DSN cases

[JWR]

So i've been having an email back and forth with Davidsen about his new auto and GMT models - trying to figure out which case they're using - his case, or a standard rep case...

Apparently the CGs from his manual models won't fit on these autos and GMTs, but he says that it's not a standard rep case... curious if anyone can lend some insight to this

[archibald]

So i've been having an email back and forth with Davidsen about his new auto and GMT models - trying to figure out which case they're using - his case, or a standard rep case...

Apparently the CGs from his manual models won't fit on these autos and GMTs, but he says that it's not a standard rep case... curious if anyone can lend some insight to this

In my experience davidsen makes his cases to fit his dials and vice versa. Unless it was my turn to take one for the team, I'd certainly wait to see if someone succeeds in combining parts before I tried it.

[PAMman]

In my experience many of DSN's dials are too large to fit a regular gen or rep case but some of his dials are the correct diameter. However I don't know which cases he uses for the normal diameter dials. An example of this is his latest 201A dial, which is the regular diameter but he is using his own bespoke case which is totally incorrect, with the crown sitting too high in the case. This means the movement and dial are also too high but this is disguised by his use of a crazily high bezel. His 201A case is an awful shape but at least his dial will fit a normal rep case which incidentally is the closest to the correct preV case with its shorter, more rounded lugs.

I can also confirm that his Ti case takes his peculiar, larger diameter dial and that again the crown sits too high in the case, but not as bad as the new 201A. He has disguised this error by making his rep Ti CG thicker than it should be, with the section above the lever the same thickness as the lower segment. This means that the arc of the crown above the CG is about right but the arc below the CG is too small. This is very apparent when you are winding the watch as your fingertip can feel as if it is entering the CG at the end of each turn. Additionally the lever closes onto the lower half of the crown rather than the centre, pushing it off line if it's tight fitting. However they are normally very loose fitting, possibly for this reason. His incorrectly proportioned CG cannot be swapped for a regular rep / gen item as the screw holes are wrong and anyhow the correct profile CG would highlight the wrong crown & stem placement issue. Another crazy thing about his Ti case is the thickness of the lug screws

Edited April 30, 2008 by PAMman

[swdivad]

In my experience many of DSN's dials are too large to fit a regular gen or rep case but some of his dials are the correct diameter. However I don't know which cases he uses for the normal diameter dials. An example of this is his latest 201A dial, which is the regular diameter but he is using his own bespoke case which is totally incorrect, with the crown sitting too high in the case. This means the movement and dial are also too high but this is disguised by his use of a crazily high bezel. His 201A case is an awful shape but at least his dial will fit a normal rep case which incidentally is the closest to the correct preV case with its shorter, more rounded lugs.

I can also confirm that his Ti case takes his peculiar, larger diameter dial and that again the crown sits too high in the case, but not as bad as the new 201A. He has disguised this error by making his rep Ti CG thicker than it should be, with the section above the lever the same thickness as the lower segment. This means that the arc of the crown above the CG is about right but the arc below the CG is too small. This is very apparent when you are winding the watch as your fingertip can feel as if it is entering the CG at the end of each turn. Additionally the lever closes onto the lower half of the crown rather than the centre, pushing it off line if it's tight fitting. However they are normally very loose fitting, possibly for this reason. His incorrectly proportioned CG cannot be swapped for a regular rep / gen item as the screw holes are wrong and anyhow the correct profile CG would highlight the wrong crown & stem placement issue. Another crazy thing about his Ti case is the thickness of the lug screws

[PAMman]

Crazy... why doesn't he just reverse engineer a gen case... or even a good rep case for that matter... It ain't that hard

Why doesn't he simply use the regular production cases which are fine, unless he can improve on them? Jimmy Fu got a small run of 200 cases, bezels CGs etc made and they were 1:1 copies of his own 001D. This is the standard that should be expected of anyone who sets themselves up as a niche producer of higher quality replicas. Instead DSN has produced his own quirky interpretation of the Panerai case which isn't remotely correct and it only causes grief for anyone who tries to correct it.

[JWR]

I was hoping someone has one of his auto models (or GMTs) o compare with 'his own case' and a 'standard rep case'

[sssurfer]

PAMman, when you say "crown sitting too high in the case" do you mean too close to the caseback, or to the bezel / crystal side? (I suppose the latter, but need to get sure).

[PAMman]

PAMman, when you say "crown sitting too high in the case" do you mean too close to the caseback, or to the bezel / crystal side? (I suppose the latter, but need to get sure).

