lello

I'm just taking for granted Archibald words, as Mark doesn't say anything about all this..., at least on the board. I didn't know he said he wouldn't make anymore 7753 DW. I'm also getting confused.

I have 4 DW 2893 (for GMT) left right now. You can see its pic on the top of this post. I sell them for 40 euros+ 5 euros registered mail shipping. I do have some 2892-2 (for PR) to the printer and should be ready soon. I don't make it for 7753, because Mark is making it. I don't make it for 7750, because Archibald is making it. P.S.: please, members who spent their word with Mark, should buy it from him.

Archibald, although I'm not an English mother language and I'm not a perfect English speaker too, I have the feeling that your words are a bit weird. As I just said, if your datewheels will be "good enough", there won't be any reason for me to start a parallel production. From your words, we can deduct, your DW will be fantastic, when so, please can you put two apart for me? But please, do the same price for me as for the others. I assume that as you say: "Screen printed numbers or numbers that look the identical but which were purchased for a fraction of the cost of producing screen printed wheels", you mean that the numbers will be also in slight relief, for the effect of pigment thickness, as I personally believe that this feature, can be important to recreate the same feeling of a gen DW number, especially when viewed under good cyclop. This being said, as I can see how sure you are about the quality of your DW, I don't think you will have any competitor's matter, as, as you stated, it's impossible to produce real printed datewheels, for the same price of a sticker. So Archibald don't worry and be happy, you'r gonna sell many of them!

Thank you guys, now I can work on it. I will be making a post to check how many people could be interested in this.

To www_watch: you are maybe right, perhaps Mark is working on the 7753 and Archibald on 7750, but as far as I know, the 7750 will be a kind of sticker, although I'm sure it will produce a good result, it won't be exactly the same as an actual DW. On the other hand, it will be probably much cheaper (I personally don't know the price). As I recall I came in peace and I would like to hear Archibald and Mark about what I wrote above. I'm getting a new Pam with asian 7750 (and one I have already) and so, I need good datewheels for these watches. Is it possible to see a pic of what Archibald is producing? If they are good enough, I will be very happy to get two. But if they won't be good enough, I will need to make it myself, that would mean to make some more than two. This for two reasons: 1) the manufacture doesn't print less than at least 20 pieces. 2) they would cost too much, without spreading the cost of cliché. Are they ready to be seen?

To docblackrock: you're right! If you will come here next March, if you like we can go there and perhaps they will allow us to see the Panerai museum that's upstairs.

To Kruzer00: I hope the sense of your words is not that I'm operating to undercut anyone... I've never said, or thought that Mark shouldn't start working on these datewheels. Regarding the recoup money of the four DW of the last run, as I have wrote above, I will be happy to replace the old version Dw, at half of the price, that means 20 euros + shipping. I believe this is an honest offer, as I pay more than that for them.

