Wrong Portuguese Dial?

[jake48]

What a thread .... it took me some time to find out if the discussion was about the dials , the numbers or some kind of smoking stuff.

Any way , just a question guys ... and I am not a IWC expert and I didnt examined the IWC portug Rep under a magnifying glass.

The first think that it striked me was the color of the dial.

The gen has a clean white dial color , where the rep it looks like it has a "silvery with white snow flakes" (????!!!!) color.

Am I wrong ????

If am I wright, to me this is the biggest fault.

Good observation, but that topic has been worked over on the boards. The gneral consenses from people who have seen both dials (Rep & Gen) in person is that the Rep is dead on. The dial color seems show differently depending on wether the photo was taken with a flash or natural lighting.

[Finepics]

TTK's version is the same as everyone elses - there is only one maker of this, just his photography that is different (and better).

[shultz]

What a thread .... it took me some time to find out if the discussion was about (...) some kind of smoking stuff.

As the guy who started this thread I can ensure you that that smoking stuff wasn't my idea

But seriously: I am very thankful that jake could clear all what I asked for.

Edited September 10, 2006 by shultz

[jake48]

As the guy who started this thread I can ensure you that that smoking stuff wasn't my idea

But seriously: I am very thankful that jake could clear all what I asked for.

This is a good thread. Through the sharing of everyone's opinion we came to a clearer understanding of the watch. I look forward to sharing some photos and thoughts when I get mine - I am still wating for my order to come. I ended up ordering both - the Panda and the gold hands version.

[Finepics]

I hear you - Everytime I handle my gen Panerai vs. my reps I have the same feeling

Well I am glad that we have finally concluded that the rep dial is in fact more accurate than the gen!!! Soon IWC will be found faking reps!!!

[alt.watch.obsessive]

This may be up there, but I'm a bit confused as to the conclusion here. The rep that I have (gold hands) DOES appear to have recessed "dots" from certain angles. You have to really look hard. They look raised until you tip it right to the light, in which case it is just like the gen picture above. To be honest, my eyes are too old to tell which is the illusion, but it can look just like that picture.

Steve.

Edited September 11, 2006 by alt.watch.obsessive

[jake48]

To be honest, my eyes are too old to tell which is the illusion, but it can look just like that picture.

Steve.

What is it they say...

Your eyesight is the second thing that goes...

I have to agree with you on that one though.

[dabom]

Good observation, but that topic has been worked over on the boards. The gneral consenses from people who have seen both dials (Rep & Gen) in person is that the Rep is dead on. The dial color seems show differently depending on wether the photo was taken with a flash or natural lighting.

just like counterfeit money is detected by holding it against certain lighting conditions, the fake IWC can be detected by how the photo looks with a flash or natural lighting. The genuine dial on the other hand, never looks "silvery" in any lighting condition.

I've seen pictures too of the replica subdials looking a different colour when shot at an angle. The properties of the plastic (or whatever) dial causes it to reflect differently at different angles and therefore appear a different colour. I found the same thing happened with my PP chrono rep.

Here is an example of how the rep's subdials look like a different colour at an angle:

If you compare with any picture of the genuine, the different colour doesn't occur. Example:

You can see that despite the different angles and lighting conditions of the genuine 3714, at no time does the dial look silvery nor do the subdials look like a different colour. So those who claim that the rep dial is dead-on, are dead-wrong.

Personally I would like to see sports watches repped, not high-end dress watches like the 3714. Reps just do not come close to the finery of a watch whose chief expense is in the finery. Sports watches on the other hand are expensive usually because of the case or bracelet (water-resistance, crown design etc.). As we all know cases and bracelets are fairly easy to replicate and the engineering features, we don't see anyway. Sports watches also usually have black dials which are easy to rep. Isn't it better to get a rep that looks good, rather than one that obviously looks fake. I seriously don't understand those who delude themselves into thinking the 3714 is a good rep. The above pictures clearly show it is not (compared with a Rolex Sub, or Panerai for example).

[lovepanerai]

just like counterfeit money is detected by holding it against certain lighting conditions, the fake IWC can be detected by how the photo looks with a flash or natural lighting. The genuine dial on the other hand, never looks "silvery" in any lighting condition.

I've seen pictures too of the replica subdials looking a different colour when shot at an angle. The properties of the plastic (or whatever) dial causes it to reflect differently at different angles and therefore appear a different colour. I found the same thing happened with my PP chrono rep.

You can see that despite the different angles and lighting conditions of the genuine 3714, at no time does the dial look silvery nor do the subdials look like a different colour. So those who claim that the rep dial is dead-on, are dead-wrong.

