panerai153

Sort of stuck with not much to do since I'm on call today, so thought I would post a few photos of my Rolex "Family" It runs from old to new and genuine as well as rep.

Now that all of them are home, I can get a family photo.

Here is the lot of them:

4 Subs - 1680 Red (Puretime), 1680 White (Old skool MBW), Tudor 9411/0 (Gen),16610 (WM9/BK v3)

2 GMT's - 16750 (gen), 11670 Ceramic (King)

2 SD's - 16600 (Trusty), Deep Sea 116660 (ETZ)

Only others on my wish list are a Pan Am GMT, either Tudor 7924 or Rolex 6538 and last the WM9 SD 16660 that i've had ordered for over a year.

Here they are

The Subs:

The SD's:

The GMT's:

Thanks a lot for all the compliments. i've been wearing this one for a couple of days and it's really comfortable.Maybe i'll try to find someone who can give it a "Shave".

Thanks very much for the heads up. most folks have no idea as to the real cost of genuine parts. Unfortunately, some take advantage of the ignorance of others to mark up the prices to insane levels.

One of the real problems is the absolute control that Rolex is exercising over it's parts supply. It is getting next to impossible to source new Rolex parts. I had a watchmaker acquaintence who has a parts account with Rolex. He tried to source a genuine crystal for my GMT IIC. Rolex NA told him that he would have to send the watch to a Rolex Service Center for the crystal exchange. He called several other Rolex watchmakers and they all got the same story, either the part was "backordered" or they needed to send the watch to a RSC.Looks like genuine parts are going to become impossible to obtain unless you have a genuine watch that needs work.It's too bad, because as the parts become more unobtainable, the hoarding will drive the prices higher.

A few weeks ago, I posted photos of this Red Sub that i got in trade for another watch from a guy in Mexico who unfortunately screwed over a few folks here before he disappeared, me included. The watch was supposed to have a genuine Rolex crown included as the package deal. Alas, when the package arrived, the genuine crown was no where to be found.

This is the newer version (Puretime) of the 1680 with a slow beat 2846 movement. Supposedly the seller had reworked the CG's and done a few other things, which may or may not have been done. Aside from the too fat CG's, the worst fault is the huge crown. Well, I found a genuine crown and Clarks tube from one of our great members and sent it up to The Zigmeister for a swap. Actually, i had no intention of keeping this one, figuring to move it along as soon as it was brought up to snuff. Well, as in a lot of cases, I got it back, and I am now torn between sellnig or keeping, with the bias toward keeping it for a while.

When I got it back, I put it on the bracelet I got from JoJo35 with the "Fantasy" clasp. Makes a pretty nice combination. Here are some before and after photos of the 1680.

First the "before" with the original crown/tube which were awful!!

Now here it is after the genuine crown and tube were installed.

Personally, I am a bracelet person, simply because down here in the "tropical South" straps get pretty nasty,really fast.Even my NATO straps need washing almost every day. In the case of your T-graph, I believe the strap is better. although it's a sport watch, it is certainly dressier than a sub or SD. I would bet that this one is not one that you would be out in the hot summer mowing the lawn or splitting firewood! So in the case of a dressier watch, a strap.

Well said Pete!!

thanks very much for all the input and ideas. This isn't a problem that i can't live with for a while. i will probably do as The Zigmeister said, try to find a CG lever that has a little longer "foot" and see if it can be trimmed down to make a tighter fit. now the question is, where Can I find one?

Thanks again

Need some help from the PAM experts. I just got my DSN 24A back from The Zigmeister. He serviced the A7750 movement and changed the stock crown for a one of T's T-48 SL models. Also changed the tube and gasket. The problem is: the crown lever doesn't exert any pressure on the crown. It doesn't flop around, but when you close the lever you don't get that feedback that it's tight and has moved over center. When I put the watch in my pressure tester, it failed, bubbles coming from around the crown. My thoughts are that the crown lever if properly sized in relation to the crown, should push the crown in and put some pressure against the gasket is this correct? Now the question is where can I find a lever that is a little thicker at the bottom that will contact and press against the crown and hold it closed.Probably not using the correct terminology here, but I'm more used to Rolex crowns that screw down to help seal the watch.I would think that someone out there is producing aftermarket levers that are deeper, even if they had to be fitted by filing down a tiny bit at a time.

Any help appreciated.

What are those Mongolian Yak Nut sack straps going for these days?

First you gota shoot a Yak!!

Ther date window is too far into the dial as well. On the genuine,if you draw and extend a line through the triangle of the 4, it will exactly cover the bottom edge of the date window. The rep window is maybe a couple of mm off. This is probably one of those "tells" that only a Panerai WIS could detect, and only if he had the watch in his hand.

