Monito1975 Posted February 25, 2011 Report Share Posted February 25, 2011 Hello Guys, As I stated on my other post "Breitling hands", Í just got a Navitimer SS Serie Especiale Replica. I´m going to modify it as I have a Gen ETA 7750 Valjoux 25 J 28800bph movement, Gen Black/Arabic Old Navitimer II Dial and Gen Hands. So I opened my watch and first I noticed numerous finger prints and dirty case cap, as I examined the watch properly I found a piece of plastic, hard , almost like glass. This might be the reason my watch stoped ramdomly even if I left it for 36-42 hours it would run ok but then one it would stop just like that. I also noticed that the winding wheel? or the gear that connects to the stem gear had one tooth broken or missing and when I hand wind it the rotor would turn like a helicopter. ;-) Anyway I wanted to know if this watch is suitable for ETA installation and Gen Dial with Gen Hands Transplant. I also wanted to knowif this movement its a A775? with 28800 or 21000 BPH. Thanks and enjoy the pics Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
andreww Posted February 25, 2011 Report Share Posted February 25, 2011 That would be a 28k movement. Odd that they put the wrong caseback on it, although if you can find a gen Old Navitimer dial, you'll be much better off with that caseback. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Monito1975 Posted February 25, 2011 Author Report Share Posted February 25, 2011 That would be a 28k movement. Odd that they put the wrong caseback on it, although if you can find a gen Old Navitimer dial, you'll be much better off with that caseback. Yes I don´t know what´s up with that caseback, it looked kind of "not very sterile" inside. Did you saw the broken gear in PIC number 2? What about that? Anyway I have a old navitimer II dial and a ETA Valjoux 7750 plus Breitling Old Navi II hands will see how it goes. Andrew is it normal for the rotoe to spin like that when I wind it via the crown? Best Regards Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Monito1975 Posted February 25, 2011 Author Report Share Posted February 25, 2011 Sorry is PIC NUMBER 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bwhitesox Posted February 25, 2011 Report Share Posted February 25, 2011 That caseback would still be wrong for an old navitimer as it should be an A1 caseback but they are not repped so close is good enough. When I made my franken Navi I used the older Fighters rep with 28k movement and the swiss 7750 fitted perfectly. The gen dial however is too large for the case and needs to be shaved down just a tad to fit...Not a big deal. Make sure you also track down a gen or Lello datewheel and double AR coat the crystal as these two mods make a huge difference. Good luck; Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kal Vilmer Posted February 25, 2011 Report Share Posted February 25, 2011 Sorry is PIC NUMBER 3 Who did you get it from? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Monito1975 Posted February 25, 2011 Author Report Share Posted February 25, 2011 Who did you get it from? Some guy in Istanbul, nurshell I think a local guy, I knew what I was getting I just needed the case Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Monito1975 Posted February 25, 2011 Author Report Share Posted February 25, 2011 That caseback would still be wrong for an old navitimer as it should be an A1 caseback but they are not repped so close is good enough. When I made my franken Navi I used the older Fighters rep with 28k movement and the swiss 7750 fitted perfectly. The gen dial however is too large for the case and needs to be shaved down just a tad to fit...Not a big deal. Make sure you also track down a gen or Lello datewheel and double AR coat the crystal as these two mods make a huge difference. Good luck; That looks Awesome Do you have any pics on how you did de mod specially the case "shaving". RGDS Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Monito1975 Posted February 25, 2011 Author Report Share Posted February 25, 2011 Where do you buy thos Lello wheels I can´t find the anywhere? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
andreww Posted February 26, 2011 Report Share Posted February 26, 2011 I don't think the Lello datewheels are available anymore. Your best bet would be to look for a used skyland, bce or SA and swap out the datewheel. You could then sell off the donor at a slight discount. That would probably be your easiest, cheapest bet. I did notice the broken gear, shouldn't affect things too much. The spinning rotor is a sign that the movement needs a service. Was the watch new or used? You really shouldn't hand wind a 7750 except to get it going. Even then it should be done very slowly. