PAMman

Looks OK to me. I can't remember the rep caseback numbers but the only F series rep that I've ever seen was the 111.

I bought 3 genuine dials with a view to making one of my own, using a rep Daytona, Swiss ETA 7750 etc. It shouldn't be too difficult. However I then bought a gen on the 'bay and I love it. I have 3 dials that I would sell if anyone really wants to do this (black, blue and white/panda).

OK...

I am a mechanical engineer and have SolidWorks and all the software needed to do what's needed in 3d... I can convert laser scanned data into useable surfaces for manufacturing... But I really don't understand why we have to re-invent the wheel... anyone have a direct line to JimmyFu?

If not... I will help any way I can if there is some scanned data of original cases... or even 2D data, and I will turn it into a full 3D model ready for manufacture...

Cheers

D

I have had a good trading relationship with Jimmy Fu but he is a fairly prominent Panersiti who decided, a few years ago, to produce his own homage watch. He had 200 pieces made using his own 001D as a pattern but then along came the Panerai litigation against 'Ken Trading' in respect of the original RXW Marina Militaire, where Panerai were successful. Jimmy decided not to go ahead and instead started to off-load his parts on ebay, described as 'after-market' replacement parts together with a warning that use of these parts would inavlidate any warranty from Panerai. He was deliberately disassociating himself from the rep scene and he clearly doesn't want any further part in any related activity. I asked him for contact details of the machine shop used but he told me that 'it was no longer in business' - he's a gentleman but I don't think that he will be willing to assist in any way.

So you suggest to do a complete set with crown and tube? Well, that would do as well, but swapping the crown is one thing, replacing the tube is another. So doing this project would be impossible for most of us without paying a pro modder for swapping the tube. With related expenses and shipping/customs risk this would keep a lot of people away from taking this project and making use of t

who does have the nicest case? i'm sure that's a subjective question, but if not DSN, what rep manufacturer?

DSN has the most inaccurate in terms of overall dimensions etc. He has different cases for different models and some, like his preV 5218/201A for example, are simply hideously deformed with a too high crown position and then a too tall bezel and misshapen CG to disguise the flaws. For some inexplicable reason he seems to think that the preV watches should have a taller bezel when actually the reverse is true.

Check out this link, changing xx for tt and search for DSN's post of his new 201A - then compare.

hxxp://www.paneristi.com/archives/casedifferences/index.html

To answer your question - anyone but DSN - honestly Jimmy Fu's was the only 1:1 copy but the rest are pretty good, certainly miles better than DSN's rubbish.

Wouldn

Just curious if the automatic 7750 will fit into a JF case.

The JF case is a bit thinner Crystal-to-Caseback, and I have heard differing opinions on the subject.

Are modification required to allow fitment? Is it a pretty straight swap?

Any and all insight is appreciated.

-M

Don't know the answer but don't forget that the autos have a diffent caseback from the handwind models and Jimmy's caseback is for handwinds. Maybe adding the appropriate back to Jimmy's case will help.

the screw tubes on my DSN 111H seem to be a little short. the non-threaded side seems to recess too far into the case and it looks a bit strange. do any of you have any recommendations for longer screw tubes? they need to be about 1mm longer. thanks in advance.

It's less likely that DSN's screws are too short but more likely than his case is wider at the lugs than it should be. His stuff is very inaccurate and poorly fitting. However try another set of screws just to make sure as regular reps screws vary slightly in length and you obviously need the longest that you can find. If you really want to sort this properly consider buying 26mm screws and cutting them to the exact length that you need and then recutting screw slots again. Not easy I'm sure but worth a try.

The first series, that's the G series, were all L SWISS L and I think that some of the H series were the same but since then they've been L SWISS MADE L.

Cool, theres quite a few of us, I wonder how many are swiss or frankened..

My modded watch is swiss+eta wheeled+gen dialed

Mine has also the gen dial and Swiss 7750 c/w day & date wheels, waiting to go to The Zigmeister for Chieftang's AR treatment. IMO, this is probably the best IWC rep of all. Yes, the crown is wobbly but AFAIK they're all like that. I'm considering getting my gen dial relumed in a tritium colour to match the T SWISS T on the rep, to reinforce the gen appearance.

I think a deeper recess for the lever could cause problems with too short levers. Better modify the lever than having a crown that is useless because of a short lever...

Good point, but I think that the Palp crown went much too far in this direction. In my experience, even the shortest rep crown levers were way too long for Palp's crowns and still had to be drastically shortened, leaving them an inaccurate shape.

Some feedback on this aspect would be useful, specifically;

Did the Palp crowns have too shallow a recess, with the result that even short levers had to be shortened significantly further?

Please respond.

In most of the older Panerai reps, including the 029, the A has its crossbar too low, resulting in a larger upper triangle and a 'droopy' appearance. Just compare most rep PAMs with the corresponding gens - the newer reps (104 some subs etc) are correct but the bulk are incorrect. The 029 pictured in that post had the crossbar at the correct height so this must be a different run of dial. However if it is for the Asain movement only then this dial will not suit the more desirable ETA 2893 movement watches.

Apart from a couple of franken PAMs that have a high content of genuine parts I have a IWC GST Ti with a Swiss 7750 and gen dial that it's easy to forget is a rep. However, straight out of the box the SOSF and the Ingy take some beating. Both feel very similar to the genuine item and with Swiss ETA movements they operate flawlessly. Both keepers for sure.

I think it is a simple Asian model from Sead on RG. Very nicely photographed. The dial looks great.

Yes, the dial is great with the corrected A.

I presume this is DSN's 029?

If the Palp crown is being used as a sample please correct the recess, where the lever closes. This should be deeper than Palp's to allow a more normal CG lever length because Palp's crown required the levers to be shortened too much.

