Is this a new Super-Clone ETA movement?

[Francisco]

Hi there:

I would like to ask your opinion to find out if this 2824-2 movement is a clone or an ETA.

I am sure that, if this is a clone, it is not a usual clone, it would be a super-clone. Let me show some pictures. The watch is a Sinn U1

Of course, the ETA stamp and the text 2824-2 is there. And, as you can see, the reversing wheels look ETA, as they have many holes:

I have been using the next image, supplied by one dealer, to distinguish a clone of an ETA movement. I normally only consider the holes of the reversing wheels:

However, if this movement is disassembled, the other faces of the reversing wheels look different whe comparing to an ETA reversing wheel:

As previous picture shows, the slots in the reversing wheels are different when comparing with an ETA reversing wheel spare. For me this is very suspicious.

Next picture shows a truly clone (no ETA stamp) that I repaired few weeks ago. The slots are similar (but not equal) to the movement what we are analyzing now.

So we have 3 types of the slots: ETA, clone

[RWG Technical]

I think it's a genuine ETA.

The markings look genuine to me.

ETA has been making this movement for almost 30 years and it comes in 5 versions and the parts are made all over the world. I don't think we can tell for sure by small changes in the gears etc, shape of cutouts, number of holes etc, simply because there are multiple variations of the quality of the movement. Parts change over time due to service experience, different manufacturing plants produce different variations etc... I can order the same ETA part from my supplier, and get two different finished and shaped parts, it all depends on when they were manufactured.

The copy ETA's are simple to identify, they have terrible lazer etched markings under the balance, or poorly stamped ETA and movement caliber. The ETA ones are clearly stamped and easy to identify.

30 years of improvements without any factory data to check against, leave us only guessing...

ETA movements are not rare like we think they are, millions and millions are available, if you give me enough money I can buy you 10,000 ETA 2836-2 movements tomorrow...all genuine...

[vlydog]

ETA movements are not rare like we think they are, millions and millions are available, if you give me enough money I can buy you 10,000 ETA 2836-2 movements tomorrow...all genuine...

Anyone up for a group buy?

[Pugwash]

I'm going to go with Genuine ETA on this one, as well. I'm sure one of the genuine ETA winding sections I swapped out looked like that.

[Francisco]

Thanks friends, so I think now it is a gen.