freddy333 Posted May 10, 2007 Report Share Posted May 10, 2007 I took your suggestions to heart, and added a 1st generation Triplock (narrow, with deep shoulder ). I also took the opportunity to pop in a spankin' new, slow-beat, 2846 movement (21 jewel, non-hacking), tricked out with another WM datewheel (this one aligned even more precisely). There is now officially nothing left to be done to this watch except wear it ...(Unless, of course, Repaustria opens up shop for those Hev mods ) Avitt -- Beautiful work and one of the best DRSDs I have seen. My WM DRSD is about where yours is and I think the original WM dial, although nice, is now one of the three remaining weak points (the other two being the case back's modern engraving instead of stamping and the He valve). If you have not yet read it, you might check out my post about sourcing Comex and DRSD dials. Polexpete was kind enough to post some photos of a nice DRSD repaint that I would like to get your opinion on. I already have one of these dials, but I am not sure if that one is better than the WM dial since both contain a different set of flaws. I am also working on an He valve mod for the WM/MBW watch cases, which is based on a previous mod I did for another Sub. I have taken apart one of my older Comex Sub reps, which has a clever and 'working' He valve. You could probably achieve something similar with a rivet or something like that, but since these cheap Subs come with all the parts you need, I decided to take the easier (albeit more expensive) route and just purchase another Sub for the He valve parts. Here is a photo of the parts (please excuse the poor lighting & color -- I forgot to set the white balance before I started) There is the 'valve' and a spring clip. There is an indentation around the lower end of the pin where it slides through the hole in the spring clip. Then you just slide the spring clip down to the other end until the pin is locked and held in place by the spring. There is even a small rubber gasket that fits below the head of the He valve to seal the case (I treat the gasket with silicone case seal). It is quite a clever little valve and I cannot understand why the WM/MBW cases do not include something similar in place of that silly He engraving they come with. Here is a photo of the He valve as it appears in the case What I am still working on is getting the hole drilled in the side of the WM case in place of the He engraving that is there now. Unfortunately, I do not have a drill press (that is the only way I can think of to get the hole drilled) or the proper sized cobalt drill bits (Update 5/15 -- drill bits ordered & should arrive in a few days). After the He valve is removed, the hole in the case of the cheap Sub looks like this As you can see, the hole is stepped. That is, there is a center (smaller) hole that runs all the way through the side of the case, which is approximately 1.10mm dia, and the outer (larger) hole (where the head of the He valve insets) is approximately 2.10mm dia. The diameter of the head of the He valve is 1.91mm. So once I can find the drill bits and a drill press to drill out the hole, all that remains is to chamfer a bit of the inside of the case to give the spring room to sit. That is where I am so far. Update 5/16 -- Received lots of drill bits & off to search for drill press options. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest avitt Posted May 11, 2007 Report Share Posted May 11, 2007 Thanks Pete & Freddy! I'm really happy with this one, and it wears quite nicely (yesterday with jeans, today with a suit). Freddy, that Hev project is an impressive undertaking...Now you've got my gears turning. Thanks for blazing the trail on this one, and please keep us up to date. With regard to the dials, I think our options are limited on these 1665's. I am a fan of the Double Red...A genuine DR dial will sell for about $10,000. I've had my eyes on various aftermarket sources for a couple of years now, and all of the dials I've seen have some type of defect (I know that we all get dialed in to certain defects. For me, it's thin 6 and 9 markers, exaggerated seriphs, and dreadful bogus aged lume). It's my opinion that the MBW DR is the best available. I base this on my belief that there are very few people in the world who could actually (for instance) tell a Mark II from a Mark IV dial, without having a reference in front of them. Let's face it - Any of the dials in any of our 1665's would be called out immediately if posted on Timezone. This goes for DR, SR, GW, or Comex...None of them would pass close scrutiny. Now, I do suspect that there are near-perfect redials out there somewhere...But they are probably being sold as genuine, for thousands of dollars. We simply don't have many options available in the <$500 range. I hope I'm proven wrong... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pugwash Posted May 11, 2007 Report Share Posted May 11, 2007 Very nice! It's giving me more ideas for mine. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Watchmeister Posted May 11, 2007 Report Share Posted May 11, 2007 Avitt- Truly a work of art. Much kudos for persevering. That is the fun of MBW's. You can keep making them better and better. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
