Jumbie Posted June 6, 2007 Report Share Posted June 6, 2007 (edited) Was just thinking about that cause I guess that I personally don't like the idea of the gold flaking off. Perhaps wouldn't be a big deal if it were easy to re-plate cause I've seen some mention of Artisan Plating during my search but it also looks like they've become non-responsive recently with speculation that they may have caught on to the watch cases being reps. I've seen some pretty nice watches with plating but I don't think I'd ever risk buying them (with one exception that I'll get to later) because I don't want to worry about the plating get rubbed off or what not. What are your opinions on buying plated reps? I guess that would depend on how you view them - as being disposable (that you don't mind tossing if they get ruined or stop working, etc.) or as something you'd like to keep (which is my view). I also realize that some reps are plated better than others or have the "solid gold" links but that almost seems to be a toss-up from what I've read so far. Anyway, the one exception I mentioned earlier is something like the Breitling Chronomat Evolution with the gold subdials, crown and chrono buttons. Before that, I was thinking that I might be interested in getting the all-white version of this watch at some point and putting it on a brown croc strap but saw someone post the TT version and it looks quite striking. Kind of got me rethinking the whole idea of no gold on reps but only because it seems that the areas that are plated on this rep aren't ones that would see a lot of "action" or acidic sweat. So, like the topic asks - what are your thoughts on gold-plated replicas? Do you ever stay away from a watch you'd like to buy simply because it's plated? I know that lots of you do buy these reps (from the reviews and obviously there is a market for them or they wouldn't be made) so I'd also like to hear your take on doing so. Oh, also forgot to add that I guess I would consider buying a plated rep if it were something I'd only be wearing on special occasions or something i.e. not that often. Edited June 6, 2007 by Jumbie Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
archibald Posted June 6, 2007 Report Share Posted June 6, 2007 Sure, just ask the dealer if the plating is decent. Most will give you a staight answer. Careful about rose gold, though. It varies from decent to crappy looking copper-like. BTW--can anyone direct me to a decent plating shop? I'm sick of trying to deal with Atrisan, who takes forever both to return emails and actually get around to doing any work. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
crystalcranium Posted June 6, 2007 Report Share Posted June 6, 2007 Gold plated watches from china are a crapshoot. I have a very nice FA Jones in Rose Gold that I wear about 3 times a month and it is doing just fine. I have heard horror stories from owners who have had their plated Chinese watches brown from the brass base metal tarnishing under a 0.25 micron plating just sitting in the box. I've stated my case here several times. The very best gold plating from high end Swiss companies is in the 10 micron to 20 micron range. This is an extrordinarily thick plating. "Gold filled" watches and jewelry are a thick wrap of 10K gold physically bonded through temperature and pressure to a metal (usually brass) substrate with a plating of 10 microns of 14K-18K gold on top of that. This is generally known as a 20 year plating. The very best, highest quality aftermarket plating processes deposit 5-7 microns of gold, a thickness that should last 5-10 years in normal use. Run of the mill plating on plated Seikos and Citizens for example are in the 2-5 micron range. Given all of this information, I have always had strong reservations about Asian gold claims. I think all "wrapped" claims are bunk if they are attempting to infer a "gold filled" process in that terminology. Given the accepted quality aspect in a true 5 micron plating, I have no doubt claims of 5 micron plating on asian replicas are nonsense. From what we know of business practices in this part of the world and, in particular, the illegal counterfeit business, the gold plate on replica watches is thick enough, to look good enough long enough to separate the seller from any responsibility for its longevity. If a 0.75 micron plating is good enough to wear every day for 18 months before it looks like like crap and the buyer gets annoyed, then that's plenty of gold. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jfreeman420 Posted June 6, 2007 Report Share Posted June 6, 2007 I love my gold watches.................... And I never miss out on a chance to flash some bling. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Raijor Posted June 6, 2007 Report Share Posted June 6, 2007 I stick to the Two tone reps. All gold has too many wear points and plating will wear off over time. Less area plated - less area to wear off - if the plating is just on the crown and bezel it should wear well - a two tone bracelet will wear better than an all plated bracelet but expect wear points to show up in time. Claims of plating thickness really are of no value - just sales hype in my opinion. Cheers Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
