archibald

Sweet. The movement is worth $400 at least. I'd put the movement in a nice rep though, knowing when I was sick of it, I could always throw it back in the gen and sell for a profit.

The hand colour is correct in blue, don't go changing them!!

That's a tough one--CH hands are tough...it really depends on the specific dial color and the year. I'd not take my or anyone else's word for it and llok for a pic. I'm thinking the purple dial uses hands whatever color the case is, which would be "white gold" on the rep. First check the size of both dials--a dial for a gen 5850 crazy hours will not fit the rep "5850" which is really the same size as a gen 2852. The gen's ffet will I beleive be @ 9 and 3, as per the 2892. I don't know where the feet are on the asian auto dial, but I bet somewhere else. If the size works, I'd really just send it out to one of our smiths.

....you dont wear slippers with a suit.

Thing is, you don't wear a 44mm Luminor w/ a suit either, or at least you shouldn't. You're confusing cost with style. A big, crown guarded steel on rubber $4000 sport watch with jeans and a sweater is stylish. A big, crown guarded steel on rubber $4000 sport watch with a suit is not stylish.

I know, I know...I've seen all the pics of notable people, including the greatest president of the 20th century, wearing PAM's with suits. Thing is, they're notable for other thing aside from being good dressers. Whenever I see anyone w/ a 111 or a Sub with a nice suit, I usually assume they haven't discovered high quality reps yet and are wearing they're using your reasoning---expensive watch w/ expensive clothes. If they won't buy a nice near 1:1 Casablanca, they at least ought to go to the mall and pick up whatever 2824 powered Rayomond Weil dress watch is for sale.

Wheres Gioarmani when you need him?

are you going to be selling these? Either way, I'd love to see a green version!!

Whatever you do, don't eat you again that bugs.

Seriously, there is no reason for you to live with a watch that bad, even if the dealer says something like "the serial number and other flaws are clearly visible in the pics." A watch with a mistake that dumb shouldn't even be sold, and if it is sold the seller sgould write, in bold fonts, "Please note the 'P' in the serial number. It stands for 'Plastered', as the guy who did the engraving obviously was." The other probems should have been caught during QC, which was obviously non-existant. Frankly, the seller knows full well how bad the watch is, and the fact that he sold it to you anyway ought to make you reevaluate your your belief that he's your "friend."

Contact the seller and ask hime to refund your money or send watches that at least functions properly. Then you can new source casebacks from anoher dealer and only lose $100 or so on the transaction.

I'm 100% firmly in favor reinstating the draft, as long as they do it the way Charlie Rangel has proposed: The first kids drafted are the kids and/or grandkids of those in a position to authorize or prosecute the war. Next go the kids from households that make over $500k w/ no student deferments, and on down to the poor who go last.

For guys who don't know, Ryannon is doing the "typical-American" parody thing, but he doesn't get what's so scary it's not the least bit funny, especially if you live in an utterly inconsequential country like, say, France: the people who vote because they'd like to have a BBQ w/ somone are 100%, and I mean 100%, in control of choosing the people who walk the puppies.

I always say this in these threads: It doesn't matter if the links are solid 14K or not. What are you going to do, let people weigh your watch? Anyone who knows enough about gold or TT Rolexes to call you out on the gold is going to call you out on the color not the weight--and 14 K gold is instantly noticeable. Much better to invest in aPVD plated piece, especially if the maker takes the time to accurately match Rolex's proprietary shade of gold. It won't fade or rub off and ultimately it will be much much more accurate than a 14K piece, solid or not as long as you keep it on your wrist, which is what should happen with reps anyway.

I think there would be a huge demand from serious Rolex collectors for pieces with durable plating that matches Rolex's color--especially in the TT sub. I understand that PVD gold can match any shade under the sun...no worries about 14K, no drilling holes in perfectly good links.

Yep. Looking at my gen 210, you would be hard pressed to even tell there WAS anti-reflective coating on it.

My 002 has AR that is quite blue, but it might be a replacement crystal or an aftermarket AR job...

The AR on most models is more visible thsn on the 127. OP probably made the fiddy's AR a subtle as possible to preserve the vintage look of the watch.

New DSN 104 with fixed second hand looks reasonable and gives good impression though pictures are not ideal - too dim to properly see all the important details. The link is here: http://www.rwg.cc/members/index.php?showtopic=71010&hl=

The only thing I'm a bit concerned about - I like the look of 104 with "dark" metal hands, like here http://www.chrono24.com/externewindows/bil...ina&lang=en

and on DSN pictures they look plain chrome. Is it just a play of light or there are 2 versions on gen 104 with "dark" and "chrome" hands?

