Beggining your Watch Repair Schooling

[RWG Technical]

I've probably done every possible mistake you can do in watchsmithing, but I try and avoid repeating the same errors.

Biggest lessons learnt.

1. THERE are NO SHORTCUTS in watchmaking. If you think you can cut a corner with a task, GUARANTEED that this will result in 10 times more labour and some sort of damage to the watch.

2. Quality Tools. Buy a good set of Screwdrivers, Rodico, Tweezers, hand removers (Presto #6) hand setting tool Bergeron Red/Grey tip does most everything, watch paper, loupe, dust blower, and caseback opener.

3. Study is necessairy but hands on practice is MANDATORY. Practice and more practice is the only way to learn.

4. If you have any slight interest in watch servicing, pay Offshore a few dollars and buy his CD set and take the TimeZone course, parts 1 and 2. Even if you don't do your own servicing, the lessons learned will be invaluable for even simple repairs and upgrades. Working under a loupe takes a long time to master and until you can do it with both eyes open, you haven't mastered it.

Biggest mistakes I have seen:

1. Not knowing when your in over your head.

2. Not learning the basics of watchsmithing, how to work under a loupe, handling parts, what to touch and not touch, cleanliness needed, how to uncase a movement, and remove a stem etc.

3. Expecting to be able to be talked through a complex job, and expecting that with no understanding or slight knowledge of even the names of the parts on a movement, that someone can walk you through a task. Take the time to learn at least the basic movement parts and their names so you are speaking the same language.

4. Trying to do watch work with a Swiss Army knife and a $5 set of jewellers screwdrivers from Wall Mart, and then getting upset when it all goes down the toilet.

5. Offering to work on other members watches without doing the required study and practice to ensure you actually know what your doing, and can send a watch back in the same or better condition than when received.

RG

[hiker01]

I truly thank you for this thread... and think that we need more people that are willing to detail there failures! I have made MANY a bone head move and screwed up no less than 5 2836-2's. My one great succes (we should discuss this also) was getting my DOA GMT IIc and replacing the entire main spring barrel. The fact that the watch is within 3 seconds after nearly 2 weeks blows my mind!!! And I thank the members here for the information necessary to make that swap. I had 4 different threads open at the same time looking at pictures and reading about how the movement fit together.

PS: I have a couple Asian 21 jewel movements in running condition that people can practice on if they want!

@CBR.....would that A21J of yours fit a Noob Sub case? I have a Noob Sub that I killed the engine by doing the unthinkable faux pas......"pushing the stem back and when I encountered resistance, instead of pulling it back out and starting over again, I pushed harder!" There goes the keyless works! Now I have a case and a dead engine! I tried to reset the keyless after reading some post here and ended up with a halfway dismantled movement and trying to find the patience and time to put it together......I need more practice.....LOL!

So, if thta spare 21J you have is good for a Nob Sub case, I'll take it!

Thanks, Hike!

[ubiquitous]

Ahhhh... Dust under the crystal/on the dial... That is my biggest pet peeve! I've taken watches apart 10 - 20 times just to get it completely dust free!

All great points by ziggy BTW! Especially the point of no shortcuts. In my opinion, the best way to fast track a job is to simply take your time and do it right the first go around. The time saved will be greater than trying to cut some corners...

[Sir-Lancelot]

Keyless works fug up's, lume attempts gone terribly and horribly wrong, many, many lost parts = carpet patrol with the wife laughing at how stupid I am, bent hands, bent bezels, scratching the hell out of a case trying to screw/unscrew or pry, broken teeth on gears when a screwdriver slipped.................etc etc etc

I have [censored] up most everything at one time or another !!!!!!!!!!!!!

Many times I have said screw it and wanted to throw all my stuff up for sale or in the trash, but never did.

I just take a deep breath, drink a scotch or two, and try again. Me doing stupid [censored] does not mean the world is coming to an end. It just means I need more practice.

There is no substitution for hands on practice and having the correct tools.

[scoobs1971]

Top 3 problems in watch repair:

1. messing up the keyless works

2. on your knees searching for that missing part in the carpet

3. having to reopen the case to remove dust under the crystal - again

So what about having to open the case again and reinstall the hands of your beloved chrono, because you've noticed too late that the date changes at 4am ?

[lanikai]

I've probably done every possible mistake you can do in watchsmithing, but I try and avoid repeating the same errors.

Biggest lessons learnt.

