Cats Posted October 19, 2007 Report Share Posted October 19, 2007 I have to remove the movement from my Fiddy. In this watch the movement has to come out via the front. A friend of mine is doing this but he doesn't have a big enough ring for the lunnete of the Fiddy. Does any one know what size i have to use and where i can buy them. regards, Cats. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sssurfer Posted October 21, 2007 Report Share Posted October 21, 2007 Maybe you are not getting replies as this post is a little confusing... or at least I got a little confused by it... If you need to remove the crystal before removing the movement, how can a press help? Do you mean some special ring, or just normal dice but of correct size? Sorry if I asked something stupid, never opened a fiddy so far. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
offshore Posted October 21, 2007 Report Share Posted October 21, 2007 @cats, I'm with sssurfer on this one. Maybe you could give us some more info? Are you saying you want to remove the crystal from the front? Not being a Pam person, I don't even know if the crystals have enough "shoulder" area to lift? If so you will need a crystal lift, not a press. I would need to research as to what lifts will operate on a crystal that size, What is the OD of the crystal? (At the "shoulders"... lifting point) as I think most lifts will open to accomodate these dimensions. Maybe post a couple of photos, of what you are attempting, then we will try to assist. Offshore Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cornerstone Posted October 21, 2007 Report Share Posted October 21, 2007 This is interesting. It rang a bell and I looked - and of course realized that it was you that had discussed this before Cats. So you have taken the crystal off with the bezel as Usil said and it can't go back on by hand, is that right? Out of interest - which Fiddy do you have, is it indeed a newer one? I thought it might be helpful to identify which ones need to come out the front and the back. Incidentally - you said you opened the back of yours, what did you use if you don't mind me asking. So far mine is resisting everything I throw at it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cats Posted October 21, 2007 Author Report Share Posted October 21, 2007 Thanks guy's i have to be more specific. What i'm looking for is the size of the ring to press the bezel of PAM127 Fiddy into place. The reason why i think i need this ring is. Navigater had this watch for a relume job of the hands and dail and a canion pin fix. He told me that he couldn't do the job because the movement had to be uncased via the front. After inspecting it with a loupe i didn't see anything unusual at the front but noticed that the movement is srwed directly into the groove of the case without any clambs. I don't know if i can get the crystal out without removing the bezel , and i want to press it in completaly , for that reason i need the size of the ring. Some pic's: Regards, Cats Some details of the case EO117/1950 BB1074729 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sssurfer Posted October 22, 2007 Report Share Posted October 22, 2007 Still unsure on what you need. Especially unsure that you have to remove the bezel in order to remove the crystal. A tool to remove and reinsert only the crystal might be the Bergeon 4266 Crystal Lift or the GS Crystal Inserter and Remover, in this page from ofrei: http://www.ofrei.com/page_208.html A large selection of presses and dies in this other ofrei's page: http://www.ofrei.com/page236.html You may also try and have a look at cousinsuk: http://www.cousinsuk.com/catalog/6/1290/1605.aspx Sorry, I don't know exactly which die size you need (I suppose that you just have to masure the diameter of your fiddy's bezel), but I also doubt that they sell single dies. I would also try a search on ebay. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
turboGUATE Posted October 22, 2007 Report Share Posted October 22, 2007 My guess of what he's asking is that he has the crystal removed and wants to locate in place again. So, once the crystal is removed, it has some kind of o-ring that makes it somewhat waterproof. From similar procedures I have made, this o-ring might get damaged. Therefore, I'm guessing hes' asking what size of o-ring is needed and where can it be purchased... Am I right? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cats Posted October 22, 2007 Author Report Share Posted October 22, 2007 Guys sorry, after reading my own reply i come to the conclusion that i have to take a break with the family. The Fiddy 1950 is still intact. I'm planning to uncase the movement, which has to be done via the front . What i needed to know who's selling rings that are big enough for the Fiddy. If i don't need to remove the bezel for taking of the crystal i still need the ring to press the bezel inplace. Thanks guys for help , problem is solved Regards, Cats Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bazz Posted October 22, 2007 Report Share Posted October 22, 2007 To replace the movement on these fiddys you have to take them out the front of the case. If you look around under the bezel you will see a slight grove under it which can be used to gently pry it up. These are a big pain in the bum to press back on! I went to a large hardware store and bought a piece of high density plastic pipe the same size as the bezel and used it with a press to push it back on. Im sure The Zigmeister has the correct size dies for it but my other problem is the height the crystal protrudes above the bezel and the pipe I used placed no pressure on it. There is already a gasket for the bezel and case so there is no reason not to use that one. I would not recommend doing this yourself if you don't have much experience, when you put the pressure on it really gets the heart rate going ... awaiting the dreaded sound of an exploding crystal! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
offshore Posted October 22, 2007 Report Share Posted October 22, 2007 Think we need to be clear if we are talking about pressing the bezel, or the crystal. If we are talking about the bezel, as long as the die to press it gives clearance on the crystal, most anything will do the job (as long as it is non-marking) If however we are talking about crystal remove and replace, it really depends on the crystal style and shape. It could be a lift, if there is no rear access, it could be as simple as popping it from the rear, either with fingers or a press. I beleive here we should look at the various types of presses available. From cheap hand models with nylon or brass dies, to screw type.. more pro models. The one thing all of these however have in common, is that they are using downward compression for the install, and don't really offer a practical method for removal, (as it is all based on force/compression) If we look at the method the G-S press works on, we see that the crystal is sitting face down in a die, and then a second die is applied in the centre of the crystal. (These dies all need to be sized to the specific job) This pressure in the centre, causes the crystal to decrease in diameter, allowing the case to slide over the crystal outside diameter. When the pressure is released, the crystal expands, and slots into the case groove, or the tension ring, dependent on the crystal style and type. Removal of an insitu crystal is achieved by reversing this procedure.... remove case back, movement, lay crystal face into die, apply pressure to crystal centre, slide case away, release pressure. However if access is from the front, then a lift is need, and there are a range of sizes, styles and types of these as well, although they all work in much the same fashion, albeit with better and worse results. Recently I discussed "The Watch Crystal Encyclopedia", available from Florida Watch (Helfands), If anyone is serious about learning the art of crystal fitting, I do recommend it, (and no, I am not on a backhander ) I do however now have a commercial interest in crystal supply, so am trying to get up to speed as quickly as possible. Beleive me, this seemingly simple task, is a real science in itself, and a most intriguing area of our craft. As an aside to all this, an accurate set of calipers are a must for crystal fitting.If you don't know the EXACT size of the case groove area you are attempting to fit a crystal to, you will never size a crystal correctly. Purchasing a crystal, that "should" fit is a long way from having measured the need, and purchased the correct size crystal to do the specific job. I well recognise that cases are CNC machined, and SHOULD all be the same size. My experience has been far different, and beleive me, I have smashed, crushed and exploded more than a few in my learning process. Thankfully far fewer now I am coming to grips with the science. Sermon ends.... Gee I get into this stuff!! Offshore Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bazz Posted October 22, 2007 Report Share Posted October 22, 2007 Think we need to be clear if we are talking about pressing the bezel, or the crystal. Im not sure either, if Cats wants to remove the movement etc. he will have to remove the bezel which in turn has the crystal in it. I can not see any reason to want to remove the crystal from the bezel and anyhow, there is no way to do it while both are still on the watch... and you cant get to from behind as the movement only comes out the front Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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