I can't take credit for this find, I saw this in another post on the forum.

What this boils down to is a war between the "haves" and the "Have Nots". The "have Nots" have their gigantic egoes bruised because they were left out. It's sort of like some guy trying to impress his hot date by bragging that he could get into Club X, only to be impolitely shoved aside ansd sent to the back of the line when he cruises up to the club door.

I used to frequent the Paneristi forum on a pretty regular basis, however it's literally been years since I visited. I was very put off by the elitist attitudes of some of the members (the "Haves"). I got the distinct feeling that new members were tolerated at best, but certainly not welcomed.I also found that there was very, very little useful content, mostly fluff posts, gooing and gaahing over someones watch and or band combo. What that was all about, I could never fathom. A new 063, 111, 196,etc looked just exactly like every other one produced and shipped out by Panerai. The ONLY way you could change anything was to put some weird Mongolian Yak Nut sack, or New Guinea Man eating chicken, straps on your cookie cutter watch!

Vintage Rolex parts and accessories defy reason! What drives the prices are folks with plenty of disposable income who will pay just about any price for something they need to complete a watch project. I suppose to put it in perspective, If you are sitting on a 25K watch and all you need is a correct bracelet to make it a 30K watch, spending 3K+ makes pretty good sense.

I would bet if you post a WTB on the vintage Rolex forum, you will get a response. My 9411/0 had the snowflake hands replaced at RSC San Francisco with Mercedes hands. i posted on VRF and got several offers to sell hand sets. None of them were even close to the 600 USD on Ebay. That's and insane price. I've had more problems trying to locate a tritium pearl, as the RSC changed the insert as well, but it has a Lumi pearl.

Thanks Pete,

Lots of posts on the internet about removing, but this one with photos is the best so far. Lot easier to see what he's talking about rather than trying to visualize in your mind from written instructions.

WM9/BK v3

He is definitely back fromm vacation. However as someone said, he is really busy. Remember he has a full time job as well as the watch repair business, so he has a lot on his plate. Keep trying, I'm sure he will respond in due time.

Every country in the world has a dark past. Read history, atrocities were committed by every country at some point in time,some more heinous than others. however, I don't believe that the child should suffer from the sins of the father. It's a pretty big stretch to say that the folks of this era should be atoning for events that were committed decades or centuries ago. So when one says that the present day citizens of a county should compensate the victims of events that played out over a hundred and fifty years ago, well to me that is unfathomable.

The events that took place in WWII were terrible beyond imagination. Atrocities were committed by all sides, but as someone said, "War is Hell". I would suspect that the Italian Special Forces troops were doing the same thing that US Special forces, Navy Seals, etc. do they are fighting for their country. I would suspect that the average guy on the ground is not interested in the ideology. His training is to accomplish a task assigned to him, be it peeling potato's for the mess hall, or riding a 2 man torpedo designed to take out an enemy warship. So IMHO, the young commandos were nothing more than brave young men who were fighting for their motherland. They were given a task to accomplish and they did the best that they could to carry out their orders. Another thing to remember, they were fighting in Italian waters, they didn't invade other countries, completely without provocation. and kill millions of civilians, under the guise of "Ethnic cleansing"

I agree with Watchmeister, I'm not a fan of those who aggrandize WWII memorabilia, however I wouldn't condemn a company like Panerai,for instance, because they were involved as part of their countries war machine. If I had that attitude, then practically every product made by companies in Germany and Italy as well as many here in the United States would be disqualified.

I believe that what this boils down to in the end is everyone has to make a personal decision about where they stand as regards to questions like "Should I display memorabilia (Frogmen statue in this case)from a very dark time in this planets history"? I would think that it would be like me having a model of the Enola Gay on my desk. IS it correct? In my eyes possibly I can justify it, to others, it's an abomination. So from my perspective, this is and unanswerable question. Sort of like arguing religion or politics.

You'r on the right track. i think all you need at this point is to replace the hands with a set of genuine Tritium hands. It will look great. At some point in time, you can pick up a genuine dial. they aren't prohibitively expensive especially for the black dials.

Here is my genuine 9411/0 Blue dial/bezel insert.

Or the springbars have flat ends instead of the correct rounded ends.

Might be a T-127 crystal instead of the proper T-125 for Tudor ETA.

A tritium acrylic pearl would help the bezel insert.

New hands and you would have a very nice watch.

Not that difficult to bring up to par!