1. THERE are NO SHORTCUTS in watchmaking. If you think you can cut a corner with a task, GUARANTEED that this will result in 10 times more labour and some sort of damage to the watch.

2. Quality Tools. Buy a good set of Screwdrivers, Rodico, Tweezers, hand removers (Presto #6) hand setting tool Bergeron Red/Grey tip does most everything, watch paper, loupe, dust blower, and caseback opener.

3. Study is necessairy but hands on practice is MANDATORY. Practice and more practice is the only way to learn.

4. If you have any slight interest in watch servicing, pay Offshore a few dollars and buy his CD set and take the TimeZone course, parts 1 and 2. Even if you don't do your own servicing, the lessons learned will be invaluable for even simple repairs and upgrades. Working under a loupe takes a long time to master and until you can do it with both eyes open, you haven't mastered it.

Biggest mistakes I have seen:

1. Not knowing when your in over your head.

2. Not learning the basics of watchsmithing, how to work under a loupe, handling parts, what to touch and not touch, cleanliness needed, how to uncase a movement, and remove a stem etc.

3. Expecting to be able to be talked through a complex job, and expecting that with no understanding or slight knowledge of even the names of the parts on a movement, that someone can walk you through a task. Take the time to learn at least the basic movement parts and their names so you are speaking the same language.

4. Trying to do watch work with a Swiss Army knife and a $5 set of jewellers screwdrivers from Wall Mart, and then getting upset when it all goes down the toilet.

5. Offering to work on other members watches without doing the required study and practice to ensure you actually know what your doing, and can send a watch back in the same or better condition than when received.

RG

Thank you All.. for the "real" input !!!!

And to our Coach .... I definately know my "limits" as I am not going to attempt a DW swap until I feel I can do it without 20 PM's

So what I'm "hearing" (reading) like any learning or training is,.... not to get into "bad habits" .. and practice .. like muscle memory in Sports comes from repititions ..

Looking through the loupe is like looking throgh a microscope .. I need to "learn" to relax that one eye .. again muscle memory and training the eye muscles..

As I was one that experienced a rep that was "short cutted" I can relate to what the end product is.... it's sort of swaping the jets in a carburetor before you decide on what kind of performance you want and what type of Cam to install...... kinda like wiping your a$$ before you sh!t !!!

and I will make my final "basic tool" order today.. the most basic and necessary one.... Rodico and I don't know what to do with watch paper.. but I'll order some so I will have it when I find out what it's for

A nice soft florecent lamp wouldn't hurt either... .. so I can actually see what I'm doing

@Ubi.... even if it's one micron in size the DUST ... when I finally learned how to take out the movement and get out that one long thin strand of lint.. it was like letting out a breath that I was holding for a year !!.. sheesh...

Guy's you will be hearing from me more now... i got all the tools .. now maybe some study on the movements may be a good thing and break the habit of making toy models without using the instructions.. ( as I did when I was a kid)

[sssurfer]

Great idea this thread, lani!

I never dared to work on a movement, but I tried almost everything else, and what I can add is:

1. DON'T TRY to work close to the border of your table. Work at least 30 cm to the center. Exactly near the border of any watchworker there is access to a black hole and/or 4th dimension. All your small bits are guaranteed to get swallowed there to never appear again. Carpet crawlers are hopeful persons, and a nice song by Genesis, nothing more unfortunately.

2. Use extreme caution when screwing a stem in a crown. A bit too strong, and the stem will not be the only one to get screwed there. It's unbelievable how a 1-2mm long, 0.90mm diameter, small piece of metal can make you throw away a whole crown, and possibly turn a whole watch in a source for parts.

3. On removing a crystal, always use the largest dye that fits the crystal.

4. If you are going to use a smaller dye, then after it use pliers, not your fingers, to remove the crystal splinters from the watch.

5. Close the cat(s) out of the door. They love watchmaking, but they hate to hear you yelling at the watch / tools / black hole / etc.

6. Always pretend you didn't hear your wife calling for dinner.

7. Check thoroughly for dust and fingerprints before putting the movement in and closing the watch.

8. Don't mistake the blower for the sticky ball.

9. Don't look at the UV lamp while curing a cyclops glue. And especially don't hope it will make you tanned.

10. Try to put attention on where you lay your tools down. Spending 10 mins on finding back every single screwdriver, or pliers, or whatever you used, is time consuming and frustrating.