Too close to the bezel. This is a factor in all of DSN's 44mm handwind 6497 cases but it is worst in his latest preV cases (the 2-screw cases). AFAIK his Ti case is worse than his normal SS cases but they all have the crown & stem too close to the bezel and he attempts to disguise this by using a thick misshapen crownguard, with the top segment (above the lever) the same thickness as the lower. In the older genuine / Jimmy Fu / normal rep CG the top segment is approx one third the thickness of the lower part, along its outer edge.

If someone sets out to provide a superior product at a premium price then, where bespoke components are being used, these should be better finished and / or more accurate than the regular production rep. DSN's are demonstrably less accurate, are more poorly finished (if you have one of his Ti crownguards check out the finish on the lever) and frequently don't fit together properly (CG to case is a good example). Compare these areas to a regular Cartel offering at a lower price. Then ask youself, 'How does this handbuilt Panerai replica compare with my regular Steelfish / IWC GST / Navitimer?' I cannot understand how he has persuaded so many people that his product is desirable.

Edited May 1, 2008 by PAMman

[scoobs1971]

So i've been having an email back and forth with Davidsen about his new auto and GMT models - trying to figure out which case they're using - his case, or a standard rep case...

According to Davidsen "Gmt dial and hands are ok to fit regular case".

I was looking to upgrade my standard PAM088 with the new hands and dial, but instead ordered the complete PAM088 thnx to SSSurfer .

[JWR]

so... wait... it then IS a standard rep case on the GMT?

[frankt]

Why doesn't he simply use the regular production cases which are fine, unless he can improve on them? Jimmy Fu got a small run of 200 cases, bezels CGs etc made and they were 1:1 copies of his own 001D. This is the standard that should be expected of anyone who sets themselves up as a niche producer of higher quality replicas. Instead DSN has produced his own quirky interpretation of the Panerai case which isn't remotely correct and it only causes grief for anyone who tries to correct it.

I seriously doubt he actually PRODUCES his OWN Ti cases...Here's why I feel so: I own a Ti 036, that I bought from a trusted dealer on another board in January of this year...This case has exactly the same "quirkiness" as the one you described earlier, the overly thick lug screws, the etched engravings, and the crown centered slightly higher than the center of the caseback...I know the CG isn't "standard", since I tried to switch it with another 036 case, and it wouldn't line up....This watch came with a proper canon pinion, a sapphire, single a/r coated crystal, and a 2mm crown that fits almost perfectly flush against the case, and a nicely fitted tight lever that contacts the crown dead center.(the only significant variation from the Dsn setup!)....And at the time I got it, it cost LESS than $150 !!...The only drawback to the entire setup is the fact that the Asian

movement has the "curved" rather than the "angular" plate layout...A non issue to me, since nobody but me ever looks at it!!

I feel that this case set is a good deal better finished and accurate than the other 036 that I had side by side with it...

The only mod I found necessary to perform was to grind a gentle curvature to the face surface of the CG, to make it less flat, and truer to the genuine 036...This took @ 10 minutes, only because I work slow!!...All things considered, this is the nicest Ti case I have handled, but I would NEVER pay Dsn's prices to own one!! ;)

Edited May 1, 2008 by frankt

[PAMman]

I seriously doubt he actually PRODUCES his OWN Ti cases...Here's why I feel so: I own a Ti 036, that I bought from a trusted dealer on another board in January of this year...This case has exactly the same "quirkiness" as the one you described earlier, the overly thick lug screws, the etched engravings, and the crown centered slightly higher than the center of the caseback...I know the CG isn't "standard", since I tried to switch it with another 036 case, and it wouldn't line up....This watch came with a proper canon pinion, a sapphire, single a/r coated crystal, and a 2mm crown that fits almost perfectly flush against the case, and a nicely fitted tight lever that contacts the crown dead center.(the only significant variation from the Dsn setup!)....And at the time I got it, it cost LESS than $150 !!...The only drawback to the entire setup is the fact that the Asian

movement has the "curved" rather than the "angular" plate layout...A non issue to me, since nobody but me ever looks at it!!

I feel that this case set is a good deal better finished and accurate than the other 036 that I had side by side with it...

The only mod I found necessary to perform was to grind a gentle curvature to the face surface of the CG, to make it less flat, and truer to the genuine 036...This took @ 10 minutes, only because I work slow!!...All things considered, this is the nicest Ti case I have handled, but I would NEVER pay Dsn's prices to own one!! ;)

I have no idea what he produces but I agree that it's unlikely that he actually commissions anything other than dials. However he uses cases which are a departure from the usual reasonable accurate rep case and in fact, with the exception of a couple of his dials and his crowns I don't consider that any component which is uses is even equal to the normal rep. Every other component is less accurate, less well finished and very carelessly assembled together to make a watch. See Uncle Jay's assessment of his recent delivery of DSN's 'premium products'.

[piberf]

As they are finishing a Pam 183H?

There are many flaws?