Timelord

I also do as Horologist does!  Before I release the stem by pressing the pin, I pull the stem out to the time setting position ie. all the way out !   It is advisable in order to "reduce the risk" of getting the keyless works out of position.   I myself have never failed using this method!  I have only failed when removing in other positions, however, that isn't to say that you cannot be lucky and not run into problems when in other positions .  I guess it depends on how the individual parts are sitting at the time on pressing the release pin!

An important point which rarely gets mentioned is that when pressing on the release pin, never use a pointy object such as a pin or tooth pick as it is advisable to use the smallest screw driver to push it down to avoid the release pin going down too far.

as with eta clones I even had problems with the valanvron Swiss which I do not find it to be that much better than the Asian clones- my opinion!

In my opinion I would avoid eta clones resulting from my following experiences.

(1)  out of 5 that I have used, they all had problems with keyless works.  No matter how many times I have removed the stem in the time settling position, the setting lever always goes out of line where the parts easily stretch or do not mesh properly.  Try and replace a part and rest assured that it will not necessarily blend with the rest.

(2)  had the yoke snapping when pulling out the stem on one of them

(3)   the coverplate spring also snapped on two of them when trying to engage the bottom and top ,

(4)  had a screw split in half while trying to screw it onto the main plate of the balance bridge  Was definitely not using a jack hammer to screw it in!!!

(5)  roller jewel falling off the balance landing somewhere in the movement, therefore the balance wheel stopped regardless

(6) the screws on the automatic bridge would not hold the automatic bridge down properly as the internal main plate thread was threaded hence the automatic bridge dislodged slightly off and not transmitting the wind onto the ratchet wheel through to the mainspring

(7) reverser wheels. do not even know where to start from bad to worse or from worse to more worse!!

(7) upon dismantling the movement, most of the pivots were dry and unoiled which is to be expected as they are assembled i slave sweat workshops somewhere in the never never land.

It may be argued that I might not know what I am doing,?  You are entitled to your opinion too, but in the past whenever I have dismantled and assembled a genuine eta movement ( more than one occasion),  I have never experienced any of the above problems.  The worst I have experience is that the movement did not run, until I rectified the problem.  I am not saying that some have never had a better luck of the draw, but each to their own.  The above are my opinion which I wish I knew before and to share with members who think twice about if it is worth the extra $100 to buy a genuine or risk with the clone.

I have been around in this rep game since 1991 when I was working part time for a cobbler that changed watch batteries in the quartz watches.  From time to time we got customers asking to attend to mechanical watches which needed attention and some even left them to us as a trade for a cheap time teller which is all they really wanted.

one afternoon a gentleman asked me to look at his late fathers  omega presentation watch from GM that had been water damaged.  It was an automatic and wanted a feasible fix just to get it working, not caring about if I could replace the internal guts with anything that would make it tick.  Then it struck me that I would put in a quality quart mvt from a citizen dress watch where I was able to use the case ring and hands.  A few modifications and presto, he had a working heirloom watch.  

I then got the idea to do the same with all the DJ cases that were coming up for sale with their original dials, so in my spare time, I bastardised them (term I used before Franken watch became the norm) by fitting eta 2783 mvts from your generic unknown brand watches such as Lator for example.  I did this with a couple of date justs, and fitting quartz mvts into good looking watch cases from other vintage timepieces that deserved a second chance in life.  Then I discovered the internet replica forum (one that is now no longer active) and the rest is history! 

The owner from the presentation watch still recognises me in the streets of the city centre and when he stops to say hello, he brings the subject up all the time having last mentioned that his daughter has given the watch to her son as  he loves the watch so much.  What a pleasure it gives me to put on a smile on someone's face even from some 30 years ago!

I don't want to overlook any artisan modder here, but I wished people like zingy and even jackjo were still as active as before as I have had some great bespoke work done that the term replica watch would be an insult to the masterpieces created!

49 minutes ago, Denny said:

Hi Guys, I'm totally new here - so please go easy on me.  I recently inherited the below watch and I have some reasons to suspect that it's not genuine.  Before I go strolling into my local Rolex Boutique, I figured I get some opinions on here.