Ok, I didn't expect that the guys working on datewheels project, would be happy to see me back. However, I came back in the spirit of bringing something positive to the community and not to scatter poisons around. Archibald, it is true that I wasn't aware of Mark's work, but this is not the reason why now I came back with the datewheels on sale. If this would be the reason, I would be in fault, as before producing something, I should have checked if anyone else was working on it. The true is that I started quite long before him and almost one year before you, to work on the 2893 and 2892 DW upgrade. The manufacture which is printing the DW for me, is actually working on the 2892-2 as well, during these days. All this time I was in silence, it was waiting and fighting to get them be made properly, as Mark is not the only one who had to pass from hell, before to succeed and I passed there before him too. In fact, although I would have now the chance to make ANY datewheel, I stopped myself to produce the 7750 and 7753 DW, right because I saw that Mark was releasing those. But why should I stop selling the 2893/2892 ones, as I was the first to work on? Now I would like to find a way out and I agree totally with Sssurfer, when he says that the members who made a preorder with Mark, shouldn't buy from me. But i also would like to find an agreement with you guys. If I understood right, you Archibald, are working on stickers and so they will be much cheaper than actual datewheels, although probably their quality wouldn't be the same. But I think that your products will stand on a different target, than mine and Mark's DW. Members who can't afford, or prefer not to spend too much for the DW upgrade, will surely buy from you. While people who don't mind how much it costs, but want the maximum result, they wouldn't by yours anyway, but Mark's ones, or maybe mine too. In other words, I don't think me and you are in competition actually, whatever Dw model we make..., this is at least my point of view. Different is the position of me and Mark, as we probably are making the DW, with the same kind of technique and perhaps with similar quality level. I would be rather happy if Mark's DW would be even better quality than mine, because so that, we would have three products, for three price ranges, as I assume that Mark's ones, cost more than mine. Listen, if what we all are saying is the true and so, that none of us is doing this to make money, but just to recover the expenses, besides to the community interest, I don't think we will have any trouble to find a solution, good for anyone. If instead someone is doing it for business, we might have some problems then. In conclusion, personally, regarding the 2893-92, I would just like to recover my losses and nothing more, however I don't have a clear idea about the market potentiality of this DW. Personally I also believe, that Mark should have very good return from the 7750/7753 DW, (I think they are now the most requested), as he would be the only one to work on them, so perhaps a solution could be that I would sell the 2893-2892 DW and he would sell the 7750-7753 ones. Obviously, as I said, people who ordered 2892/3 to Mark, will get it from him. This is just an idea, obviously if you don't agree, I couldn't complain, as the market it's actually free. If Mark would like to say his point of view, it might be helpful. Here I want also communicate to all of you, that I just started to work on the IWC Ingenier DW.

Thank you guys. These pics will be very useful. I only have some doubts about the #7, all the others I think I'm able to redisign them. I'm quite busy with my regular job right now, but I will let you see the drawings asap.

Hi, I'm planning to produce a datewheel for this IWC with correct font. If anyone could supply to me some good pics of the real one, I would appreciate it. I have a couple of pics, but I can only see 1-2-6 numbers. I made a research, but I didn't find this font anywhere and so, I'm designing it by myself. To nake it accurate I need some more references. Can anyone help? Thank you, -- Lello.

Hi Guys, wanted to tell you that today I went to the Panerai boutique here in Florence and bought an alligtor strap for my 063. Have a look at what I brought out of the shop. Perhaps I should feel better with these stuff, after I spent € 240 for a strap. I love the agenda anyway, there are also several interesting info inside and also the 2006 catalog is great. Can you believe it?... they give you also a case for the receipt!

To cskent69: when I first looked at the pic, I was also surprised about this grane in the black of the DW, but I can swear it's not visible, even with a mgnifying glass. Now the few members who bought it, are receiving it and hopefully they will show their satisfaction. Above here ther is one of them that seams very happy. Believe me, it looks totally smooth even under a mag lens. -- Lello.