[Toadtorrent]

Biggest mistakes I have seen:

1. Not knowing when your in over your head.

RG

Yup...oh yeah. How do you know when you are in over your head? When you open the caseback...see an antimag cover on the movement...and spend the better part of Ishtar looking for the screws or clips to release it...not that I would know about that...more than once that is.

As to biggest mistakes? Let me get back to you on that when AJS sends me a replacement stem for one of his movements and I get back to assembling my stripped Noob movement. Practical? No...but a fun learning experience.

[lanikai]

Great idea this thread, Lani!

I never dared to work on a movement, but I tried almost everything else, and what I can add is:

1. DON'T TRY to work close to the border of your table. Work at least 30 cm to the center. Exactly near the border of any watchworks there is access to a black hole and/or 4th dimension. All your small bits are guaranteed to get swallowed there to never appear again. Carpet crawlers are hopeful persons, and a nice song by Genesis, nothing more unfortunately.

2. Use extreme caution when screwing a stem in a crown. A bit too strong, and the stem will not be the only one to get screwed there. It's unbelievable how a 1-2mm long, 0.90mm diameter, small piece of metal can make you throw away a whole crown, and possibly turn a whole watch in a source for parts.

9. Don't look at the UV lamp while curing a cyclops glue. And especially don't hope it will make you tanned.

10. Try to put attention on where you lay your tools down. Spending 10 mins on finding back every single screwdriver, or pliers, or whatever you used, is time consuming and frustrating.

Thank you M ...these are my fav excerpts from your post....

Yes ,.. it's amazing how gravity is amplified when a part falls off the top of even the lowest table.. I've learn to "think" like a springbar or screw...it is actually an "art form" to role play, a screw .. ..... i hear myself trying to track the part and mouthing... bounce... bounce ...... b o u n c e ...

the UV lamp... nah .. I learned in College in Oregon.... used a friends UV lamp during the winter ... I wasn't used to being so pale .. I figured it was like the Sun.. so I positioned it in front of the Television and thought I would get some "rays" whilst watching the tube ..... .. you kinda guessed what happened to my eyeballs the next day.. in the infirmary ...

And finally when I had my auto shop every tool that I owned was in the "same spot" before and after it was used .. so it was second nature and "muscle memory" to pick it up when needed.;....

I went ballistic if my worker would used it and put it down where ever was convenient for him... it would totally throw off my rhythm

And lastly I have learned not to ever.... never.. attempt even the simplist of tasks when I am dead tired .... there is no way around errors .. absolutely no focus on the task at hand.. which makes me rush .. which creates more work .... and on.. and on..

[Guest carlsbadrolex]

@CBR.....would that A21J of yours fit a Noob Sub case? I have a Noob Sub that I killed the engine by doing the unthinkable faux pas......"pushing the stem back and when I encountered resistance, instead of pulling it back out and starting over again, I pushed harder!" There goes the keyless works! Now I have a case and a dead engine! I tried to reset the keyless after reading some post here and ended up with a halfway dismantled movement and trying to find the patience and time to put it together......I need more practice.....LOL!

So, if thta spare 21J you have is good for a Nob Sub case, I'll take it!

Thanks, Hike!

That is exactly what it came out of... It even still has the crown on the stem. I dont have the date wheel any longer...

Send me a PM and its yours.

T

[dvn]

Just curious, is there a place that you can get all tools in one stop shopping?

[lanikai]

Just curious, is there a place that you can get all tools in one stop shopping?

Google Ofrei... they have the best prices I see.. I got everything except my crystal press from them.. everything Rob mentions above.. the bergeon screw drivers are a "MUST".. try the hardware type and you will realize in a NY minute why....

Movement removal and crystal removal and install is the basic .. only seems scary .. If I can do it.. yada.. yada..check out scoobs post on this thread.. you really only need 2 or 3 .. you can buy that ala carte..

good luck !!

Ofrei btw.. is where we get the genuine dials and crowns and tubes for the UPO and other Omegas.. crystal .. better to get the rep crystal done by chief.. better quality than the genuine.. fo real !!!

[lanikai]

Ofrei's link ..... http://www.ofrei.com/ .... all you need to do is set up an account.. call them.... the Omega PO genuine dial .. a must have for the UPO.. and the crowns (rep) need to be replaced for practical reasons.. the rep ones give out in time..

Located in Cali..

if in EU order from Cousins UK

[MADRED7]

OK...this is a very good topic and I am so with you all....."carpet patrol" will be in my word-pool for now....just beside "desk-diving"

Well...as some of our members said before....I don