A Mea Culpa (of sorts) with Snaps

[freddy333]

You may recall that in my original thread on the subject of DRSD caseback modding (The Big Question) I compared photos of an untouched caseback to a gen (taken from doubleredseadweller.com). There was no question, even to the casual observer, that the lettering on the sharply etched MBW caseback differed from the softly rounded & sunkin gen (to the knowledgeable observer, the MBW was engraved using modern equipment & methods, while the gen was stamped using state-of-the-art technology available back in the 70's).

Ok, I am now a partial believer in the sand-and-buff approach to gen-itizing the MBW DRSD caseback. I say partial because after honing my caseback sanding & buffing skills on 3 scrap casebacks and spending hours intricately sanding both the entire surface with a dremel as well as each individual letter by hand, the final result on my MBW is both compelling and lacking.

The 'ROLEX' is the definition of perfection. If I saw a picture containing only the ROLEX, I would be 100% sure it was gen. However, the rest of the lettering, though much improved over the OEM MBW lettering, still look (to me) like a modern engraving that has been intricately sanded & polished.

Comments?

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As a postscript -- You may also recall that my last set of relatively simple mods (He Valve mod, superdome, etc.) ultimately became a nightmare when I ran into keyless works problems and ended up losing a click spring and 2 screws that caused me to have to rape 2 other 2846s in an effort to get 1 working movement back into my watch. Well, just minutes ago, all 3 missing parts magically re-appeared from the Bermuda Triangle. The most amazing find is the diminutive click spring, which is the thickness of a human hair and only about 1/4" in length. After spending nearly an entire evening on my hands & knees searching for these parts, I am stupefied that they would not only be found, but that they were all found right on my work table (which I had searched numerous times in vain). Here is the (just found) click spring about to be reinstalled in 1 of the pillaged 2846s

So, now that all 3 missing parts have been found & returned to their original homes, my record for lost parts returns to an incredible 0.

[mojo2001]

Man, I like that effect... "Rolex" indeed looks good!

What about if, instead of using a sanding cylinder on a dremel--rigid and can't "dig" into the letter--you use a piece of fine emery cloth on the tip of your finger or some other flexible sanding medium that will get down into the nooks and spread out the top of the engraved letters?

I am thinking about the fiberglass fiber sanding "pens" but that would require a mask so that not too many microscopic fibers are inhaled in the process.

Maybe even a rough ink eraser...or some emery cloth wrapped aound a pencil eraser?

Anyway, good work Bro! I can't tell you how much I appreciate your experimentation so we can all learn from your mistakes and successes!

mojo

[freddy333]

Mojo -- Thank you. Except for the fiberglass pen (sorry, I do not have one of those, but an interesting suggestion that I will look into), I did pretty much what you described -- each letter was individually (and painstakingly) sanded & polished both by hand & with a pencil-style eraser -- sharpened & tipped with varying grades of emory paper (I also tried coating the tip with pumice, but that did not do any better). (I will be posting an interesting & related update involving the eraser soon. Watch this space.) After it became clear that I had effected as much of a change as I could by hand, I switched on the dremel and went at it with several sanding & buffing tools. I mean I sanded & polished the hell out of that thing. If sanding & buffing was going to do it, I would have done it. But, unfortunately, no amount of sanding & polishing will widen the stroke width (thickness of the lines) of each individual letter to match the lettering on the gen's caseback.

I considered sanding the lettering down to the point where they were nearly flush with the surface of the caseback and began to disappear, which I think is what PolexPete did on his. Pete's lettering looked a bit better than mine, but it still looked (to me) like a modern engraving that was sanded & polished (and more difficult to read, which is not what I was after).

[freddy333]

Nanuq -- Thanks. After reading your comments about that coin bag in another thread, it is definitely on my to do list though I am mixed as to whether I want to go for the full patina or the 'just serviced by RSC' look. And I have a few more tricks (1 being Mojo's idea of the fiberglass pen) to try before I am quite ready to roll out the surrender flag. But I have a bag and lots of quarters.

[FxrAndy]

Freddy, glass pearl bead blasting, driect the glass ijn the letters and this will do what i thing you want and remove the etched look at the bottom of the letters, get the pearls as fine as possible, then do what Nanuq said!

[Pugwash]

Here is the (just found) click spring about to be reinstalled in 1 of the pillaged 2846s

So, now that all 3 missing parts have been found & returned to their original homes, my record for lost parts returns to an incredible 0.

That is the piece I am missing from my 2846. I think I'll try your spawny magic trick and see if mine turns up on my already-hoovered carpet.

ps. Anyone got a spare click spring for a 2846?

[Pugwash]

But I have a bag and lots of quarters.

A bag of sand does the trick too.

[freddy333]

Thanks FX, but what kind of equipment is required for 'glass pearl bead blasting' and how do you confine the blast to the inside stroke of each letter? I assume this is similar to sand blasting, which is not something most people can do in their homes and is also not very precise or able to be directed to nearly microscopic spaces. Or is this different?

[freddy333]

That is the piece I am missing from my 2846. I think I'll try your spawny magic trick and see if mine turns up on my already-hoovered carpet.

Since I had already searched every inch of my work table (without luck), I wonder if this one is yours?