BTW, DSN's latest SS crown and tube is excellent except for the bevel on the edge being too much. If he could produce the same crown with less bevel it would be perfect and it comes with its own case tube.

The photos aren't great but it looks 100% to me.

I have researched this topic and I came to the conclusion that Rolli can provide the best finish for the preA and A series Panerai. In fact I would have already sent mine if I could get a tube made to suit my genuine crown. I'm intending to use a gen Ti crown with a Jimmy Fu case & crownguard, get it PVD'd and drop my genuine preA1 dial / movement into it. My current problem is getting a wider tube to take the genuine B series crown as Jimmy's cases are 1:1 copies of the D series watches. The B series had seals on the shaft of the crown and the shaft was thicker to allow for the grooves that seat the seals while the D series had a narrower smooth shaft and a seal within the tube.

Unless anyone can demonstrate that there is a better source for the correct PVD finish I am likely to go with Rolli as soon as I get this problem sorted.

I seriously doubt he actually PRODUCES his OWN Ti cases...Here's why I feel so: I own a Ti 036, that I bought from a trusted dealer on another board in January of this year...This case has exactly the same "quirkiness" as the one you described earlier, the overly thick lug screws, the etched engravings, and the crown centered slightly higher than the center of the caseback...I know the CG isn't "standard", since I tried to switch it with another 036 case, and it wouldn't line up....This watch came with a proper canon pinion, a sapphire, single a/r coated crystal, and a 2mm crown that fits almost perfectly flush against the case, and a nicely fitted tight lever that contacts the crown dead center.(the only significant variation from the Dsn setup!)....And at the time I got it, it cost LESS than $150 !!...The only drawback to the entire setup is the fact that the Asian

movement has the "curved" rather than the "angular" plate layout...A non issue to me, since nobody but me ever looks at it!!

I feel that this case set is a good deal better finished and accurate than the other 036 that I had side by side with it...

The only mod I found necessary to perform was to grind a gentle curvature to the face surface of the CG, to make it less flat, and truer to the genuine 036...This took @ 10 minutes, only because I work slow!!...All things considered, this is the nicest Ti case I have handled, but I would NEVER pay Dsn's prices to own one!! ;)

I have no idea what he produces but I agree that it's unlikely that he actually commissions anything other than dials. However he uses cases which are a departure from the usual reasonable accurate rep case and in fact, with the exception of a couple of his dials and his crowns I don't consider that any component which is uses is even equal to the normal rep. Every other component is less accurate, less well finished and very carelessly assembled together to make a watch. See Uncle Jay's assessment of his recent delivery of DSN's 'premium products'.

I am very sorry but not at all surprised. However I must commend you for being willing to be honest about his rubbish.

I must have posted at least 50 posts warning that DSN's stuff is highly inaccurate, poorly finished, very carelessly assembled and not compatible with any alternative parts which may otherwise be used to correct his peculiar interpretation of what a Panerai looks like.

Can we please accept that his products are tripe? - yes they are different than the regular rep offerings but he is making fools of a lot of people. I have sent him numerous emails and PM offering to assist in improving the accuracy of his products but he has never had the manners to respond to a single message. He is not interested in improving anything as long as he has a bunch of supporters who won't speak up, lest they end up being blacklisted like me.

I'm certainly intending to get a Jimmy Fu case & CG PVD'd and my intention is to go to Rolli unless someone tells me otherwise. If we can join together to make this a worthwhile project then count me in.

PAMman, when you say "crown sitting too high in the case" do you mean too close to the caseback, or to the bezel / crystal side? (I suppose the latter, but need to get sure).

Too close to the bezel. This is a factor in all of DSN's 44mm handwind 6497 cases but it is worst in his latest preV cases (the 2-screw cases). AFAIK his Ti case is worse than his normal SS cases but they all have the crown & stem too close to the bezel and he attempts to disguise this by using a thick misshapen crownguard, with the top segment (above the lever) the same thickness as the lower. In the older genuine / Jimmy Fu / normal rep CG the top segment is approx one third the thickness of the lower part, along its outer edge.

If someone sets out to provide a superior product at a premium price then, where bespoke components are being used, these should be better finished and / or more accurate than the regular production rep. DSN's are demonstrably less accurate, are more poorly finished (if you have one of his Ti crownguards check out the finish on the lever) and frequently don't fit together properly (CG to case is a good example). Compare these areas to a regular Cartel offering at a lower price. Then ask youself, 'How does this handbuilt Panerai replica compare with my regular Steelfish / IWC GST / Navitimer?' I cannot understand how he has persuaded so many people that his product is desirable.

What, how could he be so stupid having spent time here, did he read nothing, he obviosly learnt nothing, is this the sort of person that would rob the bank he had just deposited his life savings in, in his real name?

I know someone who, together with an accomplice as bright as himself, took a day off work and made a 2 hour train journey to rob a bank in Dublin. After successfully robbing the bank they dashed outside, hailed a taxi to take them back to the station and (according to the taxi-driver who gave evidence at their trial) paid the taxi-driver with a large banknote and told him to keep the change. When he thanked them for their generosity and wished them 'Good Luck' they said, 'Thanks, we'll need it.' Needless to say they didn't complete their train journey home before being arrested and taken from the train en-route. Maybe Asad's his brother??

Dunno who makes them but those sold by Timefactors in UK are top quality. Contact Eddie Platts @ timefactors.com. His associated forum is TZ-UK.com and it's a great gen watch resource.

I certainly don't condone the use of child labour and would hate to think that I was supporting it in any way. However, I do think that I am more likely to be buying the product of exploited workers by purchasing clothes that are manufactured in China, particularly items like T shirts, socks etc which are being sold world-wide under a variety of established brand names.