subbiesrock

Keep pushing where you are but Pinch and pull it really hard and then wiggle it until you get it to the right hole. I even used pliers once to pull it

Its painful especially with a rep strap OEM are thinner and easier

This is great if you want to f$&k your brand new strap up. pliers and hard tugging on a brand new strap? Nuh uh...

Instead, find the spring bar on the top of the clasp (with the PANERAI engraving) and pop it out, this separates that section from the deployant. Fit this onto your strap in the hole you want to use and reattach the spring bar, it works perfectly and acompletely voids damage to the strap.

Pulling on a strap with pliers will totally destroy it, a little sense fellas! The above method is totally painless and much much quicker!

Hahaha nicely played )

How cool is that!

The First Air was ridiculously overpriced, but this thing is in that 'sweet spot' price point, I think they hit an absolute winner by reducing the price and adding SSD. I'll take the 13.3 inch in 256 Gb )

People who say "Rolex is a nice $500 watch" forget that they're actually very high quality watches, and they have inhouse movements. Rolex is a dirt cheap poor man's watch compared to Breguet, Zenith, Patek and JLC. How many other brands offer 100% inhouse movements for the same price? (Seiko doesn't count as it's competing in totally different league.)

You forgot Vacheron, probably the second of the big two premier Swiss watchmaking firms, but I digress

I was watching an interview with Patek's Chief of Marketing and he mentioned they move about 40,000 units/year. The cheapest PP watch is a Quartz and values at US15K. So if all they sold was 15K quartz models (which of course they don't), the annual PP turnover is US600M... Over half a billion smackers for a tiny little watch company in a nondescript valley in Switzerland. If an average Rolex is say 5K (again they sell everything from steel Subs to full gold diamond encrusted Presidentials) they would have to move at the very least 10 times what PP does. So you're looking at a cool 1 Billion turnover. I would say there's a nice profit margin at Rolex )

I know it's a little off-topic, but it really puts economies of scale into perspective, I never knew what the approximate numbers were before...

In terms of reps and gens, the quality comparison is up to the individual. Concepta's IWCs, BK Subs and the myriad modders here and on other forums do what they do to bring the reps towards the gens they emulate, precisely because the small differences are what drives people to perfection.

The more important question is, what field are you positioning yourself for? Suits might look like the most important thing on a person working/wanting to work as a lawyer, investment banker or similar (to be honest, what else do they have to show lol). Would not look all that well on a more technical field tho, and might earn you very weird looks and even (bad) critique.

Clothing is just another accessoire in our constant struggle with society - you still have to know what you can "get away" with before everyone starts making the wrong assumptions about you.

Sounds weird coming for a 25year old student right? Curiously, I have already been told by a colleague at work that I look "too well situated for a student". Interpret this as you wish, ever since then Ive been more careful choosing clothes, especially shoes... Having a nice looking polished pair of shoes clacking at your every step seems to be over the top :S.

On a side notice, I realized how hard it is to find decent rubber-sole shoes tho.. Is it worth it to have a shoemaker glue some of those thin rubber soles?

I hear your pain, my stylish brother from a different mother and father there appears to be a severe disparity in my dress sense and that of the higher-ups at my institution... Being there to learn and rolling up in Italian-styled wooden soled shoes was a little too much to bear for some of the older folk, who funnily enough summoned the courage to remark on the 'sound my shoes made' in the hallway... Ridiculous. It showed me that I might well be in the wrong profession. I've since toned it down to hoodies and jeans, and those same people commented that I'm nowhere near as well dressed as I was before... You can't win.

Take-home point, while you need them, you have to pander to their ideologies, ad as soon as you don't you can dress however the f&@k you like

Teejay

Thanks for your reply! I wasn't plan on using the whole 8k. If I went brand new I wouldn't spend more than 5500-6000. But worse case scenario I could troll eBay for a good deal 3500-4k. I am going to push this weekend to make it happen. I use the reps to trial them to see if I want to invest in the gen. I have had too many pam's reps and know it's time to finally invest.

Luke

Yoou sound like a pretty cluey guy and sure you'll be fine, we're just giving you some tough love because we care Make sure to put up many, many pics of your new purchase and make us all very jealous!

Good luck buddy

Yes it is crazy.

Dude... It's a watch... A little fatherly advice from the fellow board members who are only looking out for your best interests, As much as I like PAMs, there is no luxury item on the planet that I would consider risking my financial security on. There are far more important things in life than blowing such a ridiculous amount of money on a watch. Especially (since you need to borrow the money) you don't have the spare coin sitting around to make this 'spare coin' purchase... Having said that, you're a big boy and you can do whatever you want, we only give you the $0.02 you asked for by posting this most banal of questions on the forum...

I was you a few months ago. You need a few more months at it'll sink in.

Think about the hand layouts and ignore the dials, when you see a seconds @ 9... 6497. However if you turn it upside down (destro) it becomes... Seconds @ 3. Seconds @ 6 is a 6498. The '-x' is a different beat rate, you need to research that. Wiki it, very helpful.

The 3,6,9 with date at 4.30 is the A7750 with modified gears to move the seconds hand, and is a completely different movt to the 6497. The 649x is handwound, the 775x are automatic.

The 24hr GMTs can be three things. Swiss (rare and really expensive), Asian clones of Swiss (best value and good) and then cheap Asian movts which aren't good. Aim for a clone movt when it cones to GMT movts.

Keep reading, download and study the excel spreadsheet with google on the other side and you'll have pictures to go with the tech and movt info.

Most important, have fun )

Were the stories involving BKK clubs? Link please!

