.

[RWG Technical]

.

[Pugwash]

Eek! Just when you thought 2836s were safe bets. Thanks for the detailed documenting, Rob.

Is there any way to tell if a movement is not as new as hoped just by looking at it? Or do you have to open it up and strip it down?

[RWG Technical]

No real way to tell, on this one (2824-2) if you wound it, instead of the "Click, Click" you hear as the barrel ratchets from full wind and the clutch releases, you would have heard a "ziiiipppp" sound, which is NOT normal...

It was running fast, but that in itelf is not an indication of a problem, after all, it may only need adjusting...

The 2671 was working "ok" but as you can see, look at the dirt under the crown wheel, and the crap on the pallet stones, how much more use before it was a write off.

The only insurance is to service it on a regular basis, then you know for sure.

But in your case, not a worry once you get the TZ course out of the way, and can do your own servicing .

RG

[Pugwash]

But in your case, not a worry once you get the TZ course out of the way, and can do your own servicing .

Yes, but I'd rather learn on non-critical movements, like the broken 2836 from my MBW, instead of on my brand new Breitling Tin Haddock Mega Ocean SuperRep.

[chris5264]

This reminded me of a quote from Louis Abraham Breguet who said "Provide me the perfect oil and I will provide you the perfect watch" I am just beginning to appreciate how important this is.............

[vaccum]

WOW! That's one dirty movement....I have seen a few like that

Thanks for sharing!!

vaccum

[freddy333]

Rob - Is there a universal mainspring winder for ETAs (mainly 2836-2 & 2846) or do you have to purchase a separate winder for each ETA model? And can you recommend a source to purchase a winder?

[RWG Technical]

On the 2836 or 2846 or 2892, I wind the mainspring in by hand, not with a tool.

The 2671 I use my winder on (due to the small size), but that's about the only model that I actually use the tool on.

Jules Borel has winders for sale.

RG

[ubiquitous]

Pictures speak a thousand words... And this post alone is a good example as to why servicing a movement is important if you want your watch to last.

Consider that a watch could potentially run 24 hours a day, 365 days a year and over the course of 5 years; that watch will only need one servicing over that course of 5 years for regular service. Now take the price to service a watch and amortize that cost across that 5 year span. Considering the big picture, it's really not as expensive as one might think.

Can't really compare that to a car's motor, as you're not actually running the engine in the 24/365/5 usage duration

And, sure... You can always just pitch the old movement for a new one to keep the watch going, but the movement you receive could be just as old and worn out as the one that's being replaced. In my case... I can't just go out and slap in a new El Primero into one of my watches everytime one fails... Just doesn't make financial sense when the movement alone costs $1200.00.

[freddy333]

I can't just go out and slap in a new El Primero into one of my watches everytime one fails... Just doesn't make financial sense when the movement alone costs $1200.00.

Thanks, Randy, I was going to ask you about the cost of that El Primero. I have been considering following in your footsteps for a future 16520 project.

I have an unrelated question -- Would you consider using a similar El Primero for a Newman Daytona or just the 16520?

[Pugwash]

Would you consider using a similar El Primero for a Newman Daytona or just the 16520?

If you're going genuine-style movement, you need a Valjoux movement for the PN Daytona. V23 or v72 if my memory serves me right.

[freddy333]

On the 2836 or 2846 or 2892, I wind the mainspring in by hand, not with a tool.

The 2671 I use my winder on (due to the small size), but that's about the only model that I actually use the tool on.

Jules Borel has winders for sale.

RG

Thanks Rob, I will check JB for winders.

Do you wear gloves or finger cots when winding springs by hand?

[ubiquitous]

Freddy- Pugs has it correct. Movements for Daytonas are specified as the following-

6263/6265/6239/6240/6241, etc use the Rolex modified Valjoux 72 (727)

16520/16523/16528/16518, etc use the Rolex modified El Primero 400 (4030)

116520/116523/116258/11618, etc use the Rolex in-house movement (4130)

If you're considering an EP400/16520 project, you should also factor in the cost for service (which is highly recommended in my opinion). Figure on $500 for an overhaul.

Hope this helps...

Cheers,

R

[RWG Technical]

Thanks Rob, I will check JB for winders.

Do you wear gloves or finger cots when winding springs by hand?

I never wear anything on my hands when working on watches, too risky for slippage, and lint is always a problem. Today's springs are not prone to rust like the old ones were...I have never had any problems with hand winding.

RG

[freddy333]

Thanks Pugs and Ubi.

[freddy333]

I never wear anything on my hands when working on watches, too risky for slippage, and lint is always a problem. Today's springs are not prone to rust like the old ones were...I have never had any problems with hand winding.

RG

I was always told never to touch either type of spring with bare hands due to the likelihood of rust. But if you have not had any problems, then I guess things must have changed. Good to hear.

Thanks Rob.

[RWG Technical]

I was always told never to touch either type of spring with bare hands due to the likelihood of rust. But if you have not had any problems, then I guess things must have changed. Good to hear.

Thanks Rob.

Mainspring replacement was the mainstay of many a watchmaker 50+ years ago...not so today. I have replaced two broken mainsprings in the past 24 months, one was on a 6497 due to a failed spot weld on the bridle, the other was on a 2836 that the bridle broke where it connects to the mainspring, most likely a defect in manufacturing or assembly.

I have never seen any modern mainspring with rust on it, even the one from the 2824 above, was pristine, no rust... They are non magnetic, and rust free from what I see. Same for the hairspring, non-magnetic, so forget the magnetism causing a hairspring to touch coils and run faster, you can't magnetize them anymore.

RG

[woody]

That is one pretty gunked up movement. Rob, on the 2671 that I had thought I had sent in, you told me it was actually a 2688. Was my wife's as dirty as the one that you shown here, that caused the winding issue? Just curious.