 

Onto the photos:

 

 

The obvious areas of concern is the bracelet and case which seem to be plated gold (but not on the back)...  Aren't all "gold" Rolex models solid gold?  And the brushing of the Oyster Bracelet seems to be the reverse of a "normal" bracelet..  Happy to answer any questions and/or take more photos.  😊

Welcome to the forum! Danny !  You have come to a unique and wonderful place where you will be amongst some of the  watch Einsteins of the planet that are equally skilled in what they do in addition to being highly knowledgeable !  Sadly I am on the bottom of the pecking order and am still learning!

the pictures you have posted appear to be the Golden egg rolex date model which do exist if you google Golden egg  rolex.  As for yours, it appears to be genuine as I have never seen anyone ever replicate one of these, but that isn't to say that a replica doesn't exist or that the case and dial may be genuine  but had its movement replaced with a non rolex movement!  The odds so far look exceptional in your favour!

these models are not plated but capped with gold foil of approximately 120microns of gold. Similar to gold capped teeth!  An American invention going back as far as  the 1950's where they had the toughness of a stainless steel model and the elegance of a solid gold one! I had a few omega  bumper wind models of this make up and were amongst my favourites!

the bracelet l am not knowledgeable about this one,?  Maybe our fellow prized member Automatico can chime in here as he is an encyclopedia on watches having decades of experience!  Great specimen and enjoy to.good health!!

2 hours ago, JoeyB said:

In 1972  "....".""...

A 'good time' with a professional lady was $10. 

You may be pleasantly or unpleasantly surprised that some prices don't change!  In some cases where supply exceeds demand, the prices go even further down!!!.   The law of supply and demand!

On 10 August 2019 at 6:04 PM, Fireman_Fred said:

The Steinhart is a stunning homage to the Rolex Submariner (although it says "Steinhart" on the dial, not "Rolex"). It begs the question, for the money and the peace of mind, why would you spend $350 on a rep that could stop working and fall to pieces with no come back when you can buy a homage of the. same watch (or similar) that it is built solidly, with quality materials and a 2 year, no quibble warranty ??

 

I rest my case....

 

I have never seen a Steinhart sell new for $350 - especially the same homage as a rolex submariner, so replicas are still cheaper

I purchased the submariner steinhart  homage when in New Zealand and found it way too big ~ 42.mm, flat lugs and looked better on the webpage than it did on me  Don't get me wrong, a Good watch , but a bit overrated when I could have done better for a $100 more.

I paid mine approximately 700NZ$ and at the time, I could have got a Longines divers for an extra $135 when it was on sale at sheppards jewelers for the end of tax season .   I guess what makes us happy is the best answer to this question! 

8 hours ago, automatico said:

 

 

If you can go with rolex spec 5.3mm parts, ST Supply has them:

RP24-530W

 

Generic Stainless Steel Crown without Emblem to Replace Rolex 24-530.  Includes Stainless Steel Case Tube RP24-5320-SS with Gaskets.

$17.95

Otoh I bought a few screw down crowns sold as 'stainless steel' that turned out to be plated brass.  ST parts have always been what they say they are.

 

I should have been a little more specific as the crown is one without the threaded case tube on the case end.  It is for an old divers watch which uses a press in fitted tube  for a screw down crown.

I tried most of the rolex generic tubes by skimming the thread on a lathe to create the smooth friction fit but became too thin to get a tight fit on the case.  I even used JB weld but was only a short term solution. 

I do have a screw down crown that fits the right sized 2.9mm tube and is perfect size 5.5mm in diameter but chrome plated on brass. When the plating wears off, the end is also near for the crown.  Apart from the rolex generic crowns, the only screw down crowns available  as generics have all been plated and almost in every size imaginable!  LOL!

56 minutes ago, RickFlorida said:

While learning about Vostok Amphibia watches I see that the crown and bezel are made of brass or something other than stainless steel but is chrome plated while the other parts like case and caseback are stainless.  I can't believe they did this because that is probably a fatal flaw if they really designed Vostok Amphibia's to be tough military dive watches.

There is a real misconception regarding to something being tough and rugged versus longevity!

As a novice to the watch world since my early teens, over 35 yeas ago I was under the impression that a watch such as an Omega and a Rolex were 5 or 50 times more expensive than normal mainstream watches because they were more long lasting and were much more accurate timekeepers.  Not the case as we know as a cheapie can last just as long and be as reliable if given the same care and attention.

A military watch is no different as it's purpose is to do its duty for the time that it is in service.  Not to last forever! 

