tode1640

I have recently invested in an A21j PAM090 - one of the ones with a functional power reserve dial that goes to 40 hours. The person I bought it from (back street rep vendor in Malaysia) warned me that I wouldn't actually get anything like 40 hours. She said that it should do 24, and might make it to 30. I tested it by giving it a full manual wind and left it to run down. I got *exactly* 40 hours from it, with the PR indicator nicely and accurately counting down the hours. A21Js come in for a lot of flack, and I know that they can be a bit hit or miss. However, just sometimes, they can perform outstandingly. Not only does it have the same PR as a gen, it is also by far the most accurate rep I own - usually keeping time to less than 5 seconds per day.

I'm absolutely no expert, but I must admit I thought that Rolex reps that could take gen parts were very much the exception rather than the rule, and the whole point of the high priced WM9s, BKs and TCs etc. was that they could take gen parts and that was what people are willing to pay big bucks for. I'm no modder, and were I to seriously consider buying one of these crystals then I would take it along to a local watchsmith and get them to fit it. I know several around where I live who are happy to work on reps, but they always add a health warning - I have to take responsibility in case they damage the watch due to mismatched parts or any flaws in its design or construction. So far, I haven't had any problems. It could be an expensive exercise, though, in taking a trial and error approach to fitting a gen spec crystal.

So why the button for setting the date? Rolex A21js set the date with the crown, why can't PAMs? So what about the ETA 2892-2 reps? These have a functional PR and, I think, set the date with the crown - which is what I am after. I presume then from what you say that these are an uncommon ETA movement. Is the movement itself expensive enough to justify the cost of these watches (getting on towards $600)?

Thank you very much for that. This is the bidfun-db Watch Movement Archive, and it is an amazing resource - it provides technical details and photographs of over 8,000 different watch movements. It isn't the easiest of systems to use (the search facility is eccentric, to say the least, and doesn't seem to work properly). However, there is a vast amount of information there. Unfortunately, because the search is so difficult I think that it would be very tricky to use it to identify an unknown movement - which is what I'm really after. Also, although it is a vast resource, there are some omissions (e.g. there are no Selita and it doesn't make it obvious which movements are ETA clones). If anyone knows of any other resources, then do please post them.

I am after some advice. Can anyone suggest a reasonably accurate PAM that has a functional power reserve, and doesn't cost the earth? I have an A21J PAM090 - which I like a lot, but it has one very major flaw in that the date is set by a button at the 8pm position (in the gen the date is set by the crown). There are plenty of nice, much more accurate, reps with a faux power reserve - but for me these are a non-starter, that defeats the point of having a power reserve! Trusty Time has a ETA 2892-2 based PAM027/028, which look very nice - but nearly $600 is a lot to pay for a rep. However, I haven't been able to find any power reserve Pams for any less than this that don't have that horrible button. Are there really no such things?

Does anyone know of a good "spotters guide" to movements? There are so many out there, and experts generally seem to be able to recognise movements at a glance. I would really like to be able to learn to do that. I live in Asia, where you can sometimes find quite decent reps in backstreet shops. The dealers will often make claims about their movements, and open up their watches to show people. However, looking inside a watch doesn't mean much to me. I don't know how to tell the difference between an A21J, an ETA clone, a real ETA a Selita etc. Can anyone point me in the direction of information here. BTW, I find it hard to believe that this isn't a frequently asked question (and my apologies if it is!). However, I have searched the forums and all I have found is very old threads which point at internet resources that have long gone.

OK- ignoring any mudslinging, it sounds clear that some reps cannot take a gen-spec crystal (call them incorrectly made if you like). Coming back to my original question - is there any way of telling whet their or not they will take the gen other than by trying? That would be an expensive experiment!

This really looks superb. Do you have any idea whether this fits the new ceramics (i.e. the 11661x series)? Also, how can you tell whether a rep is likely to be able to take a gen crystal - are there any measurements that can be made?

On your wrist, probably not - although most (not all) reps have a crappy pearl that is obvious from quite a difference if you know what to look for. However, if you handle the watch, most reps - even quite good ones. feel different to a gen. It is difficult to be more specific about what this is, I guess that it is build quality - a genuine Rolex does have a wonderfully smooth feel to it that reps generally don't have. Of course, this is all for the geeks. The vast majority of people won't know or care.

The better "out of the box" reps (such as those on Trusty) are very nice watches, but no one who has been around a gen is ever going to mistake them for anything other than a nice rep. The TC watches are in a completely different league. TC isn't a dealer - rather he is an semi-amateur watch maker who buys the best rep parts he can find and assembles watches that are as close to a gen as he can make them. They use gen construction, and are designed to accept gen parts - so they are an ideal base for people who want to go the franken route. I would guess that a TC with a gen insert and crystal would be extremely hard for even an expert to tell from a gen without taking the back off.

When it comes down to a "he said... she said" type of dispute, they almost always side with the buyer - and this can leave sellers open to being scammed. There was a horror story over on Repgeek (RIP) recently, where someone sold a gen - payment was made, and the watch delivered. The buyer then filed a dispute claiming that he had been fraudulantly sold a rep in place of the gen. According to the seller this was absolutely not the case, and he demanded that the watch be given to an independent expert to verify. However, PayPal "investigated", sided with the buyer and refunded his money - without getting the watch evaluated. They then stuck the seller with the bill, even though he didn't have his watch back, and it was looking unlikely that he would ever get it.