Just kidding and if I had an extra spring, it would be yours. Hopefully, someone else can help as I have a feeling the springs may not be sold as individual items.

[FxrAndy]

It is normally done in a cabinet, no not at home but plenty of places can do it. It will not only hammer the area at the bottom of the stamping but also the top evenly, i use it on alloy engine cases that i want to be hard wearing and not pollished as it seals the pores in the alloy and hinders corrosion. once polished it should give an aged appearance but too even. Do as Nanuq says and it will age better. Bead blasting will take sharp edges off alloy so by directing it to an area on 316 eventually will do the same.

[freddy333]

FX - That is what I thought it was. I used to rebuild engines as well and we often use sand or glass bead blasters to hone cylinders and bores, but I do not think that would work in this case because I would not want the adjacent surface area to be beaded (only the bottom of the letter groove). But, still, an interesting idea for adding a unique patina.

[Guest avitt]

You could always use something like this desktop cabinet:

Abrasive blasting cabinet from Harbor Freight

Along with a bag of fine glass beads...

I don't think it's so important to direct the blast directly into the letter channels. Any material that is removed should be removed evenly, from high and low surface. So the ralationship of the bottom of the letters to case back surface should remain the same. You can always just repolish the surface.

[freddy333]

Avitt -- I guess in theory it would work, but it seems like overkill & I think there must be an easier/less expensive/less messy way to achieve the result I am after. But, like they say, you have to break alot of eggs to come up with a new cake.

[Guest avitt]

It is overkill, Freddy ...I was just trying to get you to buy one of those things, so I could send you a few watches for bead-blasting

For the record, I think you've already succeeded. If you are looking for something else to try, I'd suggest just a bit more of the same...

[freddy333]

For the record, I think you've already succeeded. If you are looking for something else to try, I'd suggest just a bit more of the same...

I doubt my fingers could take much more of the same

But if I do get a blaster, yours will be the 1st watches in the box.

[freddy333]

Another interesting little factoid came out of my DRSD caseback adventures.

Here is an easy way to tell if your 'Rolex Patent' DRSD caseback is gen or MBW (I have never seen a non-MBW caseback that was accurate enough to pose a problem for most RWG regulars).

On gen casebacks -- If you draw an imaginary line between the top of the last 'T' in PATENT across to the top of the 'E' in VALVE, following the curve of the caseback edge, it will dissect the spacer dot which is nearly equidistant between the 2 words.

On the MBW 'Rolex Patent' caseback -- The spacer dot lies slightly below that line and closer to the word VALVE.

Note the dotted red lines (you can ignore the other red markings -- I borrowed this photo because it shows both casebacks)

[docblackrock]

Another interesting little factoid came out of my DRSD caseback adventures.Note the dotted red lines (you can ignore the other red markings -- I borrowed this photo because it shows both casebacks)

Nice spot Rainman "definitely two microns misaligned....two microns....defintely two microns..."

Funny this mod has come into focus now, as it's bugged me like mad for a couple of years - first thing I did with my 1665 from base was remove that caseback ink and buff like crazy but as you know, effect is minimal.

Other thoughts I've had but yet to act on are a golf iron groove 'cleaner' (possibly too large gauge to start with) or actually employing a hand-engraver. The craftmanship these guys use is astounding, and giving them an already engraved caseback and asking them to 'enlarge' shouldn't feasibly present any problem. I am making enquiries...

[freddy333]

Doc -- I do not know what a golf iron groove cleaner is (I do not play golf), but I did try a Dremel Engraver (I posted a picture of the tool in one of the other recent DRSD threads). Unfortunately, in the shaky hands of a non-artist type like me, the hand engraver made a complete mess of everything. I practiced on 3 scrap cases and was unable to stay within the original engraved lines or even maintain a straight line in the existing lines. But I got the impression that the tool might be capable of producing the right result if you have experience, a very light touch and know what you are doing.

[freddy333]

Nanuq -- Now that is a gen (note the location of the spacer dot).

[freddy333]

That is the piece I am missing from my 2846. I think I'll try your spawny magic trick and see if mine turns up on my already-hoovered carpet.

ps. Anyone got a spare click spring for a 2846?

Pug -- I think you may be in luck. I found a click spring kit on ofrei that contains 1 spring that looks very similar to the 2846 click spring. You may need to cut the ends to proper length, but the shape and thickness look spot on (it is the V-shaped spring at the far right with its opening pointing north).

Click Spring Assortment 088098

$18.95

CLK088098

Click Spring Assortment of 24 pieces.

[Pugwash]

Pug -- I think you may be in luck. I found a click spring kit on ofrei that contains 1 spring that looks very similar to the 2846 click spring. You may need to cut the ends to proper length, but the shape and thickness look spot on (it's the V-shaped spring at the far right with its opening pointing north).

Looks like it, but I'd need a European dealer to stop the postage taking it to near-movement prices.

[freddy333]

Cousinsuk.com sells the 2846, so they probably have them. If not, I would bet a local watchmaker could sell (or give) you one. These types of parts often get tossed in a watchmaker's spares box. Also, that spring is used on a number of other ETAs like the 2836-2. So if you have any other spare movements, you can probably pluck one from there. That should at least get you ticking in the right direction.