removing items that are no longer available.

Sourcing a bracelet may be a bit of a challenge as well... I know they exist, but I'd guess them to be even rarer than the 40mm Luminors.

I'd have to agree with Peepshow on this one... its pretty much bad form to outright lie and try to pass 'em off as gens when anyone asks anyhow...

And in your specific situation having friends that may begin to qualify as "paneristi"... have you felt your friends out for their feelings about rep watches?

You could inadvertently harm or end a friendship if a rep watch offends them too much.

Perhaps set your sights a bit lower and find a nice MM 47mm rep.

Have you asked Kenberg as to the availability of his products?

Been cruising his offerings lately and might be contacting him shorty for a few shirts and such... need to let the funds recover a bit from my last purchase though.