Apart  from rolex, omega seiko and all the known brands they all have stainless steel screw down crowns for their divers models as far as I know!  I have found other divers watches that are more generic to also have brass chrome plated screw down crowns. 

In the last 6 years, I am actually having a Hard time locating a stainless steel generic 5.5mm screw down crown  as every source I have searched have plated brass ones!  So to answer your question, I sense it all to be down to cost and that big brand complained make their own

On ‎7‎/‎26‎/‎2019 at 9:48 PM, mymanmatt said:

try it yourself, this is a small tip that may help. First,  install the balance on the base plate. Be sure the jewel is in the pallet fork and the bottom axle is in the baseplate jewel.  Then gently put the bridge on. Be sure it's in the top axle on the balance. When you install the bridge, be sure that the hairspring is in the brass part of the speed lever.  Then put the screw in the bridge and tighten. you now have everything in place. The stainless bar on the hair spring is now close to the beat lever. Take your tweezers and set the stainless bar in place in the lever. Then use your tool to push it on the lever. If it's incabloc be sure and pull the stem out to the stop position after the balance is in place. Push the stem in and set the speed and the beat. Hope this helps.

Great tips and many thanks for the detailed instructions.   I had been looking on youtube and everywhere else on how to go about it, just hitting dead ends. 

I did give it a go, but I think I screwed up when installing the stainless bar in place in the lever .  I almost rejoiced when I put it together but was jubilant too soon.   I am not disappointed as I learnt something from it. 

I guess I was thinking too far ahead worrying about getting the beat right.  How they got the beat right in the old days before electronic timers surely gets me wondering!!

2 hours ago, capice said:

nothing beats the original...:) if you need parts, I will be happy to look in my stock

Thank you!!  Most obliged!   I will PM you  if  I am unsuccessful !

11 hours ago, capice said:

not entirely true buddy.....I have 13 year old A2824/36 still running good without any problem

try Cousins UK or Ofrei US

Thanks for your reassurance!  Will look into it!  

I have never had any luck with eta clone movements and have always ended up costing more than having purchased a 2nd hand genuine and freshly servicing it!   Parts are another issue.  Problem is that 2nd hand genuine etas are hard to find unless it is in the Philippines 

Thanks guys!

i knew the clone ones came fully assembled but never saw a genuine sold fully assembled.   I heard that the clones are a hit or a miss and the roller jewel is not very stable!   Might need to risk getting  a non working eta with a good balance!   

I looked on ebay and there is a guy in the Philippines that is the only seller of per owned etas but hates being asked questions about what he sells as he will lecture you on how hard he has been done by customers so I  might look locally 

6 hours ago, ceejay said:

What calibre?

Eta 2836-2 or  2824-2

Hi fellow members

I am trying to replace a complete balance attached to bridge which has lost the roller jewel( don't know how this happened ) with a bridge and hair spring complete as I am not skilled enough to remove the bridge from the hair spring nor put it in beat I if capable of assembling one.

I know that some genuine parts can still be found but have not seen them as fully complete ones like  the generics  being complete with bridge and hairspring as seen on ebay. Unless I am wrong,have the genuine eta ones ever sold as complete pieces like the generics?  Not so confident in buying a generic either!  Stuck with a dilemma here

an update!!!!

As it turned out I have the watch ticking again.  I noticed that the problem was in the jewel of the balance which was missing or had fallen off.  I had found it close by near the escapement. 

I removed the balance from another eta movement to check if this would do the trick and BINGO!!!  it has been ticking.  Now one balance down stopping a whole good movement working!!!!!

Now replacing these things isn't easy as eta parts are no longer available.  I see some generic ones but are they any good?  hope the same doesn't happen to the generic one if I were to go with that choice. 

removing the balance and replacing the bridge is beyond my league of skills   Has anyone ever done it and if so what are your recommendations?  Thanks

Hello friends,

I was thinking of getting my son a new watch for his 18th birthday and I know always wanted a mechanical watch but nothing with high brand names on it.  He just prefers something inexpensive and practical!  I then was thinking of getting a sterile dial printed with his name on it and building something for him, but wasn't sure I how to go about it as I recall reading that you can  also  get your own stencils to do that!  I am just brainstorming a moment!

can anyone help with any suggestions on how you would do it if in my position!

thanks in advance!