I've been doing a lot of reading (including outside of this forum) because the subject matter of rep and gen watches and the inherent value of reps and gens fascinates mr from a philosophical perspective. The quality of a gen would undoubtedly be better overall, I don't think that issue is in dispute, but the question is 'how much better'... I would say it's mainly the movement that distinguishes the two (not including functionless 21j movements that don't correctly operate like the gen, but actual clone movements that replicate the operation an in most cases the functionality of yhe original, such as th A7750 and 28xx clones etc to name just the most obvious) With all the interesting posts on the level of finishing doe in china, with final assembly in Swiss to be able to stamp the movement, that is frankly the clincher. I would say that the products with slightly finished ETA movements (Breitling pre B01, Longines, Omega etc) are inherently worth less that the hand finished masterpieces from the hand-finished wonders from VC, Patek etc.

If we consider the case, I would say the level of machining sophistication that the Asian factories have is almost (but not quite) on par with the German CNC machines the Swiss use. I've gathered that tolerance issues when creating reps are not the fault of lack of tolerance in machining, but laziness from the factories. Though, to be fair, some pics of the latest super reps has shown that they are definitely pulling up their socks in this area.

A wise man once told me the 'Golden Rule' of product cost breakdowns. He said that, in most cases, for western-produced items the costs were almost always 33% labour, 33% production materials and 33% overheads. Incredibly, though you might think different industries skew this value, most industries creating a tangible product for sale need people to design it, male it and market it. This applies to Rolex, but not to Rolex clones. For Asian makers, they don't advertise, as Rolex does that for them (;o)) and labour costs are lower than in Western countries. So in a clone, you ate really only paying for tooling costs for the machines for the factory, the movements are sub US100 for the most expensive Chronos and a Swiss 6497 can be had for peanuts at Retail, so you know they're cheap to make at wholesale, there's a small wholesale profit to the dealers and then they put on their 20-30% which is fair enough.

Considering the fact the Asian movements are not as well finished, often not waterproofed to the same levels or in some cases not even functionally equivalent, it's ceasy to make the mistake than most people make and say they're not worth as much... But it's comparing apples to oranges. Speaking about the ETA-powered sector, they took about the same time to build (shorter with the asian cases and movts with less QC) and about the same amount of effort went into making each one. They both take a similar time and effort - the Swiss just did it properly the first time ;o)

I would say that Frankens represent (ironically enough) the MOST value for money. They are heavily QCed and remachined by their obsessive owners (the finger is squarely pointed at the Paneristi of the forum) who obsess and discuss the various thicknesses of CGs and the level of concavity of their crowns to within micron tolerances. Gen dials and hands (and in some cases, movements such as Concepta's wonderful Portos) are added and the end result is usually twice to three times the price of a rep factory item, but still only 10-20% of retail and at 98% accuracy. Cost/Benefit seems highest for frankens, which is why we see so many on the boards being made and traded. Plus it's fun )

It's been interesting to read the various perspectives on this issue, fascinating topic.

Very nice piece, wear it with good health

I wish it hits our parliament house when they're in the middle of a session.

Everyone wishes for this BT

oh man thats gorgeous

+100

Audermars Piquet you say? haven't ventured to the AP side yet but that combo looks sh*t hot!

I have my Wife with me... So there is no need to get som####

Why should that stop you getting a girl? You need a more open-minded wife buddy... ;op

Jk

PAMs wear really well on the wrist, I have to concur with Stormtrooper on this one, a 44mm would wear surprisingly small, I have a 45mm 292 (radiomir) and it wears absolutely tiny! Compared with Breitlings of a similar size, PAMs wear a lot smaller than they might look. Try a 44 and give it a week on the wrist with a really good quality leather (not a cheap and nasty rep) and you'll be 'converted'... You'll see...

I was a Breit man, but I'm a Born Again Paneristi... :op

Search '24mm panerai strap' in the searchbox... You'll be amazed what comes up

I don't think that DSN lume is that crappy.

This is his latest 111E dial on my 01b

To play Diablo Advocatus on this one, most of the Lume shots vary from 1 to 2 seconds, from the small seconds this looks like a 10 second exposure.

Interesting thread ;o)

The (indestructible) Expendables? Deep plot warning!

Hey! Don't be knocking Sly's latest... That's the deepest plotline we've seen since Rocky V... ;op

$30,000?!

The comments left on his post are classics...

'you've just lost all future business, I hope the $23,000 profit is worth it'

Gold! What a tool...

It seems he's working through a backlog currently, I've got my first piece on order at the moment and went for it after reading about his stellar service across various sources.

Be careful to understand the difference between 'Genuine Leather Croc/Gator grain' and 'Genuine Gator'. The former is calf veneer stamped with a pattern (spottable from a mile away) and the latter is genuine gator/croc.

Absolutely no rep dealer will offer you a genuine Croc/Gator strap. They are not upwards of US100-300 for nothing...

From rough estimates, gator is roughly twice the price of crocodile, FYI.

EDIT: The link is to a nice strap, nice find

Mafia II Soundtrack - very nice

That bloke with the tribal tattoos down his arm has some awesome taste in watches...

Yes it is. Basically just an A6498 with a transfer gear to move the hour hand to the 12 o'clock position. As for the machining, I'm not to concerned about that as much as I am about the possibility of having to re-engrave the bridges after they are machined down to remove the current decoration. It looks as the the engraving is deeper, so I may be able to mill the bridges down just enough without losing the current engravings. Hard to say at the moment. I will probably pick up an F.A. Jones just for the movement.

The bridges aren't particularly thick to begin with, and the guilloche pattern seems to be milled in rather deeply... hmm... then the original has Cotes de Geneve engraving on top, you have your work cut out for you, but what a great project!