DSN's 104 and 229

[red]

What are your opinions of DSN's new work. The price is slightly better then the other collectors. I am not so good at picking apart the dials, but the date font looks pretty good.

[archibald]

What are your opinions of DSN's new work. The price is slightly better then the other collectors. I am not so good at picking apart the dials, but the date font looks pretty good.

The other collectors' casebacks blow away DSN's (eg, the rough 229 engraving and the wobbly 2 in the 104 SN) but his dials are better, I guess, in that the l-swiss-l is lower. Needs a relume, of course, to get rid of the green. Mag looks about the same. If you combine the 2 versions--not worth it on a 104 since you'd be all in to the tune of 30% of gen by the time you relume, AR, fix the mag, add an OEM crown, etc. but you could have a pretty good looking 229 if you could plausibly wear it anywhere.

[scoobs1971]

......... but his dials are better, I guess, in that the l-swiss-l is lower.

And again a missed chance: altough the position of the LSML is corrected, there's now a strange and incorrect space between Swiss and Made.........

[sssurfer]

To me, this 104 is the best 104 rep so far.

Dial: above 99%. Two only minor flaws, the length of the mark @ 9hr and yes, the spacing between swiss and made.

The lume is not green like usual DSN's lume, it looks very close to the gen.

Even the "A"s look pretty correct!

Here is a compare pic:

Caseback: above 99.5%. Even consistent in the OP, BB, and serial numbers, and there is even the white rectangle around the serial number!.

Only one very minor flaw, the depth of the engravings for the serial number.

Archibald (hi, mate!), I am quite positive that the bad "2" is just the pic. The head of the "2" in the pic looks more closed than in reality. Here is how it is supposed to be, coupled with a pic from a gen (at the bottom) for comparison.

Ok, the font is not 100% -- but it is 99%, and here we are talking of the serial number on the caseback!

Cyclops and date: still not perfect, but a step in the right direction, and at par with others.

I am also surprised at the CG. Unusually good! (Apart from the pin).

Shame on the crown as usual. An easy fix anyway.

EDIT: on a side note, what blows me away is the DSN 089. If it were not for the numbers on the caseback... 99.99%!

[tanya]

Surfer how about the 229 a critique please I was thinking of ordering it or the 104 or his new 088 GMT. Can't decide and my Stimulus Rebate check is buring a hole in my pocket. Already ordered a Mario Paci XV Santa Croce to go on which ever I end up with. Surfer ONLY YOU can help stimulate the economy (The chinese economy that is)

Thanks

[sssurfer]

Surfer how about the 229 a critique please I was thinking of ordering it or the 104 or his new GMT.

Also the 229 would be excellent if it not were for the caseback. The dial is very good (just the same mark @ 9hr as the 104, and possibly a slightly less-than-perfect "6"). Differently from others, correct spacing between the "6" and "L SWISS MADE L".

Unfortunately, the caseback is incorrect.

But to me, the 089 is the top. If you do not take it off your wrist, it looks a gen.

I wonder why Davidsen did not take better care about the numbers on the caseback. That would have made an almost 100% rep ("almost" because of the cyclops & date ensemble -- even if it is quite good anyway).

[red]

it's settled. 089 for me. if marco says its good, then it must be.

[sssurfer]

it's settled. 089 for me. if marco says its good, then it must be.

Wow... Thanks!

I just saw the 088 too. It is even better than the 089 (as it also has correct serial numbers).

Just, I am not in the panda style. But if you like the contrast subdial, go for it.

[kye_lin]

Also the 229 would be excellent if it not were for the caseback. The dial is very good (just the same mark @ 9hr as the 104, and possibly a slightly less-than-perfect "6"). Differently from others, correct spacing between the "6" and "L SWISS MADE L".

Unfortunately, the caseback is incorrect.

But to me, the 089 is the top. If you do not take it off your wrist, it looks a gen.

I wonder why Davidsen did not put a serial number on it. That would have made an almost 100% rep ("almost" because of the cyclops & date ensemble).