Looks like a T-127, cyclops is too far over, but that's not hard to correct (for about 125-150 USD for a genuine replacement T-125. Those hands are definitely wrong, a set of genuine tritium "Snowflake" hands are going to be a bit expensive. I paid around 200.00 USD for a set about a year ago and that included credit for my genuine Mercedes hand set which was put on the watch at RSC San Francisco several years ago (I assume they didn' have the Snowflake hands available). Do that, and a tritium pearl, and you will have a pretty nice tudor. Nice thing about tudors, they aren't nearly as popular as Rolex, so you won't have to worry about "is that a fake Rolex" Questions.

While I understand the value of a post like this, is airing our secrets publicly really such a good idea? Perhaps I need to remove my tin-foil hat, but lets not give anyone (LEA/Customs) monitoring our forums things to look for...

Just a thought.

I agree compleely. There are lots of "lurkers" on this and every replica site. When folks post all this info, it just makes customs agents job easier.It would be very naive to think that our site is not being watched for information. While I don't think that Customs pays as much attention to single small package shipments, concentrating more on bulk shipments of watches, handbags, clothing,etc.I would bet that they are thrilled to intercept any package that contains "counterfeit" goods. As some of the older members can attest, once you have a package seized, your name and address are in the computer, at least with US customs. They may open every package addressed to you, or they may not, but why risk it. Much better to provide no information that can help your adversary, and try to fly way under the radar.

That is beautiful Tudor, and as ususal Ubi has done a beautiful job of putting together a real "keeper" wear it well

that's a real keeper. beautiful watch with lots of sentimental value just from the parts quest. Is the "George" who used to sell MBW years ago the same "George" of WM9 fame? Brings back old memories of dealing with him for an MBW 1680 years ago.

I paid 500.00 USD for my first Rolex Submariner I believe around 1968. It was brand new and came from Hausman's Jewelers in New Orleans. They were sticklers about list price, wouldn't come off list one cent, but if you had a trade, they would "work with you" on the trade in!I kept that sub for about 5-6 years and wore it every day. I traded it on a SeaDweller. I don't remember ever paying over 1000.00 USD for a Rolex, until I bought a 18k Day Date in 1981. It listed for 4000.00 andI got it, tax included, for around 3200.00.If hindsight were 20/20 I would have a pretty nice little bunch of genuine Rolexes from the late 1960's through the late 80's. Unfortunately, back then they were just nice tool watches (Subs and SD's) Quite a few guys I dove with back then had Subs and SD's. Suprisingly in this part of the world, you never saw a Doxa. I suppose they just weren't that popular here.In the late 80's pretty much everyone was using Seikos. they were cheap, bulletproof and looked pretty nice as well. We sold Chronosport s in our Dive shop, I used up a UDT, sent it back to the folks in Conneticut several times until finally they said "It's worn out"!! Of course by then the prices of Rolex had gotten up to the point the average guy couldn't afford one, and if he could he wouldn't take it diving as they were so expensive (relatively speaking)

That's my "blast from the past"

You're never done!! I've been "DONE" a hundred times, sometimes only for a few days. Nice thing about high quality Gens, if you keep them in nice condition and save every scrap of paper,boxes, etc. that come with them, they may not really appreciate that much, but you aren't going to lose your shirt should you decide to sell or trade one occasionally.

I have to agree with Ubi. If you are looking for a platform to build a super franken, the WM9/BK is the way to go. unfortunately, I don't think building a franken or super franken of a contemporary watch like the 16610 is practical from a financial standpoint. As Ubi said, buying a sack full of genuine parts and the cost of getting everything assembled will get you in the range of a genuine if not over the cost. This is a poor decision for two reasons, one it will not be a genuine, and thus your resale avenues are very limited, the second and probably the most important, you will NEVER get your money back!! Try posting a franken 16610 on the rep forums for a price of 3000.00 USD and see how many responses you get, no matter how many genuine parts it has.

If however you are looking for a really nice rep that you can wear right out the box, either of these are pretty nice. Irecently bought a BK noobmariner for my son. It's only mods are a Clark's crystal. I think i paid around 175.00 USD for it. It passed a 4 bar pressure test and is a real bargain for the money. I was also fortunate enough to get a WM9/BK 16610 Sub for myself a few weeks ago.The only mods are a Clarks Crystal and a genuine insert. honestly, unless you are a Rolex purist and are very knowledgable about Submariners, you can't tell this watch from a genuine. Iknow that there are quite a few folks here on the forum that can pick any rep apart with little details, but 99.99999% of the public couldn't tell this one from a genuine. So my feelings are if you are looking for a really ,really nice sub, to wear and niot spend a fortune modding, get a WM9/BK. If you want one almost as nice but much cheaper, go for the BK modified noobmariner