New to reps, Just got my first

[hojosan]

I just found out about this board a few weeks ago and went out and made my first purchase, which I reviewed on here as well.

I'm very happy with my replica Submariner, although it appears I have the "Big Mac" of replicas by going with this thing. Oh well. Maybe next time I'll go a bit more esoteric.

Anyhow, I have been reading about how to detect the fact that it's a replica, and looking at this thing on my wrist, I seriously can't tell. All the stuff that I've read about o-rings on the stem, micro etched crown on the crystal, hologram sticker, 120 clicks bezel, and so on--well, this thing's got them. I have looked at what Rolex itself puts out on their site and compared every detail I could to my own sample and can't see any difference. Of course, I have no papers, box, etc.

I saw this thread:

...where Demsey jokingly gave his method for detecting a rep (Step 1: pull off the back and check the movement).

Is that basically where we are? Could I hand this thing (which feels quite substantial and weighty) to virtually anyone without a set of tools and expect it to pass muster? Then again, I'm a novice and neophyte at this hobby, and perhaps I'm missing something that one of you experienced collectors would immediately spot.

I thought about getting a copy of The Rolex Report by Brozak, but it sounds like that's about as useful as a buggy whip storage case given the improved state of the rep market. Are there any books worth having, or is RWG the only resource I should require to adequately educate myself?

-h

[FxrAndy]

To a layman on the street even if you hand him the gen he will think it is a rep unless he belives YOU can afford it and even then his mind will be saying rep as the sub is the most repped watch

An there are people here and there who will not only tell you it is a rep but where you bought it from and what version it is, you could add gen parts and thy would tell you what you added.

But the watches we get now are such a far cry from what we had 3 years ago.

RWG is to my mind the best horological site, here is where you can be educated with out a doupt

Welcome

[freddy333]

Not much I can add to Andy's response except to say that as you gain more knowledge about gens, you will also become more acutely aware of (& bothered by) the inaccuracies of your rep, as minor as they may be on the best reps.

[hojosan]

Well, to be honest, I am quite honestly capable of pulling off the image thing; I don't expect anyone to really doubt that *I* would be wearing such an item. I'm just prone to keeping my capital tied up in income producing assets instead of depreciating jewelry, thus my interest in reps.

My curiousity is really about what details, tricks, shine characteristics, or whatever, someone might notice that would tell him (without taking it apart) that it's not the real deal.

I suppose the literature on this is treated as almost a trade secret by the manufacturers so that their latest mods won't be copied immediately. I can see how they wouldn't want the rep makers to know that (as a hypothetical) there's microprinting etched into the 5 o'clock mark or whatever.

[fakemaster]

To a layman on the street even if you hand him the gen he will think it is a rep unless he belives YOU can afford it and even then his mind will be saying rep as the sub is the most repped watch

I agree with this statement for sure. Read my sig as well. There isn't a case where someone has been called out where they didn't make it happen. So don't worry about it.

Edited January 11, 2010 by fakemaster

[freddy333]

Typically, the difference between a gen & the best reps comes down to a simple phrase - fit & finish. Go to your local AD & handle some of the gen counterparts of your reps & you will see & feel the difference. The white or yellow gold bezel of a gen Datejust or Daydate sparkles in a way that steel, no matter how well polished it is, cannot. Edges are more defined where they are supposed to be, less so where not. Metals & joints are finished to a satiny smoothness & crystals gleam & sparkle in ways that aftermarket parts do not.

[FxrAndy]

My curiousity is really about what details, tricks, shine characteristics, or whatever, someone might notice that would tell him (without taking it apart) that it's not the real deal.

I suppose the literature on this is treated as almost a trade secret by the manufacturers so that their latest mods won't be copied immediately. I can see how they wouldn't want the rep makers to know that (as a hypothetical) there's microprinting etched into the 5 o'clock mark or whatever.

You may be surprised there have been times when the rep of a limited edition watch has been released before the gen, remember the pam cali dial? Panerai released a photo, the rep makers had it out before the real deal, only to find that Panerai changed the dial, it was at least two days before the rep was fixed and re-relieved.

The details and all the rest will come in time and education and before you know it you will sound as boring as we who obsess about a 100th of a mm

I'm just prone to keeping my capital tied up in income producing assets instead of depreciating jewelry, thus my interest in reps

Buy the right watch and it will gain more than you think. If you had a new comex seadweller (insert a number of vintage rollys here) in the 70s, kept it in the safe, that $2-300 would be worth 10s of 1000s now

[deltatahoe]

first off, welcome to RWG hojosan

here's at least one answer your questions about tells & tricks: one quick way to tell for most reps is to unscrew the crown and wind the watch. given most all reps use asian movements (or at the very least a different movement than used in the genuine), there is generally a notable difference in how winding feels on a rep vs. the genuine.

deltatahoe

[hojosan]

Thanks for the advice so far--I am going to stop by the local authorized Rolex dealer this afternoon and take a feel of the real thing and see how it compares to my replica in terms of the fit, finish, and (hopefully they'll let me check the) feel of winding it. Since my rep is a stainless steel model (chosen by me so I wouldn't have to worry so much about tarnishing, cheap looking gold, etc.) I will have to pay especially close attention to the bezel, paint (mine's black), and the oysterlock.

I do love the mechanical nature of this slick little machine and I'm impressed that it seems to keep amazingly good time. Over the last week, it hasn't run fast or slow by over 2 seconds per day. I'm afraid I'm going to have to get another watch soon since I'm getting a sort of gnawing, yearning sensation when I read this board...

[plaifender]

Thanks for the advice so far--I am going to stop by the local authorized Rolex dealer this afternoon and take a feel of the real thing and see how it compares to my replica in terms of the fit, finish, and (hopefully they'll let me check the) feel of winding it. Since my rep is a stainless steel model (chosen by me so I wouldn't have to worry so much about tarnishing, cheap looking gold, etc.) I will have to pay especially close attention to the bezel, paint (mine's black), and the oysterlock.

I do love the mechanical nature of this slick little machine and I'm impressed that it seems to keep amazingly good time. Over the last week, it hasn't run fast or slow by over 2 seconds per day. I'm afraid I'm going to have to get another watch soon since I'm getting a sort of gnawing, yearning sensation when I read this board...

First of all. POST PICS OF YOUR NEW BEAUTY!!! We love pictures here.

Have fun watch browsing at the AD.. just don't be flashing around your rep! To the untrained eye your rep could look completely legit.. to some really keen eyes (like some of the ones on this forum) they'd be able to spot the watch within 2 wrist glances. Don't let the clever marketing of the rep dealers deceive you. Your watch does contain flaws in some miniscule way.

otherwise, i agree with everyone else. this is DEFINITELY the best place to learn about watches (replica or gen).

[hojosan]

One quick update, and I'll drop this topic:

I stopped by the local dealership and checked out their genuine Sub, and noted:

--mine has a different feel to the winding

--the etching on the rehaut on the rep doesn't line up properly at 3 and 9 o'clock

I'm sure there are other "tells" that I lack the experience to spot. I'll keep reading and building my knowledge, and hopefully find another fun gadget like this to work on soon!

[FxrAndy]

One quick update, and I'll drop this topic:

I stopped by the local dealership and checked out their genuine Sub, and noted:

--mine has a different feel to the winding

--the etching on the rehaut on the rep doesn't line up properly at 3 and 9 o'clock

I'm sure there are other "tells" that I lack the experience to spot. I'll keep reading and building my knowledge, and hopefully find another fun gadget like this to work on soon!

See the education happens all the time