I have a gen 89 and DSN's 89 is really close... the dial color is just slightly off... a bit too blue..... is it anthracite??

No serial numbers... no problem.. Shadow PAM89 then.. very rare...

Kai

[sssurfer]

I have a gen 89 and DSN's 89 is really close... the dial color is just slightly off... a bit too blue..... is it anthracite??

You are right, I supposed it was anthracite and the blue nuance was just because of the pics... Maybe I had been taken up by enthusiasm.

All in all, the one that is very close to 100% is the 088.

Too bad I am not so much in the panda style.

EDIT: Just noticed the minute hand and the GMT hand, in both the 088 and 089...

Oh, well...

[tanya]

Surfer is the man !!!! No not Norin Radd but Marco !!!

Now a tough weekend decision. 104 or the perhaps closer to gen but a bit overly busy looking 089.

[tanya]

Oh Christ !!! The 088 minute hand has anorexia far too skinny !!!! God damn there is always something that keeps a rep from being a super rep and it's usually something so minor yet so annoyingly noticable. Gen pic for comparison 104 then......????????

[archibald]

Oh Christ !!! The 088 minute hand has anorexia far too skinny !!!! God damn there is always something that keeps a rep from being a super rep and it's usually something so minor yet so annoyingly noticable. Gen pic for comparison 104 then......????????

I still think I'm going to pick up both versions of the 229, combine the best parts and sell the remaining parts at a steep discount to a sane person who would correctly assume that even a rep consisting of "castoff" parts would be assumed to be gen by 99.9% of those who see it. Even if the resulting keeper is 8 or 9 Franklins worth of Ti, with an oem crown, AR, some lume, a little cyclops magic and a DW we're talking about a watch you'd have to compare side by side w/ a gen to call out--at less than 1/8 the cost of a gen provided you could ever find one. The only nightmare scenario would be explaining to some Paneristi that the watch he's slobbering over is...uh...even rarer than the watch he thinks it is. Actually that should be a standard line for a highly modified rep or franken:

Paneristi: Is that a real 229?

You: Ha! 1 of 250? Hell no! This baby's 1 of 1.

[sssurfer]

It's a pleasure to find you in so great shape after all this time, archibald!

And your way is likely to be the right way. In the end, super-rare reps keep or even raise their value over time.

[scoobs1971]

I still think I'm going to pick up both versions of the 229, combine the best parts .....

I think that would be an awesome rep! If you can get the Davidson dial to fit in the standard 229 with the improved cyclops you'd have the best of both worlds. Maybe add a Lello DW, a longer seconds hand and a slightly thicker crown.........

[rolli]

honorably all your positive or critical points for davidsen's new achievements,

don't forget the small second, this hand is much too short.

rolli

[scoobs1971]

honorably all your positive or critical points for davidsen's new achievements,

don't forget the small second, this hand is much too short.

rolli

We guys are terrible, LOL.

But the combined 229 as Archibald suggested would be the positive outcome of it all

[rolli]

at the moment i start the pam088 gmt project with parts from davidsen,

pam088 and pam229 standard case in connection with a gen valjoux 7754 gmt movement.

rolli

We guys are terrible, LOL.

But the combined 229 as Archibald suggested would be the positive outcome of it all

[scoobs1971]

at the moment i start the pam088 gmt project with parts from davidsen,

pam088 and pam229 standard case in connection with a gen valjoux 7754 gmt movement.

I'll drink to that .

But didn't you once told me there was a problem of fitting the rep hands on the 7754?

[rolli]

rep hands of a asia7750b1 movement fit on a gen 7754 gmt ( based on 7750 ).

davidsen and the other gmt maker use the 7750b1 for their gmt models.

the hand gears/posts have the same measures.

only the new designed asia7750 with 28.800bph have different measures for the hand gears / posts.

for the new 229 or 104 case you can swap 1.1 the gen 7754.

if you want to use the standard gmt case, then you have to use the 7750b1 main-[censored] for the gen 7754.

because the inside measure of the standard gmt case is deeper.

rolli

I'll drink to that .