Any other drawbacks on this new DSN 104?

Are there any dealers around offering better rep of 104 than DSN?

There is a thread about this watch on he second page of this subforum complete with a lik to DSN's "improved" version.

Looking at the watches makes me think of formula one cars, must be the engineered look they have. Very nice.

They're made by Sassun Sirmakes, son of Muller CEO Vartan Sirmakes. I've been tempted by a couple used pieces, which look to me like "poor man's" Richard Mille watches. He started out using the Muller business model--putting stock movements in interesting cases, but their initial offerings were actually pretty good bargains compared to mille's of Mullers--they had essentially straight 7750's and 2892's with some of the parts replaced w/ some of the high-tech materials Mille uses on his movements and sold used for about $4000. The newer models, like the one pictured, use more heavily modded 7750's and manufacture movements and are much more expensive--like $15-$20K. The manufacture pieces are almost as expensive as Milles. I may look for a used early-model CVSTOS if and when my collection is more or less complete, and I need to add some highly unusual pieces.

Get over it ... you posted this same thing on RepGeek and the Darkside as well as here ... expecting a better answer ??? Come on you are out nothing but a little time and gas money. Be thankful you were not robbed and beaten and go out and find a new watch.

My guy tells me I do have a better answer: The guy was in the process of ripping you off and now has cold feet when it's time to do the deed. Go to the PO, call him on his rep, and then warn folks the next time he tries it, which he might. The takeway for RWGers from this is Craig's list is a waste of time: my wife collects jewelry and for every good deal she gets, she has to deal with 10 idiots and 10 scammers.

Well, there re several problems w/ his pics:

1)there was never a real PVD version released by any factory that I'm aware of.

2)the dial in his pics looks like aged-tritium look luminova, also never produced by a factory. I didn't look long enough to definitively figure it out, but it looks like he's using pics of a modded rep. God knows what you are going to get.

Also, there is adifference between the original honpo 28 and later 2892 versions, most visibly the dial but also the gorgeous decorated movements (1:1 to gen aside from a missing "I") and in many cases the caseback numbers, which were numbered sequentially in the honpo run. I doubt the hompo version pictured is available in any quantity .

The only positive thing I can say is that there were a few non-honpo 28 reps available last July--so there may be some dealer somehwere who can get one if s/he's willing to look.

My advice would be to ignore this guy and move along...

Big pilot project abandoned.

I figured as much. I hope some maker can figure out a way to put a datewheel on a 6497 or some other large movement...as long as they get the date in the right place, I can live w/ a faux PR.

Yes, the dial of a DSN 228 should come out very good, J.!

Unfortunately, as you know, the caseback of the 228 is very different from the 088's and 089's...

As long as he gets the hands and dial right, I will probably just choose the caseback that has the most detailed engraving, even iff the BB and OP #'s are wrong...nobody outside of Rome has those memorized anyway!

Great!! Thanks!!

I might be excited about these,I guess, but it depends: RO seconds @ 12, skyland, 1911 BTR: could they be working on some sort of module to put on the asian 2892? Let's hope so, because otherwise those reps are going to all have pusher/crown/subdial position problems that can't be fixed. And aside from the AP, they're going to be $500 reps of $2500 watches. I guess the only one of the ones mentioned the heritage is nicest, but not as nice as the equally reppable and way, way better cost-ratio Fifty-Fathoms.

Thanks for the great advice guys! The short version is you guys are true experts and I followed every bit of it and I think made a pretty good choice.

The long version in case another semi beginner is looking for an acoustic:

Called around and found a little guitar shop that had a '69 model of the Yamaha everybody raves about as the great sleeper "best value on the planet", which I tuned to concert tuning and played a good while. Nice, but nothing that transcended the average to my ears, and nowhere near as nice as either of what would later be my top 3 pics, which were twice as expensive but sounded more than twice as good--a new Taylor 3 something, a new Martin 16GTR and, a used Larrivee D3.