Personally I would like to see sports watches repped, not high-end dress watches like the 3714. Reps just do not come close to the finery of a watch whose chief expense is in the finery. Sports watches on the other hand are expensive usually because of the case or bracelet (water-resistance, crown design etc.). As we all know cases and bracelets are fairly easy to replicate and the engineering features, we don't see anyway. Sports watches also usually have black dials which are easy to rep. Isn't it better to get a rep that looks good, rather than one that obviously looks fake. I seriously don't understand those who delude themselves into thinking the 3714 is a good rep. The above pictures clearly show it is not (compared with a Rolex Sub, or Panerai for example).

I assume your comments are based on photo observations rather than comparing the genuine to the replica? I can spot a Panerai or Rolex fake easier than the current Panda and Domino IWC's the one with the gold markers and the one with blue markers are a different story. Furthermore I don't think that anybody is saying the dial is dead on - no replica can claim that, not even the best PAM 111's and in particular not any of the Rolexes out there. I guess all that is being said here is that the dial is pretty accurate and that it would be hard to spot as a replica - you can even take it off your wrist which I certainly wouldn't recommend for most of the Panerai reps out there.

[dabom]

I assume your comments are based on photo observations rather than comparing the genuine to the replica? I can spot a Panerai or Rolex fake easier than the current Panda and Domino IWC's the one with the gold markers and the one with blue markers are a different story. Furthermore I don't think that anybody is saying the dial is dead on - no replica can claim that, not even the best PAM 111's and in particular not any of the Rolexes out there. I guess all that is being said here is that the dial is pretty accurate and that it would be hard to spot as a replica - you can even take it off your wrist which I certainly wouldn't recommend for most of the Panerai reps out there.

are you saying that in the flesh, the rep 3714s do not look silvery under any lighting condition or angle, and the subdials do not look a different shade at an angle? That would be extremely strange to me, since I have never in my life seen a picture that could look so consistently different from reality.

[by the way: I am not trying to destroy the enjoyment of those owning these nice watches, it's just that we have to be realistic. The reason why we don't see more reps of Langes like the 1815, or more PP reps is because they just look awful. Is the case of a Lange or PP any better than a Rolex? No way! But the expense of a Lange and PP is in the finishing of the dial, hands and case to a level that is virtually impossible to replicate to a nice degree. A sports watch like a Rolex does not focus on such exquisite finishing.

Now the 3714 falls in the same category as the Lange and PP. Does the 3714 have a super fantastic case? No - in fact it looks quite plain, and only has 30m water resistance. No - the expense of the 3714 is in the exquisite dial and hands, and at least from the pictures, its obvious that it's extremely difficult to replicate convincingly. Therefore I think it's better for rep makers to concentrate on delicious sports watches which are far easier to replicate]

[lovepanerai]

are you saying that in the flesh, the rep 3714s do not look silvery under any lighting condition or angle, and the subdials do not look a different shade at an angle? That would be extremely strange to me, since I have never in my life seen a picture that could look so consistently different from reality.

[by the way: I am not trying to destroy the enjoyment of those owning these nice watches, it's just that we have to be realistic. The reason why we don't see more reps of Langes like the 1815, or more PP reps is because they just look awful. Is the case of a Lange or PP any better than a Rolex? No way! But the expense of a Lange and PP is in the finishing of the dial, hands and case to a level that is virtually impossible to replicate to a nice degree. A sports watch like a Rolex does not focus on such exquisite finishing.

Now the 3714 falls in the same category as the Lange and PP. Does the 3714 have a super fantastic case? No - in fact it looks quite plain, and only has 30m water resistance. No - the expense of the 3714 is in the exquisite dial and hands, and at least from the pictures, its obvious that it's extremely difficult to replicate convincingly. Therefore I think it's better for rep makers to concentrate on delicious sports watches which are far easier to replicate]

well I just received the one with the golden hands and I now have to agree with you entirely, this was not obvious with the Laureus and Panda that I already have. The subdials are very different from the rest of the dial whereas the original uses the same texture for the subdials - I wish I would have stayed away from the golden hand version, but I still like the Panda, Domino and Laureus ;-)

[dabom]

well I just received the one with the golden hands and I now have to agree with you entirely, this was not obvious with the Laureus and Panda that I already have. The subdials are very different from the rest of the dial whereas the original uses the same texture for the subdials - I wish I would have stayed away from the golden hand version, but I still like the Panda, Domino and Laureus ;-)

I would have to agree that the Panda and Domino look much better because on the use of black in the dial, and silver hands, which help avoid the problems with using a "plastic" silver finish, the yellowish gold or the "painted blue" hands.

[alt.watch.obsessive]

OK, now I can't see, I have that first problem Jake mentioned, and a headache It's a fine rep. On to the Mark IV.

[takashi]

Have fun people!

Dial will fit the finely replicated IWC Portugieser Chrono.

[Bravo]

Looks really worn out - think I'd prefer a new rep dial