Bork99 Posted January 24, 2009 Report Share Posted January 24, 2009 Looking to buy my first Pam and I'm drawn to the Ti models which I plan to wear on a chunky brown strap. In particular, I really like the tobacco colour of the dial on the 036, but I've read mixed reviews of reps of this model. Josh seems to have a new one, though, which may or may not be any good? On the other hand, I like the 177h's sandwich dial, which of course the 036 is not. I've seen opinions that the deal Josh has on the 177 H with free shipping is great value for money, and it would leave some cash for a nice strap... I know that in terms of accuracy neither one will fool too many experts, but I'm looking for some input from the Panerisiti on the forum - What should a noob like me consider when choosing between these two models? I'm not planning to do any mods, at least initially, at least in part because I don't know of anyone in South Africa that could assist me and shipping the watch around the world would get expensive real fast! These are the two I'm looking at: 036 - http://www.jpc8118.com/pn03602-titanium-to...497-p-5503.html 177 H - http://www.jpc8118.com/pn17705-series-tita...497-p-4580.html Thanks in advance... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
adrenalin Posted January 24, 2009 Report Share Posted January 24, 2009 Well, First off, welcome to the forum! As I am sure that you will find out, this place is a real time sink.... Be prepaired to spend many, many hours surfing, asking, reading and learning Oh, yeah... hide your wallet! As for your question, both are excellent choices. Both are pretty accurate- enough that the casual observer wont notice the major flaws. Most people are not real watch savy and wouldnt know a cannon pin from a crown guard..... Having said that, choose which ever one you like and the one that you will wear the most! I am partial to the 177, as that was my first rep. The only way to be sure you got the right one is to buy both! Welcome and have fun! -K Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hooky Posted January 24, 2009 Report Share Posted January 24, 2009 If you would consider doing mods in the future, you might want to consider the version either 036 or 177 with swan neck movement, like the genuine. mods on these models could be: cannon pin fix, Ti crown, flattening the pin of the crown guard, relume. (cannon pin, ti crown, relume, good movement i have done by vaclume aka vaccum for my 177H) By the way the blue-ish tint of the AR on the mineral version was way too blue when i got mine from Andrew/Trusty. I bought a single sapphire from him and when i got the chance I had it AR coated by Jakub. IMO the plain sapphire looks better than the blueish mineral. this blue stuff made the dial a lot less visible. only after i got the sapphire installed i started to notice details which i hadn't seen before... But a first good start will be a good leather strap. the rep strap screams 'fake'. according to the specs on Josh' site, for the price I would choose 036. Why? No recessed cannon pin problem & sapphire & AR coat & swan neck. And you'd better verify if you really will be getting the Ti buckle. Cuz last time I checked it wasn't supply able by my dealer... good luck! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mickey Padge Posted January 24, 2009 Report Share Posted January 24, 2009 The 036 rep has completely the wrong style of movement when compared to the gen, and what the hell is that "cap" over the canon pinion? Urgh! The 177 wins hands down out of the two links you provided, although it has issues too..... Still I would suggest you contact Davidsenjpn here: http://www.rwg.cc/members/Davidsenjpn-f72.html He has always delivered great watches whenever I have ordered, even custom stuff and "sterile" (no branding) watches Do a search for PAM036 or 177, there is lots of info here to steer you in the right direction Cheers! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hooky Posted January 24, 2009 Report Share Posted January 24, 2009 True, at first did not see it, but the cannon pinion on the 036 at Josh' is way off...! You could also ask Josh/other dealer what the price will be with (asian or swiss, but asian is also good) swan neck and sapphire. Warning, whenever you go modding, watch your wallet: My 177H is now near perfect. But the total cost -also including a strap from Greg Stevens (google)- has just exceeded the 1000usd. Cheers! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
klocklind1 Posted January 25, 2009 Report Share Posted January 25, 2009 I thought that the Pam 036 was stopped beeing produced long time ago !? It can be VERY difficult to get a good dial on the 036 as the color on the dial or lume is way off ! Be careful with ALL titanium pams as they are not made the same way as the earlier titananium pams! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bork99 Posted January 25, 2009 Author Report Share Posted January 25, 2009 Thanks for the feedback gentlemen. @Adrenalin - Yes, I know, already spent way too many hours lurking, reading and learning. @Mickey - I'd come across Davidsen, and I gather his watches typically cost a little more (well, double...) than the two I was looking at, but if they have the major problems fixed it might be worthwhile longer term rather than trying to sort out the issues afterwards. I dropped Davidsen a note to see if he can get me a 036... On the other hand, trying to fix the problems myself could be fun! Maybe starting with the "cheap" 177H is the way to go. @Hookey - $1000 is toch wel veel, ik zou het liever wat goedkoper gedaan krijgen! But I checked out Greg Stevens - some nice straps there. Bookmarked! I'll wait and see what Davidsen says and figure it out from there! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LoganX3 Posted January 26, 2009 Report Share Posted January 26, 2009 for the price and overall quality, I'd probably go with the 177, very nice versatile watch. BOL with your purchase! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bork99 Posted January 28, 2009 Author Report Share Posted January 28, 2009 Davidsen came back with a price of $430 for a "swiss" movement 036 with sapphire crystal, cannon pin fixed, and relumed dial and hands, shipped. Looking at the pics, and comparing with photos of the gen, this certainly looks like it's more accurate than Josh's version in a lot of small ways. I guess it's probably the way to go but it is quite a bit more than the watch on Josh's site. Any indications of what one would pay to have the cannon pin fixed and the dial and hands relumed otherwise? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fat.tail.event Posted January 31, 2009 Report Share Posted January 31, 2009 For your first PAM, I would do a nicely modded 177 and call it a day. From payment to truly enjoyable wrist time, its the shorter road. The 36 project is time consuming and eventually there will always be something nagging to make it better. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Genebe Posted February 3, 2009 Report Share Posted February 3, 2009 (edited) Davidsen came back with a price of $430 for a "swiss" movement 036 with sapphire crystal, cannon pin fixed, and relumed dial and hands, shipped. Looking at the pics, and comparing with photos of the gen, this certainly looks like it's more accurate than Josh's version in a lot of small ways. I guess it's probably the way to go but it is quite a bit more than the watch on Josh's site. Any indications of what one would pay to have the cannon pin fixed and the dial and hands relumed otherwise? I'm looking for a nice 177H also, and just contacted Davidsen. Price was $460, with swiss swan neck mvmt, superlume upgrade, 44mm ti case, sapphire crystal... but he didn't mention the cannon pin fix. (I'm assuming that's included.) If I remember correctly, other sites I've visited seem to have the cannon pin upgrade for $80 or so. Not sure how much the re-lume is... I think a really nice rep watch, with a quality aftermarket strap, is going to be somewhere around $700-$800. Anyone else? Edited February 3, 2009 by Genebe Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fat.tail.event Posted February 3, 2009 Report Share Posted February 3, 2009 Depends on your personal definition of REALLY nice. REALLY nice can range from $650 to $1300 depending on a lot of factors. LH parts could push it higher...can always take things further until you're content. Enjoy the 177H Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fat.tail.event Posted February 3, 2009 Report Share Posted February 3, 2009 Davidsen came back with a price of $430 for a "swiss" movement 036 with sapphire crystal, cannon pin fixed, and relumed dial and hands, shipped. Looking at the pics, and comparing with photos of the gen, this certainly looks like it's more accurate than Josh's version in a lot of small ways. I guess it's probably the way to go but it is quite a bit more than the watch on Josh's site. Any indications of what one would pay to have the cannon pin fixed and the dial and hands relumed otherwise? Bork, I own the DSN 36 (not the latest dial however). You dont need to worry about a CP fix, its done. However, the one thing I would recommend is doing research on DSNs dial coloring vs. gen. It is too purple for my taste and I think his latest dial suffers from the same issue. On the other hand, I am really happy with his case. Do some searches on the board about the lengths other members have gone to for accurate 36s. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hooky Posted February 3, 2009 Report Share Posted February 3, 2009 Depends on your personal definition of REALLY nice. REALLY nice can range from $650 to $1300 depending on a lot of factors. LH parts could push it higher...can always take things further until you're content. Enjoy the 177H What are LH parts? haha, 650usd - 1300usd My PAM177H 160usd for the watch 40usd for sapphire 80usd for AR coating by Jakub plus shipping 125usd good Titanium crown + install 140usd relume dial & hands 75usd cannon pin fix 95usd better movement with swan neck and better inscriptions 65usd complete service of movement 45usd crownguard fix to make it more tight to the case and fix the pin 175usd greg stevens strap total: 1000usd. Cheers! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fat.tail.event Posted February 4, 2009 Report Share Posted February 4, 2009 What are LH parts? I may have spoke about a half a day too soon...Little Hero is (was?) a dealer on RG who offered modded H movements and very near to gen dials for the 111H. I suppose you could pop one into your 177H? Anyhow...the dial runs $200, the H movement all reworked, white gold plated brideges etc, about $500. But it sounds like he is pulling down all of his threads on the boards as we speak. It is also possible that he is just editing...no one seems to be certain at this point. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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