"Hi all members, please excuse me if I want to make this post to clarify this datewheels issue and to trace back its history, and some of mine too. First of all, my intention is not messing around or creating problems to anyone, but just behaving to the interest of our community. I would like to recall that I personally started working on the Panny datewheels in June 2005, one and a half years a go, all the veterans here will remember that. I started with the 2893 wheel, for GMT 063 and 029. I faced several problems since the very beginning, I am more than aware that this is a hard task to anyone to venture into, and I have not been the only one who broke his head several times before finally getting a good result. When criticism was raised I decided to put myself on a side, promising to myself that I would come back only if and when I would succeed on the datewheel issue. Now the time has come. Now I can imagine that others who worked on similar projects may now get worried in seeing me back on the datewheels, as in the meanwhile they also spent their time, money and efforts in order to make it work. But this is exactly what I also went through, too. I don't like to talk about it, but it may help in getting the whole picture. Right now I'm still out of 1000+ Euros on this project, as I had to pay it all out from my pockets, several cliché and several printing tests, and also full production of 50 pieces each time, only one refunded by the manufacturer. I actually had some income only when I had printed and sold some 2893 datewheels that then revealed a small alignment defect on other watches. I still have one of those datewheels on my 063, and the problem is very slight, almost undetectable on my watch. Now that I can provide new and improved datewheels, anyone who got one of those less-than-perfect pieces will get a new one on half the price. I'm saying this just because I don't want anyone thinking that I came here to steal customers from other fellows who are working on similar projects. I simply happened to start first and finish first, that's all. I was also aware that, for the time I was ready to come back, somebody else could have managed to make it right before me, and I was ready to accept this occurrence. Now I would like to work together to find a solution that may make all us satisfied in the end. All members can judge by themselves, by reading the story. I'm open to any suggestions you all may suggest in order to find a solution that won't hurt anybody. My target is not making money from this, luckily I can live on my profession that it is totally different. My target was, and it still is, and I'm sure it is the same to many of you too, taking our reps as close to the genuines as possible, the "perfect rep". To achieve this goal, whoever is able to offer good solutions and upgraded parts is very welcome. I would be so happy not to need to work on anything anymore because someone else already managed to provide all the upgrades we want. I have the good luck to be born and living in Firenze (now I moved a bit out of town in a more quiet place), the town where Panerai was made, and - I don't know why - here it is possible to find spare parts to any types of watches. Here are a few very specialized shops where all the watchsmiths from all the region use to come to get the parts they need. I shouldn't be allowed to purchase in those shops, but I managed to become very close with the owner of one of these places and now, through him, I am able to get any parts I need. Since the beginning I wanted to be helpful to RWG members, I started to make the 'famous' crowns for Pannies, and a while later I started the datewheel project. Why, now that I finally managed to reach a good result, should I throw everything away and stand on only the losses I went through to make it the interest of the whole community? I noticed that in the meanwhile Palpatine and some other members produced Pam crowns, and I'm pleased of it. I find it very sensible that, should these new crowns work better than mine, people won't ask for my crowns anymore. If Palpatine's crowns are better, I will also buy from him. Right now I am also having my 063 and one of another member relumed. When I'll get the dials back, I'll let you know how they look. I'm receiving some requests to produce the 7750 and 7753 datewheels, but I currently prefer to wait and see the outcome of the other current projects. I read that in 1-2 weeks these new datewheels will be ready. If they will come out good I'll have no reason to do the same, I do not want to compete with anyone. I think that the best and wiser solution might consist in sharing the requests for datewheels, and all those who prove good products might then work on different models. Below you can see the difference between the old datewheel I printed on last January and the new ones. These are printed with proper equipment by a manufacturer that only makes dials. That's why the pigment is so bright, and it will last forever. Ok, I stop here. I will be grateful to all of you, if you will let me/us know your opinion. Thanks a lot, -- Lello

...AND THANK YOU TO ALL ARE WELLCOMING ME BACK!

If you can let me know the exact model name of the original mov. from which the asian 21j has been copied, I will try to see if I can get the blank disks and maybe order the print. Potentially I can let them print any dial, I just need to get at least 10-15 people interested.

Thanks for the info! I've been browsing on Trustytime site and saw several interesting pieces. It's a shame that you think they are not very accurate, from the pics they look very good and some of them, I think are the same watches as the ones are sold on RWG, don't you think so? I forgot to ask you: where did you get the Submersible you are waiting for?

Hi guys, I've been away for quite long and so, I could have missed some new watches on the replica market. A guy has shown to me these pics that I found quite interesting, is it something that also here on RWG is sold by our dealers? Thanks.

Hi everyone! Lello is back! I don't know if anybody cares about it..., but we never know. I don't even know anything about what happened since I stopped visiting RWG, several months a go. So, I can't be sure if you guys can be interested on this, but as Gil said on his recent post here, I've got just a few new datewheels for the Pams GMT's and PR, if in the meanwhile they didn't make any more with the 2893 mov. These ones fit perfectly on our replicas, as the blank discs are the same as the previous ones I printed months a go. On those ones there was a little problem, as some of the numbers were'n perfectly centered. This time, this problem was solved and the numbers have been printed a little bigger and bolder, for maximum result. Let me know if anyone can be interested in getting one. Many thanks, --