freddy333 Posted May 11, 2007 Report Share Posted May 11, 2007 Freddy, that Hev project is an impressive undertaking...Now you've got my gears turning. Thanks for blazing the trail on this one, and please keep us up to date. With regard to the dials, I think our options are limited on these 1665's. I am a fan of the Double Red...A genuine DR dial will sell for about $10,000. I've had my eyes on various aftermarket sources for a couple of years now, and all of the dials I've seen have some type of defect (I know that we all get dialed in to certain defects. For me, it's thin 6 and 9 markers, exaggerated seriphs, and dreadful bogus aged lume). It's my opinion that the MBW DR is the best available. I base this on my belief that there are very few people in the world who could actually (for instance) tell a Mark II from a Mark IV dial, without having a reference in front of them. Let's face it - Any of the dials in any of our 1665's would be called out immediately if posted on Timezone. This goes for DR, SR, GW, or Comex...None of them would pass close scrutiny. Now, I do suspect that there are near-perfect redials out there somewhere...But they are probably being sold as genuine, for thousands of dollars. We simply don't have many options available in the <$500 range. I hope I'm proven wrong... Avitt -- I will definitely keep you (and rwg) posted on my progress regarding the He valve. I have ordered some drill bits and will probably end up renting a drill press to get the rest of the work done. As repaustria already made clear with his version, it takes an already good rep up another notch. As far as the dials go, I had a feeling you would have the same issues I have regarding the narrow hour markers on the DRSD dial I have (and Polexpete posted a photo of). But I should say that, in person, the lume on that dial is quite well done. It is hard to see in the photo, but (on mine at least) it has just the right hint of original white color around each of the hour markers (the round ones too), which looks like alot of the vintage tritium you see on the gen watches. And I agree that there is probably a near-perfect replacement dial out there, but I also suspect that it will cost no more than the dials I have already found (under $400). There are so many variations of these DRSD rep/aftermarket/repainted dials (each gets one thing right and another wrong) that I think it is just a matter of finding the one with the least objectionable combination of sins. The search goes on. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
klingsor Posted May 11, 2007 Report Share Posted May 11, 2007 With contributions from no less than 15 different vendors or craftsmen, here's my latest iteration of the venerable 1665: Thanks for your comments! very very beautifull some times some old forum fox comes out..... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kingkitesurf Posted May 11, 2007 Report Share Posted May 11, 2007 This is the fun about this forum... I wouldn't even enjoy buying a gen... just slap a load of money and walk away... No this is true craftmanship... Trying to reach perfection knowing that it always will be a rep but eliminating to 0,0001% who is able to detect it.. Luvit! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
freddy333 Posted May 11, 2007 Report Share Posted May 11, 2007 Exactly. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest avitt Posted May 13, 2007 Report Share Posted May 13, 2007 As far as the dials go, I had a feeling you would have the same issues I have regarding the narrow hour markers on the DRSD dial I have (and Polexpete posted a photo of). But I should say that, in person, the lume on that dial is quite well done. It is hard to see in the photo, but (on mine at least) it has just the right hint of original white color around each of the hour markers (the round ones too), which looks like alot of the vintage tritium you see on the gen watches. I just wanted to clarify that none of my comments were directed at your dial specifically. I was just pointing out those thing that I tend to focus on. I know that some people tune in to fonts, letter spacing, colors, etc. As for me, my eyes notice shapes and textures first. I do agree that the lume on your dial is quite nice. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest avitt Posted May 13, 2007 Report Share Posted May 13, 2007 That is the fun of MBW's. You can keep making them better and better. That's definitely the allure of the WM/MBW. Here is what is looked like when I picked it up in Dec. '05 (photos by Z80): A year ago, it looked like this (documented here) ...and now, it's what you see above (with countless intermediate steps along the way). These are definitely ongoing projects. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
freddy333 Posted May 13, 2007 Report Share Posted May 13, 2007 Very interesting progression, Avitt. I see why Sherrington removed the lume on the last dial. The color looks off (too yellowish). I am also giving second thought to the original WM/MBW datewheel as it has those quite genuine looking slightly serifed fonts. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest avitt Posted May 13, 2007 Report Share Posted May 13, 2007 Actually, the dial with yellow markers above was the same one that came on the watch when I bought it. I relumed it myself with Revell Night Color paint. It looked pretty good, when I did it: ...However, I pushed things a little too far, by trying to repair the scratches (you can see them around the date window). When I sprayed the dial with clear matte varnish, it yellowed the markers. So, I decided to replace the whole thing with Sherrington's DRSD dial, which matched my hands perfectly. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
freddy333 Posted May 13, 2007 Report Share Posted May 13, 2007 That is too bad because your original work (aside from the scratches) looked pretty good. You probably could have touched-up the scratches with a black magic marker. It is such a small spot that if done carefully, I doubt you could even see the color difference with a low power loupe. But I guess that is water under the bridge since your watch is gorgeous now. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
freddy333 Posted May 14, 2007 Report Share Posted May 14, 2007 It might have been me who stated the way to adjust the caseback. I have posted pics also. You have to clear the aint first with a tippie and terpentine. Then you run a engraving bit over the letters to smooth the edges. Then polish it. Kingkitesurf -- Did you use a dremel 'engraving bit' to smooth the caseback engraving? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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