But didn't you once told me there was a problem of fitting the rep hands on the 7754?

[fat.tail.event]

To me, this 104 is the best 104 rep so far.

Dial: above 99%. Two only minor flaws, the length of the mark @ 9hr and yes, the spacing between swiss and made.

The lume is not green like usual DSN's lume, it looks very close to the gen.

Even the "A"s look pretty correct!

Here is a compare pic:

Caseback: above 99.5%. Even consistent in the OP, BB, and serial numbers, and there is even the white rectangle around the serial number!.

Only one very minor flaw, the depth of the engravings for the serial number.

Archibald (hi, mate!), I am quite positive that the bad "2" is just the pic. The head of the "2" in the pic looks more closed than in reality. Here is how it is supposed to be, coupled with a pic from a gen (at the bottom) for comparison.

Ok, the font is not 100% -- but it is 99%, and here we are talking of the serial number on the caseback!

Cyclops and date: still not perfect, but a step in the right direction, and at par with others.

I am also surprised at the CG. Unusually good! (Apart from the pin).

Shame on the crown as usual. An easy fix anyway.

EDIT: on a side note, what blows me away is the DSN 089. If it were not for the numbers on the caseback... 99.99%!

On DSN's 104....Is the short mark at "9" something a modder could address? Same question with the short seconds hand in the recessed dial...are there hands out there to swap for accuracy?

Case back accuracy doesn't worry me as much. If the dial issues are simple solutions, I'd be happy to own this rep and pay for those mods.

[sssurfer]

Is the short mark at "9" something a modder could address? Same question with the short seconds hand in the recessed dial...are there hands out there to swap for accuracy?

Yes, I suppose that The Zigmeister or other relumers may fix the short mark @9.

Replacing the small seconds hand should be an even more trivial matter.

[Juso]

reposting from another closed thread http://www.rwg.cc/members/index.php?showtopic=71147:

New DSN 104 with fixed second hand looks reasonable and gives good impression though pictures are not ideal - too dim to properly see all the important details. The link is here: http://www.rwg.cc/members/index.php?showtopic=71010&hl=

The only thing I'm a bit concerned about - I like the look of 104 with "dark" metal hands, like here http://www.chrono24.com/externewindows/bil...ina&lang=en

and on DSN pictures they look plain chrome. Is it just a play of light or there are 2 versions on gen 104 with "dark" and "chrome" hands?

Any other drawbacks on this new DSN 104? Also, how good are DSN leather straps with deploy buckle - should it be replaced it right out of the box or it's good enough to wear it?

Are there any dealers around offering better rep of 104 than DSN?

EDITED: link fixed

Edited April 14, 2008 by Juso

[sssurfer]

The only thing I'm a bit concerned about - I like the look of 104 with "dark" metal hands...

and on DSN pictures they look plain chrome. Is it just a play of light or there are 2 versions on gen 104 with "dark" and "chrome" hands?

Your link is not working.

But gen 104 are with "chrome" hands only. If you found a pic of a gen with black hands, either the hands have been replaced or it was a play of light on the gen pic.

EDIT: got your link working from another thread. It was just the pic.

Are there any dealers around offering better rep of 104 than DSN?

Well, we are still discussing about it. A 104 in competition with DSN's is that from Joshua/Andrew/Angus/King's.

DSN's is more accurate in the caseback, no doubt. But about the dial, someone is preferring DSN's while others the others'.

[Juso]

Your link is not working.

But gen 104 are with "chrome" hands only. If you found a pic of a gen with black hands, either the hands have been replaced or it was a play of light on the gen pic.

Thanx sssurfer. I played a bit with a gen PAM (don't know exactly which one, with power reserve) in a shop and got confusing feeling about the metal on hands, one moment it's dark another moment bright, so was wondering whether this is a special metal OP uses that gives this odd effect or really a play of light, seems like the later.