Buying A Gen Gmt Ii On Ebay

[MechWatch]

I am not sure buying a gen from eBay belong in this forum but I am sure there are other members like me; wanting to buy a gen after owning a few reps. So it may be helpful. Delete or move as Admins find appropriate.

After having several reps, I got the bug to have a gen "sport" type Rolex. Went to an AD to price a GMT II and sub. The place is very intimidating with everyone wearing great looking suits and I felt I went to a black tie affair underdressed. They were out of ss subs except blue and gold and all gold version. Only GMTII available was a pepsi. I asked how much. Without hesitation they said $5075, which is the list price. I wondered how many people don't want to seem like a cheapskate and bought it at that price. I then asked if there are any discounts. 5% they said, so around $4,800. After fondling the watch awhile and playing with the bezel (120 clicks, wow, my rep is only 60) I said I have to think about it and thank you very much and left. Next option is to try buying a used one and I tried eBay. With all the horror stories, I approached it very cautiously:

1. Watched eBay auctions for GMT II for about a month to get a feel for price range. A year or too old GMT II can be had at $3500 and less than 5 years at $3000. Some higher and some lower at both ends depending on condition and age. Watch dealers on eBay usually charged more.

2. I ignored the following if I came across them:

* Sellers with less than 50 positive feedbacks (my arbitrary cutoff)

* Sellers with no recent activity (hacked dormant account)

* Listings with no decent pictures or pictures from Rolex (10:10).

* Those that do not take Paypal or credit card, i.e. only accept Western Union or bank wire transfers, etc.

* Listing with buy it now that are out of whack with the price range established above. If it's too good to be true, it's usually is a fake.

* Foreign sellers

3. I looked at pictures of interested listings for the obvious rep mistakes for a GMT II:

* Crown guards & crown

* Incorrect hand stack

* Rehaut

* Poor bezel insert printing

4. Rip-offs found on eBay:

* Fakes

* Gens with aftermarket bezel inserts (number too large with the bottom of 8 slightly cutoff) and dials (GMT I dial on GMT II), by watch dealers with thousands of positive feedback.

* Misinformation. The letter of the serial number and the stated age of the watch do not match. This lie makes the watch seems a couple of years old rather than 4/5 years old. I ruled out that the watch was on the shelf for couple of years before being sold, since the watch doesn't come with papers, so they wouldn't know the purchase date. Another listing shows the Rolex warranty paper but the date of purchase was obviously changed with writing over. It is so obvious its laughable.

5. If you think you found a listing that you want to bid on, then contact the seller for more photos of specific areas not part of listing. This will:

* Give you more pictures to determine gen or fake

* Confirm that the seller has the watch and not just posting other people's pictures.

* See how responsive or willing the seller is in providing more information. If it's a fake he will be hesitant. If he's nonresponsive don't deal with him.

* Try to talk to the seller over the phone. If you seem interested, the seller should be more than willing to talk to you so he can sell his high priced watch. In my case, after asking for more photos, he sent photos and included his phone number in case I have more questions. I called him and discussed the history of the watch, why he's selling; confirm condition and age of watch, etc. He was an individual selling a Rolex to raise money and not a watch dealer.

I found a couple of listing, followed all of the above cautions and got a GMT II at the lower end of the range. It's a K serial number (manufactured in 2001) with papers (Rolex warranty and sales receipt) showing it was purchased in 2005 and still under the Rolex 2 year warranty. Upon receiving the watch, I:

* Checked the hand stack with a loup, GMT hand should be between the hour (on bottom) and minute hand. I don't think there are any reps out there that correctly copied this.

* Dial printing of Rolex Logo and lettering. Gens are smooth with no ragged edges unlike the reps. Some rep dial printing actually looked like sandpaper when viewed under a loup.

* Date thru window. Under a loup, the numbers should still be sharp, while with reps, the edges are rough or fuzzy looking.

* Checked serial number under 6 against the Warranty paper provided, it matched.

* Set time to verify that the hour hand moves independently instead of the GMT hand (some new reps can do this)

* Compared GMT hand to a rep. Should be thinner than a rep and it is.

From the above inspection I was 99% sure it's a gen. On one hand I don’t want to open the back since this will risk losing the 100m water resistant. But I know I won’t sleep easy if I don’t open it. I opened the case back and to my relief, it's a picture perfect cal 3185. I have been sweating it from the instance I sent my Paypal payment to this moment.

So for me, the choice was between a new Gen at $4,800 plus tax or a 2 year old gen GMT II and more than enough money left over to buy a new gen Omega Seamaster Pro if I choose to. Choice was easy to make.

I gained the knowledge and confidence to do this from reading and learning on this forum so thanks to all RWG members that contributed to the forum and my education. I am so pleased with what I learned from this forum that I became a supporter, one-year subscription paid! It's well worth it.

Disclaimer: eBay is full of scam artists and are very creative. Even if you followed the above, there's no guarantee you screened out fraudulent sellers. Your mileage may vary as the saying goes.

[TJGladeRaider]

OMG . . . someone convinced you that was the real thing?

Jeez Louise, but I hate to see a poor guy get hosed totally so I'll tell you what - I'll give you $1000 for the POS.

I know, I know, I am constantly in awe of my own generosity.

; )

Bill

PS - that post ought to be pinned somewhere. Best "how to avoid EBay rips post I ever saw.

[MechWatch]

Thanks. You can tell I gave it a lot of thought before buying. If I got scammed, I am not sure which is worse, losing the money or hearing my wife's constant reminder that "I told you so".

[marrickvilleboy]

thats how someone should approach buying! very good write up - covered much everything - EXCEPT - that the hand stack has been replicated. Some of the dealers carry the correct hand stack.

and yes....the wife constantly reminder would be death....

[linkukbora]

Congrats.....to your successful purchase of your pepsi I've at often times wanting to pull the trigger on those vintage rollies listed on the Ebay........but the fear of being taken has refrained me from doing so

I'd prefer go to my trusted watch dealers thesedays

[Category 5]

Great Watch! I am genuinely jealous.

Another avenue to pursue for a Gen Rollie is the Diamond District. Take a vacation to NYC and you'll see what I mean. I have seen subs start at $3800, and by the time you leave the dealer with a "no thank you" they are chasing you down the street going $2800? $2600? How much you want to pay?

Go towards the end of the day and some of these guys will do anything to make a few bucks. I'm sure they take a lot of these watches in for low trade in values too, so they can let them go cheap. One thing I've learned about the DD> You can easily pay too much, but if you know how to wheel and deal they'll sense it and make it clear that they want to sell the watch above all.

[By-Tor]

Congrats. GMT is the only gen Rolex I'd consider buying... ever. And the only Rolex that haven't lost its appeal for me during the years. It's a magnificient watch.

Wear it well!!!

[MechWatch]

Thanks for the kind words everyone.

@ By-tor, your magnificent pictures of the pepsi you have posted played no small part in me buying a pepsi rather than in other flavors.

@ Category 5, nice suggestion, I am in the suburb of NYC, and didn't think of going there. The single biggest advantage in my mind is you can inspect the watch right there before paying. I also hear if you are the first one, they will also be very tenacious in making the sale.

@Marrickvilleboy, that's scary. I depended on the pictures of hand stack as a main criteria for gen.

[yt74]

Great post, and a great GMT!