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Monito1975 Posted February 26, 2011 Author Report Share Posted February 26, 2011 I don't think the Lello datewheels are available anymore. Your best bet would be to look for a used skyland, bce or SA and swap out the datewheel. You could then sell off the donor at a slight discount. That would probably be your easiest, cheapest bet. I did notice the broken gear, shouldn't affect things too much. The spinning rotor is a sign that the movement needs a service. Was the watch new or used? You really shouldn't hand wind a 7750 except to get it going. Even then it should be done very slowly. The watch was new, I will not use the chrono and I will not wind it, since I removed this piece of plastic it has been working flawlessly with +20 seconds per day though. White-Sox said something about AR but who is doing that and how much is it? I have never done a Movement swap but I really want to try, I´m mostly afraid with the stem removal and the hands installation. Some members are saying that I should "shave" the Old navitimer gen dial in order to make it fit some say that this is not needed any idea why their opinions are different? I would apreciate any tips from any of the pro´s here I´ve seen awesome mods here and I´m getting obssesed with the idea is very adicting. Best Regards and thank you for your comments and tips Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sneed12 Posted February 26, 2011 Report Share Posted February 26, 2011 That would be a 28k movement. Odd that they put the wrong caseback on it, although if you can find a gen Old Navitimer dial, you'll be much better off with that caseback. They don't make the Fighters caseback anymore. I ordered a new Serie Speciale last summer from Josh, and I got this caseback too. I had to trade for a used Fighters to get one. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sneed12 Posted February 26, 2011 Report Share Posted February 26, 2011 (edited) I have never done a Movement swap but I really want to try, I´m mostly afraid with the stem removal and the hands installation. That's great! I think people working on their own watches is fantastic. That said--I would not start with this watch if I were you. Chronos are tricky and A7750s are even more so. Get comfortable installing and removing hands, stems, etc on a watch you don't care about breaking first. Some members are saying that I should "shave" the Old navitimer gen dial in order to make it fit some say that this is not needed any idea why their opinions are different? Because reps vary from production run to production run and factory to factory. No way to know for sure until you try and fit it. I can tell you that you're going to have a sunken datewheel problem when you install your gen 7750 unless you use some kind of overlay. Stem heights for the A7750 and Swiss 7750 are the same (hand sizes are not, for the high-beat, but I see you plan to use gen hands so that doesn't matter). Edited February 26, 2011 by sneed12 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Monito1975 Posted February 26, 2011 Author Report Share Posted February 26, 2011 That's great! I think people working on their own watches is fantastic. That said--I would not start with this watch if I were you. Chronos are tricky and A7750s are even more so. Get comfortable installing and removing hands, stems, etc on a watch you don't care about breaking first. Because reps vary from production run to production run and factory to factory. No way to know for sure until you try and fit it. I can tell you that you're going to have a sunken datewheel problem when you install your gen 7750 unless you use some kind of overlay. Stem heights for the A7750 and Swiss 7750 are the same (hand sizes are not, for the high-beat, but I see you plan to use gen hands so that doesn't matter). Well it pretty sunken already but you can´t apreciate it in the pic.I was thinking of glueing the Gen date wheel without the gears to the ETA wheel but we´ll see, it´s a good challenge. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bwhitesox Posted February 26, 2011 Report Share Posted February 26, 2011 If you get the old case like my one which originally had the fighters caseback the datewheel is flush and not sunken like the new case ones. Not 100% sure why these new ones are sunken. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Monito1975 Posted February 27, 2011 Author Report Share Posted February 27, 2011 It´s hard to tell they look the same to me, the only way is to measure it. Were did you take the watch for AR? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Monito1975 Posted February 28, 2011 Author Report Share Posted February 28, 2011 I don't think the Lello datewheels are available anymore. Your best bet would be to look for a used skyland, bce or SA and swap out the datewheel. You could then sell off the donor at a slight discount. That would probably be your easiest, cheapest bet. I did notice the broken gear, shouldn't affect things too much. The spinning rotor is a sign that the movement needs a service. Was the watch new or used? You really shouldn't hand wind a 7750 except to get it going. Even then it should be done very slowly. So the Skyland rep has a similar Date wheel as the gen Navitimer? Is this correct? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
