Up against the wall, it's a seizure!

[automatico]

There is a recent post on VRF about a 1655 case being not genuine but still passing through RSC service titled "Buyer claimed my post after more then one year"  but what attracted my attention were the remarks about 1655 cases being prone to seizing because of corrosion or galling.  I did not suspect this at all.

 

http://www.network54.com/Forum/207593/thread/1487782568/last-1487949986/View+All

 

A lot of genuine rolex watches have passed through my greedy little mitts in the past 40+ years and the cases I have seen corroded more than any were 16xx DJ and 16xxx DJ, probably because I have owned a lot of them but they still seem to be the worst in my experience.  I have not owned many vintage watersport models (submariners) but have owned quite a few modern watersport subs/GMT/Exp II (1980s/1990s mostly) and very few of them were corroded enough to amount to anything.

 

This of course means nothing much at all because:

1... For one thing I live a few hundred miles from salt water (where watches are actually worn in salt water).

2...I try to look each watch over so I do not get a 'rip-rot special' if I can help it.

 

One thing to look for is black specks around the mid case under the hoods between the lugs.  This is often a sign of corrosion...you can not tell how bad it really is, just that it is present.  It can go from insignificant to deadly and sometimes can be bad enough to let water in the case.  I had an old 16xx DJ with a tiny black speck under the bezel and it was letting water in the case when it was pressure tested.  I would have not paid much attention to it but a stream of bubbles shot out from under the bezel.

 

Something else to look at are the areas on the case and case back where the gasket seals up.  One side may look new and the other side may be rotted out so it is always a good idea to remove the gasket and take a look.  This is why some 'watch for sale' pictures will show the case or case back with the gasket in place...one side is good, the other not so much.

 

The best way to prevent corrosion is to not wear the watch (Ha!) or be sure to lubricate the gasket with silicone 7 or something similar.

The best way to prevent thread galling or seizure! is to use a little bit of lithium base lubricant on the threads.  The high priced lubricant used by rolex (Fomblin) is basically high grade lithium vacuum pump grease.  Krytox makes lubricants similar to Fomblin but usually at lower prices.  Something else: the smoother the machining around gasket areas...the less corrosion usually develops.

 

I've said all the above before but the 1655 info is news to me and maybe you too.

 

Btw...in general, what brands of vintage cases have I seen that seem to hold up the best?  Mostly Bulova.  The worst?  Vintage Wyler and older models of all brands made back when stainless steel first became popular just after WW II.

　

　

　

　

　

[RickFlorida]

I live in a very corrosive environment.  Two blocks from ocean and high humidity.   I do a lot of running, snorkeling, fishing, yard work..... But....I don't see much corrosion on my stainless marathon watch.   I believe since I also shower or go in my pool with the watch after each of those activities, rinsing saltwater off really prevents a lot of corrosion.

 

I wore my marathon diver for almost 10 years in that environment, and I don't see any pitting of corrosion.   Maybe it takes 40 years.

 

It's so bad where I live, all my stainless hardware out side my house has a light orange coating of rust.

[RickFlorida]

I just noticed someone said 304 stainless.   So we're 1665 only 304 stainless instead of 316?   That may be why cases corroded.    

 

I'm not an metal scientist but unless you are exposed to strong acids or other chemicals, I fail to believe 316 is not good enough for a watch in saltwater periodically.  I believe the custom stainless in new Rolex is more for marketing.

[altesporsche]

316 will depending on the conditions corrode. You will see discoloration in saltwater no matter what if its submerged a lot and not rinsed off in fresh water.  the pitting that you see in older cases is a combo of salt water exposure and acids and oils of the skin over time building up on the watch in and areas where it just sits and reactions take place. this for example on the old subs and stuff would be outside of the oring on the case and under the case back. I would get into the metallurgy of it all but, im at work and not supposed to be on forums lol   seriously though ive seen 316 corrode quite badly in as little as one year and less when introduced to any kind of electrical current and saltwater exposure.  ill see if I can find some photos of a court case I was involved in where 316 stainless piping and valves looked like nickel plated brass after a lot of exposure to maritime conditions..  black and pitted badly.  

 

You can also see an example of how corrosive body oils are in vintage guitars on nickel bridges and parts. I used to play with a fella who used pure nickel strings and after a gig they were absolutely toast from corrosion from the acids in his skin oils. His 5 year old strat looked worst than my 58' strat lol all of his paint was rotted away from his sweat, all hardware was completely toast, but it looks quite cool for a relic guitar after only 5 years of use.  so my point being is that you cannot just think about the saltwater that these watches are in contact with. you also need to consider the PH of the human wearing it.

[automatico]

"I wore my marathon diver for almost 10 years in that environment, and I don't see any pitting of corrosion."

 

Marathon!  I always liked Marathon watches and have a Marathon 'SAR/CCG' (Search And Rescue/Canadian Coast Guard) watch the MWR forum had made 10 or 12 years ago.  This style of watch (matte finished steel, 200MWR, non screw down crown, plastic bezel, Eta 2824) was made under contract for Marathon by Horoswiss in Switzerland and it is built like an Army tank.  Horoswiss also made a lot of the higher quality Swiss Army watches.

 

The MWR Forum had 65 special made with 'sterile' dials for members.  They are exactly like the examples in the links except for the dials and the case backs...they have MWR engraved on the backs.  Might see one for sale every now and then on MWR etc.  I guess (hope) they are collector items now.

 

http://broadarrow.net/ccg.htm

 

http://chronocentric.com/forums/chronotrader/index.cgi?md=read;id=53688

 

 

"I just noticed someone said 304 stainless. So we're 1665 only 304 stainless instead of 316? That may be why cases corroded."

 

I noticed that too.  Maybe 304 corrodes quicker than 316.

 

 

"my point being is that you cannot just think about the saltwater that these watches are in contact with. you also need to consider the PH of the human wearing it."

 

I knew a guy whose stainless steel watches all looked 20 years old in a couple years because of this.  The back sides of the cases looked like he worked in a battery acid factory.