I live in Malaysia, and if you know where to look in KL some dealers have back street "shops" (really lockups) where they keep a lot of interesting stock. Last time that I was in one of these, I was offered a ceramic 116610LV that was very tempting. It wasn't up to TC standards, but it was pretty good nonetheless. I passed on it, because the dealer wanted a lot of money, and wouldn't haggle much. I am kind of hoping that TC will eventually produce something like this.

How many watches are you talking about? Also, are they reps or gens? If it is a fairly small number, it is very unlikely that customs will bother about this - I would suggest that you carry then with you in hand baggage. If you have a large enough number to look like a dealer, then that could well pique their interest. If they are gens, then you should declare them to customs (i.e. go through the red channel if you are accompanying them, or else fill out a customs declaration form if you are shipping them unaccompanied). If you do this, and have a very small personal collection, they will probably let you get away with it (duty isn't payable on personal effects). However, if you have a significant number of watches, the they will probably assume that you intend to sell them and charge duty - which is, I believe, 4.5% of the estimated market value. If they are reps, the situation is murky. You can't declare them as reps because importing reps is illegal, and if you are caught they are likely to be confiscated and destroyed. On the other hand, if they think that they are gens, then you could be liable to duty (4.5% of the value of the gen) - which could easily be more than the rep is worth. In short, if you have a small collection of reps or gens, just carry them through customs, and in the unlikely event that they question you then tell them that you are a watch collector and this is your personal hobby collection that you would never dream of selling. Don't say anything about them being reps! If you have a large collection of gens - then discuss the matter with customs. If you can't persuade them that it is your personal collection then you will have to bite the bullet and pay import duty (if you can afford a large collection of gens, you can probably afford the duty!). If you have a large collection of reps, then try to keep them out of customs view - if they do take an interest then that could either cost you a lot of money or you could conceivably loose the lot. I suggest that you split such a collection up. Carry a few with you, ship a few and maybe post some to yourself in ones or twos. If customs don't see a lot of watches together, then they are unlikely to bother with you. Also, that way, if you do get any confiscated at least you won't loose them all.

You can get heavy duty springbars that are designed for Panerais either from panatime or ebay. I prefer these to the quick release button, because that is fiddly and the build quality on most reps isn't up to it. Springbars are simple tried and trusted technology. They are very cheap, so it doesn't matter if you loose them, and you can't see the difference once they are in place.

It depends how and why you are wearing your rep. If it is on your wrist, no one can see the caseback - open or otherwise. I personally don't ever lie about my reps - on the very rare occasions that anyone asks me about my watches, I tell them that it is a rep. The only time that this would be a problem would be if you were taking your watch off to show people, and pretending that it is a gen. If you do that, then you are indeed more likely to get away with it with a closed caseback. Otherwise, get whatever you like the most. I like open case backs, because I find watch movements fascinating and beautiful.

TC Submariner Site That does look like a very nice watch. Can you tell us a bit more about it? TC advertises it as a kit on his site for $450. How much does he charge to assemble it? Is there a waiting list or did he ship it to you directly? I'm torn between ordering one of these, and waiting for a ceramic version. This looks lovely, but I do love those ceramics.

Paypal automate most of their security check. The moment that you do something that triggers their security software, they do this to you and you have to start uploading scans of your passport, proof of address etc. I have triggered this by having the be the temerity of being British, with a long standing UK PP account, but living abroad (with foreign bank accounts and addresses). This looks suspicious to their software, so they regularly "limit" my account. It is bloody annoying, but they have you by the ****. If you want to carry on using Paypal you have to follow their rules.

I would never divulge that sort of information to someone casually. It is often used as a part of security questions for verifying various online transactions. I'm not saying that this guy is anything other than trustworthy, I am just saying that this sort of information should be regarded as sensitive. Ask him why he wants it.

A shill post is one made by someone from a commercial site masquerading as a customer to boost their sales. Were someone from discountswatchesshop.com to create an account on here, then post saying something to the effect of "has anyone heard of these guys?", and then a few days later post saying "I just got my watch and it is great!" - that would be a shill. I'm not suggesting that you are shilling, but if you do get your watch and, in a few days time, post saying "it's great" then you might expect some skepticism on here! Sadly, that site does have all of the signs of being a scam site - pictures of gens, and offering a cut-price rep of a watch that no other dealer has.

My favourite is the blue two tone ceramic sub - it is just such an outrageously pretty watch! It is also smart, and would go very well with a military uniform. There are some very nice reps of this, although you might need to replace the pearl for it to look reasonably accurate.

The story that I have heard is that WM9 was a father/son business - and that both the father and the son died within a very short space of time. If this is the case, the money wasn't exactly stolen - it is just that dead people can't deliver watches or answer e-mails! The old WM9s are still out there, and supposedly the factory has been opened again by different people - so new WM9s are likely to appear, and the name lives on.