andreww Posted February 28, 2011 Report Share Posted February 28, 2011 Yep, the Skyland, BCE (some of them), and Super Avenger datewheels will all work in a 6-9-12 Navi. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Monito1975 Posted February 28, 2011 Author Report Share Posted February 28, 2011 Yep, the Skyland, BCE (some of them), and Super Avenger datewheels will all work in a 6-9-12 Navi. Roger that , I think that it will be my plan to get one of those and play with it I will use it as a rat lab . Thanks Mate it´s really nice when you have somebody to help as I have litle idea of I´m getting in to, hehehe but every day I like it more. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Monito1975 Posted March 2, 2011 Author Report Share Posted March 2, 2011 That's great! I think people working on their own watches is fantastic. That said--I would not start with this watch if I were you. Chronos are tricky and A7750s are even more so. Get comfortable installing and removing hands, stems, etc on a watch you don't care about breaking first. Because reps vary from production run to production run and factory to factory. No way to know for sure until you try and fit it. I can tell you that you're going to have a sunken datewheel problem when you install your gen 7750 unless you use some kind of overlay. Stem heights for the A7750 and Swiss 7750 are the same (hand sizes are not, for the high-beat, but I see you plan to use gen hands so that doesn't matter). Is it correct that I will have a sunken date Even if I put a Gen Dial, Gen eta valjoux 7750, and Gen Breitling date wheel? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
andreww Posted March 2, 2011 Report Share Posted March 2, 2011 its really hard to say. I'd like to see a picture from the side if the watch so I can see the side if the bezel. If your date wheel is recessed, its a pretty good indication that you have the newest version with the flatter sliderule. These are fairly new and I really don't know a lot about the, except the word of one modder that said the case is useless. If that is what you have I would suggest you hunt for an older versions as this one will always have a sunken datewheel and the gen dial will not fit. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Monito1975 Posted March 2, 2011 Author Report Share Posted March 2, 2011 its really hard to say. I'd like to see a picture from the side if the watch so I can see the side if the bezel. If your date wheel is recessed, its a pretty good indication that you have the newest version with the flatter sliderule. These are fairly new and I really don't know a lot about the, except the word of one modder that said the case is useless. If that is what you have I would suggest you hunt for an older versions as this one will always have a sunken datewheel and the gen dial will not fit. Well even so I think I could shave the dial a bit and averlay the gen data wheel.Some gen dials I´ve seen look more white than my watch , mine look kind of goldish in direct sunlight.Anyway there you go what do you think? Regards Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
andreww Posted March 3, 2011 Report Share Posted March 3, 2011 That would appear to be the newer version. Not great for modding. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Monito1975 Posted March 3, 2011 Author Report Share Posted March 3, 2011 That would appear to be the newer version. Not great for modding. yes Andrew I agree, however I think Whitesox used this case for his frankentimer, and he shaved the dial a bit and did a date wheel overlay and it looks great. I still don´t understand why the date wheel will be sunkent if I´m using gen movement ang gen date wheel where does the case come into the movement/dial clearance? RGDS Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
andreww Posted March 3, 2011 Report Share Posted March 3, 2011 bwhitesox used and older version (V2 I believe) of the fighters to create his franken. It had a flush datewheel to begin with, so after shaving the dial it fit perfectly with the gen movement. The V3 version that you have has a shallower sliderule ring. Because of that the dial sits higher in the case (closer to the glass). But, the movement still sits low in the case as to allow for pusher and crown/tube alignment. That results in the gap between the dial and the datewheel. To do this mod you are best to find a V1 Fighters. The dial will fit without modification and the sliderule will align with the dial properly. The hands however would need to be broached as the V1 has a 21K 7750 with slightly smaller hand sizes. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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