Ado213 Posted April 27, 2014 Report Share Posted April 27, 2014 Wow, I've never seen them side to side so to speak, big difference. The BP crystal is higher, which is good for me ( reasons on the way) and the bezel angles are completely different . This makes a big difference to machining the case out to accept gen xtal. I knew the gen bezel insert was flatter (seen picture of this before) but not in as great a detail. Thanks guys, keep it coming, going to have to find the time to post my pics of the xtal, this is getting interesting !, Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
danielv2000 Posted April 27, 2014 Report Share Posted April 27, 2014 I knew the gen bezel insert was flatter (seen picture of this before) but not in as great a detail. The insert on the BP Sub pictured above is genuine. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ticktick Posted April 28, 2014 Author Report Share Posted April 28, 2014 Today my SSD V2 arrived from a member. I took it apart immediately and made some interesting observations. Z-serial number. Inside is a gen eta 2836. The rehaut is really wokky and not a seperate piece. It's a one piece construction with the midcase. The crystal is 2,8mm tall, OD is 29,4mm. Bevel angle is not so bad I think. Bezel is held in place with a spring wire. What I don't understand is the height of the midcase, 5,3mm. Same height as my Sub LV rep. Is this really a SSD V2? I think midcase should be taller than a Sub case? BTW some hard work to machine the case for a gen crystal construction. Don't know if it is worth... I took some pictures: Cheers Andi Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
danielv2000 Posted April 28, 2014 Report Share Posted April 28, 2014 Andi, what's the serial number? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ephry73 Posted April 28, 2014 Report Share Posted April 28, 2014 SSD is still one of the cult classics when building a franken. The BP case is definitely better suited for a newer 16600 build however. Can't wait for a V3 or a 1:1 SD case set. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ticktick Posted April 28, 2014 Author Report Share Posted April 28, 2014 Z539117 Cheers Andi Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
danielv2000 Posted April 28, 2014 Report Share Posted April 28, 2014 Z539117 Cheers Andi That's the correct serial number for a SSD V2.http://www.rwgforum.net/topic/133356-super-sea-dweller-question/?hl=%2Bssd+%2Bserial Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ticktick Posted April 28, 2014 Author Report Share Posted April 28, 2014 Thanks Daniel. I thought SSD V2 has got removable rehaut. I took the drawing above and printed it on A4. I calculated all important measurements and compared it with the SSD V2 case. I was really surprised! All measurements are nearly 1:1 corresponding to the drawing! The wokky rehaut is also absolut correct according to the drawing! I'm now really sure that the gen's appearance is only caused by the special shape of the crystal. I will scan my drawing with the measurements and post it here for comparison purpose. Cheers Andi Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ado213 Posted April 28, 2014 Report Share Posted April 28, 2014 Hi all, finally found some time to contribute to this interesting post. So first we look at a generic replacement xtal and gasket for the SD. This is not a gen xtal and gasket, but from what I have learned it should fit a gen SD?. You will notice the gasket is much deeper than the xtal,itself, reviewing the sectional drawing of the gen SD case I posted earlier, this is correct?. So the problem is now, how to get the xtal in the case?. Well the only way is to machine the existing rehaut out. Not having a gen SD to measure is a pain, so all I can go off is the height of the BP SD as it arrived with me. This was a mistake, after looking at the great pics posted of the gen, I could have gone deeper and sat the xtal that bit lower. So out come the existing rehaut, and i make another using the same rehaut angle as the BP. Again with not having the gen it's all I can go off, here's a pic of the rehaut So we now have the three piece construction of the front end, Xtal, rehaut and gasket. On machining the existing rehaut out of the case and to retain the BP xtal height you are left with 0.020" of the existing BP rehaut left in the case, this is a visual problem, you can actually see the joint between the new rehaut and the remainder of the existing. This is why I said I made a mistake, dropping the crystal height would have allowed me to take all the existing BP rehaut out and replace it with a slightly thicker new rehaut and therefore removing the unsightly joint between existing and new. Here's a picture of the case with the new xtal, gasket and rehaut in from the top, I've tried to show the joint but it is hard to spot, but it's really not good enough to me!. And here's a shot from the side, which shows the xtal at the same height as the stock BP So in short this is a doable exercise, all I need is the gen measurements off an SD front end to do it correctly. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ticktick Posted April 28, 2014 Author Report Share Posted April 28, 2014 Wait until tomorrow. I will post the drawing with measurements. Maybe you can compare with your project. Cheers Andi Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ado213 Posted April 28, 2014 Report Share Posted April 28, 2014 Cheers Andi, very much appreciated, it's the missing link! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jmb Posted April 29, 2014 Report Share Posted April 29, 2014 This has always been a sore-subject for anybody contemplating an SSD. Adrian is much more "energetic" than I and I commend him! The couple I messed with I just glued in a 2.5mm thick crystal and decided not to do any more! I talked with Jules-Borel about making some custom crystals (really not that expensive in the grand scheme of things) but they said they could not accommodate my specs on their machine due to the thickness. Here's the plain 2.5mm epoxied in place... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ado213 Posted April 29, 2014 Report Share Posted April 29, 2014 Ok as soon as I get the measurements, I'll see what can be done. Now I have seen the gen crystal height it will make my job that bit easier, dimensions will be a massive bonus. One thing I have noticed is that on the gen ( See cross sectional drawing, posted earlier) the crystal sits directly on top of the rehaut!. Very strange, to have glass touching steel, not really good engineering practice. There looks like a small "bulge" in the gasket at the contact point of the xtal and rehaut, perhaps this is created when the xtal is pressed in, it certainly wouldn't be machineable in the gasket?. But then again the rehaut, xtal and gasket would have to be pressed in together (what I did) as I don't see a way of pressing the xtal in post rehaut without damaging the gasket?. Any ideas anyone Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ticktick Posted April 29, 2014 Author Report Share Posted April 29, 2014 Here is the drawing with my measurements. Some known measurements are taken from the net. The rest is calculated by me. No guarantee they are exact like Rolex the watch manufactured. But they could give a hint for machining the case. Cheers Andi Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ado213 Posted April 29, 2014 Report Share Posted April 29, 2014 Cheers Tictick, this will do very nicely. Just what the doctor ordered!! At least now I have the gen measurements, which should allow me to reveres engineer the BP Thanks a lot, I can see you've put a lot if time into this, perhaps now we can collectively crack this!. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ticktick Posted April 29, 2014 Author Report Share Posted April 29, 2014 Adrian, the gen gasket has got two bulges. The first one on the inner diameter sets into the groove of the crystal. It fits the gasket to the crystal. The second bulge on the outer diameter of the gasket you can see sets under an edge in the case. It's very small and special shaped to held the gasket in place in the case. So the only possibility to assemble the whole thing is to fit crystal, gasket and rehaut. Then press in these 3 pieces as a preassembly into the case. Cheers Andi Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ado213 Posted April 29, 2014 Report Share Posted April 29, 2014 Hi Andi, I did as you say, assembled the gasket xtal and rehaut before pressing into the case. I just don't get this seal !! It seems so little of the xtal is held within the case. Plus there is no seal between the xtal and rehaut. If you look at the sub or Deepsea there is a seal seat that the xtal "sits on" No such thing here, the xtal sits on the rehaut. Anyway, with your dimensions, I can probably track this and see what's going on. Let's get this cracked, seems we can't get an alternative at the moment. Plus looking at the oics, the BP xtal sits higher than gen. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ticktick Posted April 30, 2014 Author Report Share Posted April 30, 2014 Considering the DSSD there is not a seal between crystal and metal underneath. The crystal sits directly onto the ringlock and builds a 3 piece stack with the bottom. This stack is pressed together by water pressure whilst diving. The seal is laying around the outer crystal diameter. At our SD I think the outer bulge of the seal is not absolutely necessary. But maybe it makes the construction stronger against inner pressure caused by He and prevents popping out of the crystal as an additional safety to the He valve. Due to the thickness of the sapphire there shouldn't be a problem sitting onto metal. Cheers Andi Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ticktick Posted April 30, 2014 Author Report Share Posted April 30, 2014 BTW: Here you can download an article about the SD and mainly DSSD construction from my Dropbox. https://www.dropbox.com/s/cjd1hy2711e8iwe/DSSD%20Construction.pdf Cheers Andi Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ado213 Posted April 30, 2014 Report Share Posted April 30, 2014 Hi Andi, thanks for the link (very informative post) yes do know the DSSD has xtal to steel, perhaps I am confusing myself with mu limited knowledge of glass/crystals. I do now that toughened glass should never touch steel as it almost always cracks and shatters, but here were dealing with a different animal "sapphire crystal" completely different composition and properties. I think I'll have to do a lot more reading up on sapphire crystals to understand their mechanical properties. But that apart, and after your excellent dimensional work on the gen SD, i feel I have enough to progress to see if it is possible to get the look and water tightness we would desire. Only problem now is time !!. On holiday from the 5th-May for a fortnight, so this going to slow me down just when I have everything to progress !! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ticktick Posted April 30, 2014 Author Report Share Posted April 30, 2014 My problem is time, too. I'm planning to mod my SSD on a lathe. My Dad has got a small lathe for mechanics. So I will turn out the rehaut and will machine a new one like you did. I think over a solution which can take a gen gasket and crystal or rep parts, too. Gen spec gasket should be availible by Clark's. But the crystal...hard to find and expensive. Had a look on Startime's replacement crystal for SD. But it seems to look like all generic crystals which incorrect angles. Cheers Andi Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ado213 Posted May 1, 2014 Report Share Posted May 1, 2014 Andi, I have a drawing of the dimensions I bored out the BP SD to, it may help you if you get chance to attempt it?. If you can hang on until I get back from hols, I am re boring the prototype so the crystal sits lower and I can get rid of the remaining existing rehaut. Hopefully then all will be well to copy! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ticktick Posted May 1, 2014 Author Report Share Posted May 1, 2014 Yes, I think this would be a help for my project. Maybe next week I'm able to take some time for working on the lathe with my SSD V2. Cheers Andi Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ado213 Posted May 1, 2014 Report Share Posted May 1, 2014 The ST xtal will fit the BP SD, but you will need to custom make a gasket, the BP gasket is too small. I'll post pics and your drawing Andy, as soon as I get a minute mate! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ado213 Posted May 6, 2014 Report Share Posted May 6, 2014 (edited) Hi Andy, sorry for the delay, been really busy clearing the decks so I could get away on my holiday. Below are the dimensions of the BP SD case and in red is what I bored out to accept generic crystal and gasket. Hope this is of use as a guide, when i do this again I will go 0.7mm deeper and take the whole existing rehaut away. Edited May 6, 2014 by Adrian Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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