2 hours ago, Nanuq said:

 

And gentlemen in England now a-bed Shall think themselves accurs’d they were not here, And hold their manhoods cheap whiles any speaks That fought with us upon Saint Crispin’s day.

 

Interesting to hear of Saint Crispian!  I recall as a child my late mother mentioned of a Saint Crispian who was also a mystique as he had the power to fly.  A Franciscan monk if I recall correctly!   

Gentlemen,  I am not sure how to say it, but thank you are too little words in comparison to the gift of attention you have given me to help solve my problem!  

Took all of your advice on board, by checking the pallet fork balance etc.  upon shaking to add power from rotor swing, hair spring swings perfectly for almost a minute until it stops. Upon removing balance the pallets flick from one banking pin to another without a problem,but noticed the end  of pallet fork that engages into the rotor jewel seems odd with a bent piece which I cannot photograph as my camera resolution is not powerful enough.  It even looks like it has a bent jewel on the end which explains why the hairspring rotates freely for almost a minute.  The seconds hand does not move nor does the pallet fork while the balance swings nicely.  

Will buy a new pallet fork and see how it goes!  It must be a clone as it was running perfectly before all this happened

On 4 June 2019 at 6:12 AM, Rolexman said:

Remove the balance wheel and fork if you can and see if the gear train moves freely than. Such an immediate stop sounds strange and is usually a loose screw or part. 

13 hours ago, mymanmatt said:

I too have had this happened. I take my finger nail and put it on the mainspring tub gears and then rock the the tub back and forth. If the balance is in the pallet fork, it may start. Make sure the the balance hasn't popped out of the pallet fork. I"ve done that on a dozen eta's in the last year. Something binds up and I cannot figure out why. Try that first . Horologist is correct. Remove the pallet fork and make sure the drive train spin"s freely. Good luck

On 4 June 2019 at 9:17 AM, horologist said:

Is this movement you have a clone or a genuine?

I don't know for sure as it was already in a replica watch which has all the eta stamps etc.   I know even clones come with these stampings so it's anyone's guess.  Have also taken advice of both Mymanmatt and rolexman , however it s still the same 

Have a freshly serviced eta 2824-2 which was running fine and within 5 seconds per day for  couple of weeks!  Now  the balance wheel no longer swings as pallet fork is stagnant!  Very strange!  I have checked if there are are any obstructions in the gears, cogs, including the balance stop in case it brakes onto balance wheel which is clear!  Anyone ever experienced this?   Thanks for any input!

1 hour ago, Jblakes said:

 Im leaning towards to the explorer. I just didnt know much it would cost compared to an gen.

 

Regards

James

The explorer is harder still as you have close to NO chance of finding a genuine empty case  unless it is from a donor water damaged one.  You could try getting a case which is close to the real deal from yuki and have Justin  reshape it for you, but it won't be cheap!  Good luck!

Welcome!

this place is the grail of watch forums!  You will meet wonderful people here from all walks of life that are both friendly  and  highly knowledgable and intelligent!

To answer your question, for the money you intend to spend you might even find the real McCoy.  To find an empty genuine  day date case or an explorer case is the hardest part of it all.  Movements are east to find even though they are also  scarce!

if you want to build a custom 18k gold day date,, you might want to try getting a star supply case and try to fit an eta Swiss mechanism, but the dial feet will not match up on a genuine dial,. Also I am not sure if a genuine dial will even fit in a star supply case!  This is where our technical expert member  Automatico can chime in!  He is a true asset to this forum along with some of the others that can make you feel like a child in a candy shop

Well said!   That nails it head on!  The same would apply with most of the "all sell and no tell " commercial world!

I remember a similar example used in commerce school which are the basic essential ingredients lubricating marketing and capitalism!

2 minutes ago, automatico said:

"Aren't the 17 jewel movements a thing of the past?  I would figure anything new is 25 jewels these days."

 

I have not seen any new 17J auto 28xx Etas in years.  Nos... yes, new...no. 

 

Thanks for the piece of information!  The problem is that some supply houses have old stock which are sealed in these silver bags and there is no indication as to the jewel count of the movement unless one opens the packet to be sure!

Unless  the older 17 jewel versions have different packaging, then this would confirm it!!  

The other problem is that that swatch/ eta group who sell these movements are notoriously unhelpful in directing you to even getting close to an answer or having the courtesy in answering what to the catalogue number on the packet suggests!