new & improved osteopath Posted June 6, 2007 Report Share Posted June 6, 2007 As a rule, I like one-time purchases- Reps are an interesting alternative to gens if you don't want to spend big bucks on gens. That being said, I like the reps to last- after all, the better ones while cheaper than the gens, are not altogether cheap- particularly if you are getting the better ones with good Swiss movements, etc... SO I tend to stick w the all SS and Solid Gold rather than plated. As others have already stated, plating is crap shoot- and regardless of the quality of the plating, one thing is a certainty- eventually the plating will wear off. -O Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Corgi Posted June 7, 2007 Report Share Posted June 7, 2007 Most of my watches have some gold on them. From the completely-covered full gold president to my new Breitling Navitimer. I am very happy with the gold plate (18K 5 mil) I have owned the prez for almost a year, worn it often, and everything is just fine and dandy. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
crystalcranium Posted June 7, 2007 Report Share Posted June 7, 2007 Most of my watches have some gold on them. From the completely-covered full gold president to my new Breitling Navitimer. I am very happy with the gold plate (18K 5 mil) I have owned the prez for almost a year, worn it often, and everything is just fine and dandy. I'd be willing to wager the house and the car and the safe deposit box your rep isnt 5ml plated...but if you are happy with the performance of the plating so far....that's fine. For a reality check on what a respectable commercial plating outfit regards as a good quality plating, check out the thickness chart at artisanplating.com. A 5 micron plating is in the range of an "extra heavy gold plating" and quite expensive. I think you are giving our Asian manufacturers credit for honesty in advertising and intrinsic quality in manufacturing that isnt part of their manufacturing credo. I believe, if you do not have allergic skin reactive problems with the ingredients, continuous application of thin coats of an automotive car wax to plated reps can do wonders to extend the wearability and appearance of even a thin plating. I have a hard time investing hundreds of dollers in a watch that has a predetermined expiration date on looking like the genuine article. Decent commercial re-plating options are pretty expensive. Lousy cheap ones are lousy and cheap...in the 0.25 to 0.75 micron range. I usually advise sticking to stainless. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zed Posted June 7, 2007 Report Share Posted June 7, 2007 I own many gold plated watches and have had some for years and they still look brand new but you have to treat them right ! The chrome plating on the wheels of my car hasn't fallen off yet either Zed Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chronus Posted June 8, 2007 Report Share Posted June 8, 2007 Most of my watches have some gold on them. From the completely-covered full gold president to my new Breitling Navitimer. I am very happy with the gold plate (18K 5 mil) I have owned the prez for almost a year, worn it often, and everything is just fine and dandy. And you're the guy that thinks the AP Royal Oak Offshore is garish ....! Personally I stay away from plated reps. Too much of a gamble. I love the PAM231 but the plating scares me off. Stick to solid gold (eg. FM Casablanca) or the older MBW's with solid gold midlinks (though the crown and bezel are probably plated). Only problem is that these will set you back a lot more, but will last a lot longer. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
narikaa Posted June 8, 2007 Report Share Posted June 8, 2007 (edited) Agreed some of the GP out there is diabolical.... (yet nowhere near as bad as it was a decade ago on reps when it was seldom good for more than one or two days wear!), but generally easily spotted as such, and therefore avoided by reputable dealers. But conversely a lot is VERY GOOD and equally on a par with the GP on say a Edited June 8, 2007 by narikaa Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gargoil Posted June 8, 2007 Report Share Posted June 8, 2007 I like gollllldddddd!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
archibald Posted June 9, 2007 Report Share Posted June 9, 2007 Agreed some of the GP out there is diabolical.... (yet nowhere near as bad as it was a decade ago on reps when it was seldom good for more than one or two days wear!), but generally easily spotted as such, and therefore avoided by reputable dealers. But conversely a lot is VERY GOOD and equally on a par with the GP on say a Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shultzie Posted June 9, 2007 Report Share Posted June 9, 2007 I thought i would never buy a gold-plated rep - for fear of quality until... The gold plating on my RM never ceases to amaze me. I don't even keep it in my watch box for fear of scratching it. and my 231 ain't too shabby either Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
P4GTR Posted June 9, 2007 Report Share Posted June 9, 2007 I think if I had the money to blow on gold reps with a very small shelf-life, I'd rather "blow" the money on a gen. At least with stainless reps, if the quality is there, its there for good. Thankfully i'm not partial to gold. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
