vr44 Posted October 26, 2011 Report Share Posted October 26, 2011 (edited) Hello Rwg! This is one of my first posts over here! I would love to build a 1960s era Tudor Submariner - 7928. It is a great watch. It has the same timeless style of a sub with out attracting the attention of the name "rolex". I believe ( edit: confirmed) the this would be the same case as a Rolex 5513 / 5512. How would you expert geeks advise me on what parts to source? Some Questions I will have to answer are:What is the best "base" watch to begin this build with? Answer: MBW see post below - expensive Answer : Jos rep $99 (now $119) http://www.1-pc8838.....00-p-9670.html "Perfect base for Tudor submariners, the gen and replica Tudor dial fit's the case perfect " (Edit: Everything below will be in reference to this case not the MBW)Can I find a rep of this dial? Answer: Yes ndtrading ($160) ndtradingcorp.com Answer: Gen - eBay? ($200+)What are the crystal recommendations? Answer: Tropic 19 aka t19 Clarks Crystal or Gen Tropic 39 fits fine too (Clarks T19 is nice, but a little wider on the OD than the Ofrei units) Source: http://www.rwg.cc/to...e/page__st__140 photo What is the Crown/Tube Recommendations Answer: gen 702 crown w/ 7030 stem is proper but crazy expensive Answer: gen 703 crown with 7030 stem is acceptable replacement but 100$ (703 crown is smaller then modern crown and will make the stubby crown guards look better, HOWEVER - this crown will not fit factory tube!) Answer: Modern Gen Crowns will fit the factory tube (i am pretty sure must confirm)What size are the lug holes? Answer: gens use 2mm Spring bars Modification: For the Josh 5513 Case use a 1.3mm Bit and drill out. http://www.rwg.cc/to...e/page__st__120Thoughts on Movements Answer: Proper motor is a slow beat one. Standard 21j is 19k - this is wrong. Gen is 21k (like 2846 i think). 2836 is high beat 28k (i believe) Answer: ETA 2846-2 slowbeat motor Answer: "Easiest and cheapest way is to just replace it with a DG 2813 - which is the slow beat Asian movement. Its sturdy and easy to replace." "buy it off ofrei and the likes or ebay."Modify Crown Guards Answer: on MBW http://www.repgeek.c...highlight=tudor Answer: on Cartel Here are some pics of a 7928 Rep Photos: compliments of timebomb compliments of squierx1 Additional Resources: great info here: http://www.repgeek.c...highlight=tudor and here: http://www.repgeek.c...highlight=tudor Great resource for vintagizing rolex watches: http://www.repgeek.c...highlight=tudor resource here http://www.rwgforum....bmariner-70160/ Any comments - suggestions or words of caution? Edited October 26, 2011 by vr44 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jmb Posted October 26, 2011 Report Share Posted October 26, 2011 Your basic a21j is also 21600 vps but you will be limited on hand choices. I made this one with a decal I brewed up... I used a cheapo rep case, glued in a generic "Super Dome", slimmed the crown in the lathe, and enlarged the lug-holes. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
woof* Posted October 26, 2011 Report Share Posted October 26, 2011 And here's mine with Jmb's decal dial, Josh case, Clark T19, gen 703 crown and rep rivet with gen clasp. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vr44 Posted October 26, 2011 Author Report Share Posted October 26, 2011 (edited) Your basic a21j is also 21600 vps but you will be limited on hand choices. I made this one with a decal I brewed up... Very interesting and nice job. I will fix error above. Does the 2836 movement fit more hands? And here's mine with Jmb's decal dial, Josh case, Clark T19, gen 703 crown and rep rivet with gen clasp. where did you source your 703 crown / tube? Any issues with the install? did you have to re-tap the case with new threads to fit the 703? Edited October 26, 2011 by vr44 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Star69 Posted October 26, 2011 Report Share Posted October 26, 2011 thats not an easy project an Rolex 5513/5512 whould be easier - if you could live whith the wrong caseback i whould try to find an older MBW 1680 case - which is basically an 5513 case - the younger MBW cases are not so good - here you could go also with the Castel 5512/5513 cases. Yuki/Phong are bad (rehaut) / too expensive - sometimes you find an DW case wich is also shitty (doesnt take gen parts) if you are paitient you can find a gen middle case relativly cheep (ebay, vrf) the dial : if you whould go for a younger Tudor - an gen dial is easy to find and rel inexpensive - for this ref you are stuck to aftermaked ones (around $100) tube/crown : any gen will work imho - its just a matter of $$ what you choose .. lug holes - i just whould widen them a little bit - can be done by hand Cgs : all need work : on an MBW case : inside+outside and on the side profile - Cartel : only outside cheers, Frank Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nanuq Posted October 26, 2011 Report Share Posted October 26, 2011 VR44, I've got to give you a huge thumbs up for this. You've done your homework before putting this post together. And what a breath of fresh air to see the old Rose Tudor thread resurrected! That was a nice read. Keep up the pursuit, you're going to end up with a very nice build. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ephry73 Posted October 26, 2011 Report Share Posted October 26, 2011 Similar to one I built recently search for my posts. E 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jmb Posted October 26, 2011 Report Share Posted October 26, 2011 VR44 - The ETA is more of a standard and it will be easier to find different styles of hands for ETA. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ephry73 Posted October 27, 2011 Report Share Posted October 27, 2011 I would definitely lean towards a 2783 ETA. Works flawlessly, right Beat rate and no hacking. Parts are easily sourced and the movements are not too expensive to buy/fix. a 3/64" drill bit will work for the lug holes as well. E Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jasf2002 Posted October 27, 2011 Report Share Posted October 27, 2011 On the Crown tube I can confirm that a gen 703 will not fit the rep tube on a josh case. You are right that the early 703 is best I.e. the one with the long crown is slimmer and makes the CG's look much better. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vr44 Posted October 28, 2011 Author Report Share Posted October 28, 2011 just got this tidbit of info. To replace the tube: "1:1" 5512/5513 Cartel case with stubby crown guards use a 3mm .25 w/ a .3 pitch http://repgeek.com/showthread.php?t=153226 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ephry73 Posted October 28, 2011 Report Share Posted October 28, 2011 To install the gen tube you NEED the correct tool. The tap you can buy off of ebay. E Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vr44 Posted October 28, 2011 Author Report Share Posted October 28, 2011 just got QC photos of my 5513. Man those crown guards look stubby. Anyone see any other flaws? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vr44 Posted October 28, 2011 Author Report Share Posted October 28, 2011 (edited) To install the gen tube you NEED the correct tool. The tap you can buy off of ebay. what does it look like? I imagine a reamer... I would definitely lean towards a 2783 ETA. Works flawlessly, right Beat rate and no hacking. Parts are easily sourced and the movements are not too expensive to buy/fix. a 3/64" drill bit will work for the lug holes as well. both very helpful comments. Will the a21j hands fit this movement? Edited October 28, 2011 by vr44 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jmb Posted October 28, 2011 Report Share Posted October 28, 2011 No, you will need hands for ETA movement if you use the 2783 - I would just use the a21j that comes in it. Looking at the timer screen the .7 msec beat error seems quite high. I always try to adjust mint to no more than .3 and I try to get .1 or .2. The Cartel case-back should be thick enough to mill flat and engrave and once the CGs are re-shaped and a slimmer crown is installed they won't look so bad. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ephry73 Posted October 28, 2011 Report Share Posted October 28, 2011 +1 to what JMB said. Worse case scenario, get a Tudor Rose dial from Raffles in the smaller size and go with that after the case work is done. E Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Star69 Posted October 28, 2011 Report Share Posted October 28, 2011 don't get the Clark tubes - i had 2 broken while installing - Cousins UK seems to be better ... CGs can look way better after shaving outside : cheers, Frank Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jasf2002 Posted October 28, 2011 Report Share Posted October 28, 2011 The SG's do look stubby but they can look quite nice - here's mine Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vr44 Posted November 4, 2011 Author Report Share Posted November 4, 2011 http://www.repgeek.com/showthread.php?t=139958 Greatpost on modifying a noob case Should have my watch tomorrow -first mod will b the cgs . Suggestions on sand paper? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Star69 Posted November 4, 2011 Report Share Posted November 4, 2011 http://www.repgeek.c...ad.php?t=139958 Greatpost on modifying a noob case Should have my watch tomorrow -first mod will b the cgs . Suggestions on sand paper? wet+dry sandpaper - different grades - and time ! - it took me like 1 hour for each side - if you finnish it up with very fine sandpaper you dont even use an Dremel to polish the case again - i used Cape Cod ... cheers, Frank Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ephry73 Posted November 4, 2011 Report Share Posted November 4, 2011 Hello Rwg! This is one of my first posts over here! I would love to build a 1960s era Tudor Submariner - 7928. It is a great watch. It has the same timeless style of a sub with out attracting the attention of the name "rolex". I believe ( edit: confirmed) the this would be the same case as a Rolex 5513 / 5512. How would you expert geeks advise me on what parts to source? Some Questions I will have to answer are:What is the best "base" watch to begin this build with? Answer: MBW see post below - expensive Answer : Jos rep $99 (now $119) http://www.1-pc8838.....00-p-9670.html "Perfect base for Tudor submariners, the gen and replica Tudor dial fit's the case perfect " (Edit: Everything below will be in reference to this case not the MBW)Can I find a rep of this dial? Answer: Yes ndtrading ($160) ndtradingcorp.comAnswer: Gen - eBay? ($200+) Wrong. You'd be lucky to find a rean Gen for less than $400, much less on eBay. Reps on ebay at the $200 price range, yes What are the crystal recommendations? Answer: Tropic 19 aka t19 Clarks Crystal or Gen Tropic 39 fits fine too Go with OFrei's t19 service crystlal for a more accurate dome (Clarks T19 is nice, but a little wider on the OD than the Ofrei units) Source: http://www.rwg.cc/to...e/page__st__140 photo What is the Crown/Tube Recommendations Answer: gen 702 crown w/ 7030 stem is proper but crazy expensive Answer: gen 703 crown with 7030 stem is acceptable replacement but 100$ (703 crown is smaller then modern crown and will make the stubby crown guards look better, HOWEVER - this crown will not fit factory tube!) Answer: Modern Gen Crowns will fit the factory tube (i am pretty sure must confirm)What size are the lug holes? Answer: gens use 2mm Spring bars Modification: For the Josh 5513 Case use a 1.3mm Bit and drill out. http://www.rwg.cc/to...e/page__st__120 3/64" drill bit will work also, and more accurate in size than 1.3mmThoughts on Movements Answer: Proper motor is a slow beat one. Standard 21j is 19k - this is wrong. Gen is 21k (like 2846 i think). 2836 is high beat 28k (i believe) Answer: ETA 2846-2 slowbeat motor ETA 2783 will work also Answer: "Easiest and cheapest way is to just replace it with a DG 2813 - which is the slow beat Asian movement. Its sturdy and easy to replace." "buy it off ofrei and the likes or ebay."Modify Crown Guards Answer: on MBW http://www.repgeek.c...highlight=tudor Answer: on Cartel Here are some pics of a 7928 Rep Photos: compliments of timebomb compliments of squierx1 Additional Resources: great info here: http://www.repgeek.c...highlight=tudor and here: http://www.repgeek.c...highlight=tudor Great resource for vintagizing rolex watches: http://www.repgeek.c...highlight=tudor resource here http://www.rwgforum....bmariner-70160/ Any comments - suggestions or words of caution? Some revisions on the post E Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vr44 Posted November 4, 2011 Author Report Share Posted November 4, 2011 @frank - that's for the suggestion. I just got wet/dry paper. One @ 220 and one @ 600 . I plan to cape cod to polish it off. Anyone know where to buy 2mm bars for this ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ephry73 Posted November 4, 2011 Report Share Posted November 4, 2011 @frank - that's for the suggestion. I just got wet/dry paper. One @ 220 and one @ 600 . I plan to cape cod to polish it off. Anyone know where to buy 2mm bars for this ? Yuki, or Nostalgia for the bars. make sure to get 1000 grit wet/dry sandpaper as well. E Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vr44 Posted November 4, 2011 Author Report Share Posted November 4, 2011 Damn - they didn't have 1000 grit I have cape cod cloth - do you think that will work? And who is nostalgia? And how are yuki's 703 crowns and tubes? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nick1972 Posted November 4, 2011 Report Share Posted November 4, 2011 Damn - they didn't have 1000 grit I have cape cod cloth - do you think that will work? And who is nostalgia? And how are yuki's 703 crowns and tubes? 600 grid sandpaper is to abrasive. So no, do not use it after a 600. Get a softer grid in any autoshop. Gary (Nostalgia) sells aftermarket parts on ebay: http://myworld.benl.ebay.be/nostalgia-2000 Tubes from yuki are also good. No crowns in stock but you can find one on ebay for the same price. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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