I thought the Taylor played the easiest and had a beautiful bright tone; the Larivee was the most balanced and the loudest by far but was $$150-200 more than the other 2 which were both around $750. Ultimately I decided on the Martin I had originally played for two reasons: although the high end could have been brighter, the bass was very rich and tight, and that suits the style I like (read: unsuccessfully try) to play, which is to try to do bass note "runs" while picking or strumming chords on the top 4 strings. It also buzzed the least when tuned down to open C and drop D, which tend to allow hacks like me sound like we know interesting chords in addition to the standard Mell Bay Volume 1 chords we play 99% of the time!

Just to let anyone interested that I got assuration by Davidsen that he is going to fix both the minute and GMT hand issues.

Also that the 089 caseback that he used in his photobook was just for early display purpose, it is not the same that he is going to mount on his watches for sale that will be very accurate.

According to this all, we should have almost perfect 088 & 089 soon...

In that case, I hope they also make the 228!!!

Davidsen's is more accurate, but both versions represent blown opportunities to make what could have easily been one of the most accurate PAMs of all time--all of the needed parts already existed, even most of the dial: all they needed to do was get the l-swiss-l right and cleanly engrave the correct digits on the caseback. Both makers screwed up both things.

before I point out what may one of the biggest upsets in the PAM rep industry.

Unless you think you'll be mistakenly shipped a rep w/ a gen movement or you're planning on buying all of the supply, why not post what you're thinking? I've always assumed that the way it usually works around here is that people post what they think about something, others may agree or disagreee, and then we all eventaually arrive at a conclusion that's useful to all of us.

That being said, I'd like to see a pic of the balance wheel stopped, too.

Anybody know the measurements of the dials I have found a couple of gen dials but I am not sure weather they are ladies or men size.

Arch you pobably know, care to chime in ?

If they're the conquistador dials toumii is selling on ebay, you want the ones she advertises as 25mm wide (actually they're 25,2). Also, when bidding assume her conq. dials need to be lumed since she sells factory rejects that rarely made it to the lume stage. I've never been able to figure out why the dials I've bought were rejected except for a few that have very light scratches. If the dials are for the 2852 size casablancas you want to try her "36mm" wide dials, although I have never tried the dials she advertises @ 36. The reps need dials 36.24mm, which may be what she means. I bought Casa. dials advertised as 36.3 from another seller and they worked fine. If they're long island dials, fugetabotit. Haven't found a LI rep that fits any of the 15 or so LI dials I've bought.

4fun very generously gave me a sunset dial that I believe will fit the rep casablanca case, which I would be happy to give away to pass along to one of our fellow Muller fans. The catch: For this to make an accurate rep, you'll have to buy or own a "gold"crazy hours (muller makes no stainless sunsets) w/ the blued leaf hands and then disable the jumping function, which is easy to do. After installing the gen dial you'll have a very rare Sunset that's pretty damn good on the dial side but dead wrong on the back.

WOW looks PERFECT to me!

Sure does!! Awesome job!

If bought that dial recently on the Bay, sorry to make you pay so much!! But, if it makes you feel better, the one I got a week later cost me $14 more! I'm going to try to throw my dial into an MBW case--when you tried yours in the MBW case did it look worse or the same as the "perfect" case? I know the Noob dial drops right into the MBW case, so I guess that would be a fallback, but I'd sure love to use the gen dial.

Wear that beauty well!

...ask yourself why they are always extremely careful to keep us in the loop when they change URL and the such....ask in fact why they even bother dealing with us if we are such a small part of their business.

Ken

That says it all.

Just apply the math I did earlier and decide for yourself what level porofit from the boards would keep them coming back, freaking out when people post that they've changed websites, etc. If it's 1-5%, looks like they're sprending an inordinate amount of time getting and trying to reatain a very very small part of their customer base.

Seriously? You thing we're half of the market for HBBs or SFSOs?

From the "Big Three" dealers I think maybe we are closer to 50% than 5%...or they have much larger access to much larger runs than I've been led to believe. But what's a forum buyer, anyway? A guy who finds a dealer's site and then stumbles uopn us while trying to figure out if Andrew is legit? A guy who comes here after googling"Fake Breitling" figures out where to buy and then is never seen again? Or just us die hards? Like I said in my first post...we'll never know the gross and we'll never know the net, and if we did we'd be powerless to change a dime of prices...but it sure would be interesting to know.

Exactly.

So the true mean figure should stay middlepoint between those two extremes, and 1-5% might be not so far from reality.

Most likely near the lower limit, though.

With respect to the super-reps sold by forum dealers, I'm thinking we need to put a 0 after the 5 and before the percent sign. But I actually don't think they have much to do w/ the pricing....