crystalcranium Posted June 9, 2007 Report Share Posted June 9, 2007 I think if I had the money to blow on gold reps with a very small shelf-life, I'd rather "blow" the money on a gen. At least with stainless reps, if the quality is there, its there for good. Thankfully i'm not partial to gold. Amen I know the rose gold plate on my hamilton jazzmaster is 10 microns. I was told that with daily moderately intense wearing, I could expect 15-20 years. I wear it twice a week so I'm sure it'll be good as gold for my lifetime. And just a BTW, Hamilton is the latest watchmaker to stop gold plate and use PVD Titaninum Nitride as "golding" on their watches. Tough as nails and looks just like actual gold. They join Tissot and Baume and Mercier as major manufactures using this process. The only problem is TiNi is yellow and with the popularity of coppered rose gold, it's not being used on a lot of watches. When the chinese start golding 18K Folexes with PVD, we'll see a revolution in "gold" replicas. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest TTK Posted June 9, 2007 Report Share Posted June 9, 2007 (edited) Most good reps are using PVD now also.....which contrary to popular opinion is available in almost any Pantone colour.....rose gold / yellow or pink also.....! Edited June 9, 2007 by TTK Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jumbie Posted June 9, 2007 Author Report Share Posted June 9, 2007 (edited) Thanks for all the feedback guys. It's been interesting and illuminating as well. Don't think I've much changed my mind in the end though. Which is good cause I'm not really into bling. Like some others I tend to prefer steel, and recently, the idea leather for my watches. I don't think I'd ever go with a gold watch for daily wear but I guess that I'd be okay with having perhaps one that I'd wear on occasion when I want to be a bit more dressed up. Still definitely interested in a Breitling Chrono Evolution TT (white with yellow gold dials and crown) on a brown croc strap though. Looks pretty hot IMO. Gonna have to try and find out some more info on this PVD coating. Not that I doubt you guys but I guess I find it hard to believe that it looks like real gold. Doesn't PVD get scratched off as well? Edited June 9, 2007 by Jumbie Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
crystalcranium Posted June 9, 2007 Report Share Posted June 9, 2007 Thanks for all the feedback guys. It's been interesting and illuminating as well. Don't think I've much changed my mind in the end though. Which is good cause I'm not really into bling. Like some others I tend to prefer steel, and recently, the idea leather for my watches. I don't think I'd ever go with a gold watch for daily wear but I guess that I'd be okay with having perhaps one that I'd wear on occasion when I want to be a bit more dressed up. Still definitely interested in a Breitling Chrono Evolution TT (white with yellow gold dials and crown) on a brown croc strap though. Looks pretty hot IMO. Gonna have to try and find out some more info on this PVD coating. Not that I doubt you guys but I guess I find it hard to believe that it looks like real gold. Doesn't PVD get scratched off as well? Physical Vapor Deposition of Titanium Nitride has been used as a wear extending coating on tooling like drill bits and router bits for years. It is extremely hard and durable. It has been used to gold plumbing fixtures for the not too rich but famous for many years as well. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jumbie Posted June 9, 2007 Author Report Share Posted June 9, 2007 Physical Vapor Deposition of Titanium Nitride has been used as a wear extending coating on tooling like drill bits and router bits for years. It is extremely hard and durable. It has been used to gold plumbing fixtures for the not too rich but famous for many years as well. Thanks for the info. It's just that I've read in some of the threads about PVD coating PAMs that it can be scratched off to reveal the base metal. In fact, I believe I even read on the Paneristi website about it happening to gens - something about how Panerai wouldn't recoat the watch but they offer a service to strip off all the rest of the PVD or something like that. Not sure how hard a knock that would take but figured that it might be risky. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
archibald Posted June 10, 2007 Report Share Posted June 10, 2007 Thanks for the info. It's just that I've read in some of the threads about PVD coating PAMs that it can be scratched off to reveal the base metal. In fact, I believe I even read on the Paneristi website about it happening to gens - something about how Panerai wouldn't recoat the watch but they offer a service to strip off all the rest of the PVD or something like that. Not sure how hard a knock that would take but figured that it might be risky. From a post @ finishing.com, w/ cuts and my italics: "The PVD treatments that are used in (good quality) watch casings are much more resistant to scratching than electoplating... An excellent reference is the Longines website.... ... What is actually on the top of a PVD watch is a sub-micron finishing layer of gold which highlights the gold colour of the PVD coating (usually titanium nitride).... As mentioned before, since the top layer on a PVD coating is so thin, if you manage to scratch a PVD coating you cant buff it back...." So it looks like PVD is much harder to scratch than electroplating, but if you scratch it, you're screwed. Also, it looks like Louis Erard offers a PVD Rose gold piece... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
crystalcranium Posted June 10, 2007 Report Share Posted June 10, 2007 Great news. The revolution is coming. Gold electroplating is going to the scrap heap. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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